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Ultimate Motorwerks Rear Wing Lift Cylinder Repair Kit

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Ultimate Motorwerks Rear Wing Lift Cylinder Repair Kit

Old 05-30-2017, 04:24 PM
  #31  
champignon
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Originally Posted by DaveCarrera4 View Post
I'll let Porsche explain it.
I understand that you have a nice kit and you are spoken well of on the various Porsche groups. I might even buy your kit one of these days. But it is pretty obvious however that there is NOT the absence of a conflict of interest here.
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Old 05-30-2017, 04:34 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post
I understand that you have a nice kit and you are spoken well of on the various Porsche groups. I might even buy your kit one of these days. But it is pretty obvious however that there is NOT the absence of a conflict of interest here.
Are you for real?

Are you calling out Dave? Calling him a huckster?
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Old 05-30-2017, 04:35 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post
I understand that you have a nice kit and you are spoken well of on the various Porsche groups. I might even buy your kit one of these days. But it is pretty obvious however that there is NOT the absence of a conflict of interest here.
I wouldn't interpret someone directly quoting the manual in support of their product as a conflict of interest.
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Old 05-30-2017, 04:46 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Hosewater2 View Post
Since I don't own a GT2, I wouldn't put a GT2 wing on my car...although I did debate putting an Si badge on my wife's Pilot when we owned it.

I'm doing Rennkit when mine goes, my kids love the spoiler coming up way too much to lose the feature.
To be honest, I didn't even realize when I bought the car that anyone would interpret that this spoiler amounted to a sort of "mis-badging" of the car with a spoiler type from another car. As I have said previously, I did not buy this spoiler, it was installed on the car when I bought it.

In the BMW world, one frequently sees cars with M-type badging that obviously was put on aftermarket by an owner, probably with fake badges bought on ebay or elsewhere. If BMW hadn't gotten into the act putting "M" badging on everything, I could see it as being offensive.
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Old 05-30-2017, 04:51 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by manimal View Post
Good for you, and to each his own. To me, the moving wing is one of the cool features of the car, and mark my words, in 10 years, cars with working hydraulic spoilers will be a premium.
I agree it is a cool feature. I do not buy cars with the intention of holding them as an investment, so any premium placed on the car having a functioning hydraulic spoiler system would not be of much interest to me on this car which already has 76,000+ miles on it.

Originally Posted by manimal View Post

FWIW (it sounds like maybe you don't care or don't drive the car hard), but GT2 rear aero should be matched to GT2 front aero. The extra downforce on the rear can actually cause lift on the front. Do you think Porsche was just randomly putting random spoilers at random heights when they engineered the car?
Again, I regard this as silly marketing pablum lifted off of Porsche's promotional materials from when they were originally marketing these 996TT cars for sale, at least as regards drivers who will drive on public roads and who will not track their cars.
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Old 05-30-2017, 05:08 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by 911mhawk View Post
(snippage)
Not sure how much the "imbalance" with a GT2 rear and stock front end would impact driving dynamics but I believe there was a thread here a while back that got pretty granular.

With max cornering speed of 90-100 at my local track in 3 corners where rear grip is more of a concern, I'll guess that I stay on the pavement.
I may be new to Porsches, but I'm not new to internet forums, including car forums.

There are a few people who actually understand such things as have been bandied about on this thread, basically car aerodynamics and handling, upforce, downforce, et. al.

One will often get very vociferous and exclamatory statements of supposed fact on complex threads and topics on forums, such as these. Unfortunately, the percentage of those commenting, often strongly, who actually have a background in and understand these complex subjects, is vanishingly small.

People frequently mistake "post count," e.g. the number of posts that someone makes on an internet forum, for knowledge. Sometimes post count and knowledge go hand and hand, and you do get the occasional mass poster who knows his stuff and who is extremely generous with his or her time in helping out others. I have already encountered several people like that on this board. Most people like this are careful to clarify what it is that they know for a fact, and what is questionable, but which they are repeating for the sake of completeness. That sort of posting demeanor helps me in separating out who actually has a handle on what they know, and what they don't know, essential in separating out the credible, from the rest.

But, I don't respond that way to strongly stated opinions, stated as fact, no matter how strongly or in fact even offensively, these opinions might be stated.

Peace.
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Old 05-30-2017, 05:35 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post
To be honest, I didn't even realize when I bought the car that anyone would interpret that this spoiler amounted to a sort of "mis-badging" of the car with a spoiler type from another car. As I have said previously, I did not buy this spoiler, it was installed on the car when I bought it.

In the BMW world, one frequently sees cars with M-type badging that obviously was put on aftermarket by an owner, probably with fake badges bought on ebay or elsewhere. If BMW hadn't gotten into the act putting "M" badging on everything, I could see it as being offensive.
Putting an M on the back of your non-M BMW is poser pure and simple. Yes they put M components on non-M cars, but the only non-M model that got an M in it's name was the M235i right?

