Tanner Foust's '01 996TT
09-18-2012, 06:35 PM
#31
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The only data I have is prices for 993s are comparably higher as are prices for 997.1s.
I also spoke with a very experienced long time used Porsche dealer who told me he will not touch a first generation non-turbo 996 because "they are terrible cars and nobody wants them". He then went on to recommend the 996TTs because their values were depressed by the non-turbo 996s and the unconventional headlights.
I also spoke with a very experienced long time used Porsche dealer who told me he will not touch a first generation non-turbo 996 because "they are terrible cars and nobody wants them". He then went on to recommend the 996TTs because their values were depressed by the non-turbo 996s and the unconventional headlights.
09-18-2012, 08:53 PM
#32
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09-18-2012, 09:14 PM
#33
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Carlo - easy the air cooled cars are now on the incline since these cars are not the common car anymore!The 997 are newer so earlky in the deprecistion curve. If you start looking at the 997. thry the 997.2 and compare to the original proce, you will see in fact that these cars are ojn the downward slope! The 996 are coming close to the bottom of the curve, and with time should start coming up! I have to disagree with your source the first generation 996 did have their issues, with the 1999 being the worst, and as time progressed they got more reliable. I know Carerra owners who have over 100k miles on their cars and have no majpr issues!
09-18-2012, 10:30 PM
#34
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Carlo - easy the air cooled cars are now on the incline since these cars are not the common car anymore!The 997 are newer so earlky in the deprecistion curve. If you start looking at the 997. thry the 997.2 and compare to the original proce, you will see in fact that these cars are ojn the downward slope! The 996 are coming close to the bottom of the curve, and with time should start coming up! I have to disagree with your source the first generation 996 did have their issues, with the 1999 being the worst, and as time progressed they got more reliable. I know Carerra owners who have over 100k miles on their cars and have no majpr issues!
I hope you are right that 996TT prices are going to rise.
Last edited by Carlo_Carrera; 09-18-2012 at 10:54 PM.
09-18-2012, 11:23 PM
#36
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The 996 engine issues are associated with the NA motors, and IMO are overblown. The 996 Metzger isn't flawless, but is every bit as reliable as the 993 if not more so.
The 993 is a beautiful car and the last of the air cooled. The 996 being the first of the water cooled will take longer to be a classic, but I think will achieve that status with a little patience.
The 993 and 996 are both significant in their own right.
The 993 is a beautiful car and the last of the air cooled. The 996 being the first of the water cooled will take longer to be a classic, but I think will achieve that status with a little patience.
The 993 and 996 are both significant in their own right.
09-19-2012, 09:49 AM
#37
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09-19-2012, 09:57 AM
#38
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I know guys that purposely passed up on pre-2009 model cars that were significantly cheaper for a more expensive post-2009 model. Just so they would have the new motor with no intermediate shaft.
I did pretty much the same thing. I looked at and could have bought a 996 C4S for 2/3 the price I paid for my 996TT but I didn't want the IMS issues.
09-19-2012, 10:57 AM
#39
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Its simple - supply and demand.
I don't know total production numbers, but US sales of 993 turbo barely topped 2,000 cars. (2,085). Total production may have been double that number.
(Production numbers aside, there's also the enhancing "last of the air cooled" status.)
Porsche sold twice as many 996 turbos (9,180).
Just look at market listings - there's probably 5 times more 996 turbos for sale than a 993T at any given time.
If a buyer has taken the time to research the engine issues of the 996 n/a, how can one presume that very same research did not reveal the major design differences with turbo engine? If anything, market analysis assumes an informed knowledgeable market participant.
I don't know total production numbers, but US sales of 993 turbo barely topped 2,000 cars. (2,085). Total production may have been double that number.
(Production numbers aside, there's also the enhancing "last of the air cooled" status.)
Porsche sold twice as many 996 turbos (9,180).
Just look at market listings - there's probably 5 times more 996 turbos for sale than a 993T at any given time.
If a buyer has taken the time to research the engine issues of the 996 n/a, how can one presume that very same research did not reveal the major design differences with turbo engine? If anything, market analysis assumes an informed knowledgeable market participant.
Last edited by JG 996T; 09-19-2012 at 06:07 PM.
09-19-2012, 12:06 PM
#40
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I agree, simple supply and demand. In New Zealand there is a definite excess of supply over demand with the 996 TT and prices are adjusting accordingly. That's not a judgment on the cars per se, I love mine.
09-19-2012, 12:23 PM
#41
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I also think that there were many 996 Turbos bought during strong market times by people who, after the economic downturn, couldn't afford them any longer. They dumped lots of 996 Turbos on the marker and got what they could for them quick to get out from under the payments.
Also a contributor (I think) is that once cheap 996 Turbos were on the market, they provided a pool of very nice cheap (cheap relatively speaking) cars for people to buy who could use the Turbo as a occasional (or more) track car; they were able to move up to an uber-Porsche for cheap, replacing a track car with the Turbo and eventually beating up the Turbo (on the track or otherwise) while not really having the money to take care of it properly (hence posts on forums about how expensive parts/maintenance are). When these people were finished with the Turbo (many times after a short period of time) the cars were again dumped on the market. I believe there have also been people buying "cheap" Turbos who have done things to their cars (modifications) that placed them in a more narrow envelope in terms of desirability for potential buyers, lowering the bar in terms of money that can be commanded.
