rs10

I drove one recently. The owner was in the passenger seat, so I didn't want to drive too aggressively, so I pushed the throttle half way down. And nothing much seemed to happen.

So I floored it. Still nothing. I mean, the car was accelerating. I could feel it in my back. But no excitement, no eye-widening, no adrenalin. I was not getting my speed-fix. I thought maybe I did something wrong, so I slowed down, down shifted, floored it to the redline, shifted quickly, and floored it again. Nothing.

I know there was nothing wrong with the car, because this confirmed my experience on a shorter drive in another turbo a week earlier.

Then I repeated the same route in my car. Instant throttle response, engine shrieking towards the redline, nose raised, steering light, rear tires squirming, wide eyes - and adrenalin, lot's of it. I was getting my speed fix. Then I looked at the speedometer. The number was at least 15 mph lower ...

What I experienced in the Turbo is not what I want in a car. I want the highest possible ratio of speed felt to speed achieved. This was the opposite.

But, but, but …. the little boy inside keeps saying "it's a Turbo! A supercar! You might be able to keep up with your friend's GT3 on track and lose him on the street. And with a few choice mod's it'll go 200. But it! Buy it! Buy it!"

The inner little boy also used some logic. For instance, why does a regular 996 feel fast? Maybe just the sound. (The regular 996 sounds like a 911, the Turbo sounds like Hoover. Not even an evil turbo hiss, like a Mitsubishi Evo. Just a bit of vacuuming in the next room.) And sure enough, people say great things about some aftermarket exhausts.

So all this leads to a question: Can the right exhaust really make a difference? Will it make a Turbo as fun to drive on the street as a C4S???

I had a great test drive with a C4S recently, zipping about the countryside, staying just below license-loosing speed. I didn’t – couldn’t – use full throttle that much, but I was regularly treated to a great flat-six blare. Whenever I accelerated at all, I felt speed. With the Turbo, I could use even less throttle. And being exciting 1% of the time is not exciting. (And I will do max 5 track days per year, so it’s got to be fun on the street.)

So it seems to me that for an exhaust to make the Turbo exciting, it needs to (1) sound great on half throttle (even if only above ~4000 rpm), (2) sound great with full throttle at whatever speed the turbos kick in, if not lower, and (3) be relatively quiet in most other circumstances. Oh, and (4) all this has to be true inside the car. All the manufacturer’s exhaust video’s I’ve seen are outside, and I’ve experienced enough cars that sound great outside but boring inside to be skeptical. As I’ve mentioned in another thread, to be really convincing, a video should show at least three cars (from the inside): a stock turbo, a turbo with the aftermarket exhaust, and a normally aspirated 996 (3.6 liter) with a Porsche sport exhaust (like the C4S).

Anyway, any info/insight/opinions would be greatly appreciated: Can an aftermarket exhaust do “1” through “4” above? And can it make driving the car as exciting on the street – without risking losing my license from a single event – as a regular 996 (given that I’d either spend less time accelerating, or use only half throttle, or maybe stay one gear too high)???

James88

The right exhaust will and does make a huge difference to these amazing machines and yes i have driven just about every Porsche model. I have the Kline sports exhaust and it howls like a worked 993 from low in the rev range.
I have also installed semi solid engine mounts and gear box mount inserts which has totally transformed it with seat of the pants handling.
I just love it and cant seem to get enough of it.

I have just ordered Kevins UMW tune and cant wait.
So the right mods can and will transform these cars to just the way you like them.

rs10

Thanks for the helpful post!

If I may ask, from what engine speed does the Kline exhaust start to howl? And only full throttle, or also half-throttle?

Thanks again!

turbo4 me

RS,

There was something wrong with the Turbo you drove, the exhaust has nothing to do with it. When you nail the trottle, the next thing that happens is the back of your head hits the headrest. And by then you already missed shifting to second.

Drive another one-

Misplacedyankee

I felt that way about a 997 TTS I drove recently. I had one at a track and its very quick, but didn't seem any faster that the 996 TT (mine is tuned) and was far more refined. I actually find the trubo kick in the 996 TT nice to feel. When I went from stock X50 to the tuned X50 what I noticed most was the torque, but the tune seemed to make the car more smooth in delivery of the turbo. Exhaust will be my next mod for sure. A few good ones out there. I will likely to the europipe.