I don't think it's quite the same thing with rear spoilers, just wouldn't be my choice to put a GT2 wing on a 996tt, I don't think it looks good myself and serves as a reminder that these cars were once so undervalued that lots of GT2 knockoff wings were installed to save a grand or two.
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Old 05-30-2017, 05:40 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Carlo_Carrera View Post
Are you for real?

Are you calling out Dave? Calling him a huckster?
Is this just your posting style, or is this how you present yourself in real life?
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Old 05-30-2017, 05:41 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Hosewater2 View Post
I wouldn't interpret someone directly quoting the manual in support of their product as a conflict of interest.
He's selling this thing, that is a prima facie conflict of interest. If stated by someone else, it would not be.
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Old 05-30-2017, 05:43 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Hosewater2 View Post
Putting an M on the back of your non-M BMW is poser pure and simple. Yes they put M components on non-M cars, but the only non-M model that got an M in it's name was the M235i right?

I don't think it's quite the same thing with rear spoilers, just wouldn't be my choice to put a GT2 wing on a 996tt, I don't think it looks good myself and serves as a reminder that these cars were once so undervalued that lots of GT2 knockoff wings were installed to save a grand or two.
Again, I did not put it on there; one of these days, I might take it off. But it is not a priority.
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Old 05-30-2017, 05:55 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post
Anyone thinking this is really important for a car that is not tracked and driven on public roads at speeds under, say, 105 MPH, please produce some EVIDENCE. Just saying that Porsche engineers did this or that does not cut it.
I like how you flip the issue around. You make a statement -not backed up by any evidence- against the current status quo, and then call upon everybody else to come with the evidence against it.

I'm willing to bet that Porsche determined the functionality of the wing based on a lot of data, including drag, cooling, downforce etc. These things even play a role at relatively low speed. Hold your hand out of the car window into the wind, you will be amazed at the forces at play.
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Old 05-30-2017, 06:00 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post
He's selling this thing, that is a prima facie conflict of interest. If stated by someone else, it would not be.
So if someone else quoted the manual as he did then his statement would be more valid? Step away from the shovel....
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Old 05-30-2017, 06:29 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post

The Porsche Turbo is not the only fast car manufactured with a spoiler; other cars which tend to be driven hard, with spoilers, include the Subaru STi, which routinely was sold with the spoiler removed entirely per customer request, and now is sold that way, with and without spoiler.
What you are forgetting is the engine is located behind the rear axle on a 996 turbo making the rear downforce necessary. Even at low speeds with slippery conditions and wind, the downforce may be necessary.

But do whatever you want with your car.
BTW Porsche is a racing company, they put stuff on the cars mostly for performance after testing. Stick around a while and you will see Porsche is very different from BMW. BTW I like BMWs as well just not as much a Porsche
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Old 05-30-2017, 06:49 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by champignon View Post
I may be new to Porsches, but I'm not new to internet forums, including car forums.
So we should not value your opinion about Porsches since you state you are new to Porsche?

Originally Posted by champignon View Post
There are a few people who actually understand such things as have been bandied about on this thread, basically car aerodynamics and handling, upforce, downforce, et. al.
Are you implying you are one of the intelligent few?

Originally Posted by champignon View Post
One will often get very vociferous and exclamatory statements of supposed fact on complex threads and topics on forums, such as these. Unfortunately, the percentage of those commenting, often strongly, who actually have a background in and understand these complex subjects, is vanishingly small.
I would suppose as already stated the Porsche team responsible for aerodynamics and aerodynamic modeling has some of this knowledge and access to way more data than any single Porsche owner. Or do you have a wind tunnel and are running experiments? I would guess not, but we are supposed to believe you have some idea about the effects of speed on aerodynamics...something doesn't add up here. But I guess using your extensive vocabulary makes up for the lack of data?

Originally Posted by champignon View Post
People frequently mistake "post count," e.g. the number of posts that someone makes on an internet forum, for knowledge. Sometimes post count and knowledge go hand and hand, and you do get the occasional mass poster who knows his stuff and who is extremely generous with his or her time in helping out others. I have already encountered several people like that on this board. Most people like this are careful to clarify what it is that they know for a fact, and what is questionable, but which they are repeating for the sake of completeness. That sort of posting demeanor helps me in separating out who actually has a handle on what they know, and what they don't know, essential in separating out the credible, from the rest.
Can't disagree with this...and of course we are doing this for your benefit...LOL

Originally Posted by champignon View Post
But, I don't respond that way to strongly stated opinions, stated as fact, no matter how strongly or in fact even offensively, these opinions might be stated.

Peace.
Did you ever think that your comments can be construed as offensive?

Peace out.
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Old 05-30-2017, 07:01 PM
  #45  
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So this guy is saying that engineered aerodynamics in a high performance sports car is a doo-dad. I think he's just pissed he bought a car that doesn't have one and secretly wishes he did.

You should just put a c4s lid on then the gt2 lid is also another fun doo-dad.
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