Also a contributor (I think) is that once cheap 996 Turbos were on the market, they provided a pool of very nice cheap (cheap relatively speaking) cars for people to buy who could use the Turbo as a occasional (or more) track car; they were able to move up to an uber-Porsche for cheap, replacing a track car with the Turbo and eventually beating up the Turbo (on the track or otherwise) while not really having the money to take care of it properly (hence posts on forums about how expensive parts/maintenance are). When these people were finished with the Turbo (many times after a short period of time) the cars were again dumped on the market. I believe there have also been people buying "cheap" Turbos who have done things to their cars (modifications) that placed them in a more narrow envelope in terms of desirability for potential buyers, lowering the bar in terms of money that can be commanded.
09-19-2012, 04:20 PM
#42
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Here one example. High mileage. The seller must have bought it for pretty cheap to sell it 32K
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Porsche-911-9...item27cb15e39f
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Porsche-911-9...item27cb15e39f
09-19-2012, 05:37 PM
#43
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what he said. It is visible in the Italian market right now, lots of TT's being dropped on the market, they are way cheaper in the main than the rest of Europe.
Reason for this one, strange but true, the Italian government is looking for un taxed incomve, those with high end cars are being stopped by the police no less . Not for speeding or any motoring related crime, it is to establish the owners tax status, i.e. nice car, you must have some cash, lets check you have been paying taxes!! Go figure.
Reason for this one, strange but true, the Italian government is looking for un taxed incomve, those with high end cars are being stopped by the police no less . Not for speeding or any motoring related crime, it is to establish the owners tax status, i.e. nice car, you must have some cash, lets check you have been paying taxes!! Go figure.
I also think that there were many 996 Turbos bought during strong market times by people who, after the economic downturn, couldn't afford them any longer. They dumped lots of 996 Turbos on the marker and got what they could for them quick to get out from under the payments.
Also a contributor (I think) is that once cheap 996 Turbos were on the market, they provided a pool of very nice cheap (cheap relatively speaking) cars for people to buy who could use the Turbo as a occasional (or more) track car; they were able to move up to an uber-Porsche for cheap, replacing a track car with the Turbo and eventually beating up the Turbo (on the track or otherwise) while not really having the money to take care of it properly (hence posts on forums about how expensive parts/maintenance are). When these people were finished with the Turbo (many times after a short period of time) the cars were again dumped on the market. I believe there have also been people buying "cheap" Turbos who have done things to their cars (modifications) that placed them in a more narrow envelope in terms of desirability for potential buyers, lowering the bar in terms of money that can be commanded.
Also a contributor (I think) is that once cheap 996 Turbos were on the market, they provided a pool of very nice cheap (cheap relatively speaking) cars for people to buy who could use the Turbo as a occasional (or more) track car; they were able to move up to an uber-Porsche for cheap, replacing a track car with the Turbo and eventually beating up the Turbo (on the track or otherwise) while not really having the money to take care of it properly (hence posts on forums about how expensive parts/maintenance are). When these people were finished with the Turbo (many times after a short period of time) the cars were again dumped on the market. I believe there have also been people buying "cheap" Turbos who have done things to their cars (modifications) that placed them in a more narrow envelope in terms of desirability for potential buyers, lowering the bar in terms of money that can be commanded.
09-19-2012, 05:58 PM
#44
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Reason for this one, strange but true, the Italian government is looking for un taxed incomve, those with high end cars are being stopped by the police no less . Not for speeding or any motoring related crime, it is to establish the owners tax status, i.e. nice car, you must have some cash, lets check you have been paying taxes!! Go figure.
09-19-2012, 06:13 PM
#45
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I also think that there were many 996 Turbos bought during strong market times by people who, after the economic downturn, couldn't afford them any longer. They dumped lots of 996 Turbos on the marker and got what they could for them quick to get out from under the payments.
Also a contributor (I think) is that once cheap 996 Turbos were on the market, they provided a pool of very nice cheap (cheap relatively speaking) cars for people to buy who could use the Turbo as a occasional (or more) track car; they were able to move up to an uber-Porsche for cheap, replacing a track car with the Turbo and eventually beating up the Turbo (on the track or otherwise) while not really having the money to take care of it properly (hence posts on forums about how expensive parts/maintenance are). When these people were finished with the Turbo (many times after a short period of time) the cars were again dumped on the market. I believe there have also been people buying "cheap" Turbos who have done things to their cars (modifications) that placed them in a more narrow envelope in terms of desirability for potential buyers, lowering the bar in terms of money that can be commanded.
Also a contributor (I think) is that once cheap 996 Turbos were on the market, they provided a pool of very nice cheap (cheap relatively speaking) cars for people to buy who could use the Turbo as a occasional (or more) track car; they were able to move up to an uber-Porsche for cheap, replacing a track car with the Turbo and eventually beating up the Turbo (on the track or otherwise) while not really having the money to take care of it properly (hence posts on forums about how expensive parts/maintenance are). When these people were finished with the Turbo (many times after a short period of time) the cars were again dumped on the market. I believe there have also been people buying "cheap" Turbos who have done things to their cars (modifications) that placed them in a more narrow envelope in terms of desirability for potential buyers, lowering the bar in terms of money that can be commanded.
I am starting to think it is really a combination of everything written about in this thread. The oddball headlights, higher production numbers, loose association with the flawed NA 966 motors, many short term owners and the economic downturn.