I guess its all relative to what you come from and your driving experiences. Back in 2000 I bought a Saab Viggen which wasn't all that fast really (for the time it was decent), but boy was its goofiness at speed and take-off made it fun. Still think fondly of that car.

sanyata

rs10, It sounds like the cars were fast as you mentioned your own car was 15 mph slower. But what you are looking for is the visceral feel of speed like the 993 has. I came from a 993 with the motor sound package and M030 suspension so I know what you mean. The TT was designed more toward the Grand Touring side of the equation not the "hot rod" sports car side. The visceral feel is very attainable but it will cost ya! What transformed my car to more than satisfying for me was the Europipe Stage 2 Load exhaust, X73 suspension, 997 GT3 SSK, and UMW tune. Holy beejeezzus the car is a total driving experience, scary fast for the street and a true sports car. But as turbo4 says, first gear is waay to short. YMMV

Last930

I don't know about the Turbo you drove, but my 996 tt is the ultimate e-ticket ride in my opinion - tractable around town and incredibly fast when you run it out. The problem with any of these very high performance cars is that you hit warp speed so fast when you redline through the gears that you can't stay in wide open throttle too long before you reach go- to- jail speeds.

sanyata

Absolutely agree as my only complaint is the fun is over very quickly. In some ways a slower car that offers all the sounds and feels of speed is more suited for the street. Now, on the track I'm sure it's another story but I don't track my car.

928drvr86.5

Yup, one of the most boring cars out there, probably not for you. I would recommend the Mitsu Evo you mentioned.

rmc1148

I've had a lot of cheaper cars that seemed faster behind the wheel mostly because the car was being pushed to its limits at a slower speed causing a lot of feed back. The 996tt is set up to handle more performance with less drama. I always called it going fast in a slow car and it can be fun but nothing compared to the rush of my turbo coming on full steam lol.

rs10

Actually, I'm pretty sure there was nothing wrong with them (as I mentioned, I drove two). And it was much faster than my car, which in that speed range is about as fast as a C4S. It just didn't feel fast.

Yes, your head and back are pushed back more physically than in any other car I've ever driven. Yet somehow, despite this, and also despite the car being lower than mine, most of the speed experience was still missing. Maybe better suspension and more rear grip contribute to this, but I suspect (and hope) the sound is the main thing.

(Maybe if I tried flooring it in 1st from zero, that would have caught my attention - but even if so, that's not something I want to do often. There are all sorts of ways to have fun with a car, including drag racing (on track or just at stop lights), circuit driving, driving fast on country roads, touring, and showing off your extremely low ride height. I sympathize with all but the last of these, but for me, fun driving fast on country roads is the thing.)

rs10

Thanks for the interesting post! I'm wondering how much of the "visceral feel" of speed came from the exhaust and how much from the rest. (Or did you make all the changes at once?)

Also, do you think the basic Europipe would do it? I fear the Stage 2 loud would be too loud for me when I'm cruising on the highway.

John D II

The 996TT requires an upgraded suspension, tune and exhaust to wake it up - once these are in place, it's a very different car...the right exhaust will transform the driving experience and add a lot of enjoyment to the car. The OEM exhaust is very boring to drive. Here is an example of how the sound can be enhanced with the right exhaust...This car has suspension, exhaust & tune among a few other upgrades and is an absolute blast to drive. Stock, it is not the same car.

rs10

Yes, this is what concerns me even if you feel speed on full throttle. For me, license losing speed on country roads is ~90 mph / 140 kph. And all else being equal, it's more fun to accelerate all the way to the braking point than to accelerate for half the straight, reach 90, and then coast and wonder whether it's worth the trouble to wait till the braking point and brake hard - which is what one may end up doing constantly with the Turbo. So I figure that to be as much fun as a normal 996, it has to sound good on half throttle and/or low revs (in other words, I would drive around a gear or two too high, always upshifting at, say, 5000, as if I had an old American V8 (saving full-throttle to the redline for highways, tracks, and very long straights where I'm going to end up coasting anyway, so I might as well accelerate hard).) If it sounds good that way, then it could be fun.

But I'd still like to know if it really would be - if there are others who drive Turbo's with good exhausts this way and find it as much fun as a normal 996 driven harder.

rs10

It does indeed sound great. And maybe the Turbo would be perfect for me with this exhaust. But much though I enjoyed watching this video - it doesn't provide much of the info I need. It was recorded outside the car, and if I buy a Turbo, I plan on being in it when it's moving. As per my original post, it would be great to see a video that is not only made in the car, but compares different cars. One reason is that the experience may be so much stronger in the car than on Youtube (unless the video is artificially enhanced), so even if the in-car video seems a bit tame, if it compares well to a normal 996, then one knows it's exciting.

Furthermore, I suspect the car in the video is almost always on full throttle. It would be good to hear it on part throttle (and to see the tachometer and/or speedometer to have some idea what the car is doing).