ghostofpain

991 do everything for you. There are to easy to drive. No charisma. 991.2 TT is a monster. Would i buy it....of course. Would i sell my 996 TT for it? No way.

Freddie Two Bs

In all fairness the turbo headlights still kind of have a runny egg shapeness to them, so I don't think it's completely out of character to call them that.

But call them what you want, hating the car for the headlights is the same snobbery that many poseurs have in the aircooled world over the impact bumper cars even though they're sweet little cars. Such tired bullcrap.

vogz

No really and apples considering the mileage. A 56K mile well sorted 6TT sells for around $45K. that's a significant difference. Just like a 6K mile 991S will sell in the $80K range.

911mhawk

You hit it here.
Also bought the wife a new ride with all options and other than AC seats, BT stereo and backup camera, I could leave the rest. An ability to delete unwanted options that are "standard", would be great but will never happen.
I almost bought a 2013 335i MSport but ended up getting a 2000 M5 instead because nannies are off with one button, car sounds better than most, don't see them every day, steering feeling is great, they're done depreciating, and I can work on it if I want/need to.
I drove all the new Ms at Thermal in March this year and they are insanely competent to the point where anyone could turn a good lap without fear of stacking up the car. I was surprised at how much better the new systems are. Taking an X5M into a corner two cones later than than told to, then flooring it immediately was scary for the passenger but completely controlled by the nannies, haha.

A 996 is more engaging to drive and feels faster than newer smooth power delivery. Now imagine a 996turbo that comes on boost right away vs at 4k like this article says, that what I did
Thanks Kevin/UMW

wross996tt

I agree with the 996 and the 993, but the first turbos (930's as we refer to them) had a nickname..."widow maker". I had a '78 930 and there were times I was scared in that thing. When the K27 (read lag) kicked in it almost sent the car in a spin...

Carlo_Carrera

Been there and done that, not fun.

There is fellow that I drive with regularly at DE events with a heavily modified high HP 930. He is fast as blazes in that thing. I cannot figure out how he keeps it on the track, but somehow he does.

imlumpy

Exactly ,Thank You !!!!!!!!!

pfbz

Exactly. And my point is that 930 owners probably felt the 996 Turbo driving experience was completely neutered when it first came out... There is a really fine line between a car that has sophisticated driver aids and is still a blast to drive vs. one that over-nannies everything and is a complete buzzkill., and here is where I think Porsche excels over every other high performance manufacturer. Aids that make the car safer all while making a weekend-warrior skill level driver feel like an F1 master.

I recall seeing quite a few supercar reviews on shows like topgear (AMG Merc's come to mind) where with the nannie's ON, they were terribly intrusive, chopping power at all the wrong times, just killing the fun. And with then OFF, the car was a freaking nightmare to keep pointed in the right direction with your boot in it and went into 'kill the driver' mode.... That's one of the things i think Porsche does really well, and my limited seat time in some of the later generation 911's (991.2S in particular) is that the new electronic aids do NOT kill the driving enjoyment! Different, sure.

It is exactly a fair comparison for someone with $60K or so i their budget and might consider both cars. I'm not saying the price at equal miles is the same, but both cars have huge appeal and can be bought for nearly the same price.

I've bought three different Porsches at about 55K miles (including my current 996 Turbo), all looked and drove like they rolled off the showroom floor. That mileage is totally acceptable to me, I have zero issue with that range of miles when the cars are well maintained and cosmetically excellent.

oceancarrera

^^^ Test magazines and the like are driven solely by the newest flavor of car/truck that year because the car makers are paying up on adds. They are NOT paying up on old models.
To me life is simple. The fastest/coolest car for the money...period. Domestic cars don't do it for me at this time. The 996TT is the best value/potential cheap HP/handling/looks for the buck.

z06801

One of the most fun cars I've ever got to drive on track was a highly modded 930 with 600rwhp, set up right and really easy to drive.

BauerR

I prefer my video

Dock

It depends on what you mean by "driving enjoyment". If one's driving enjoyment is just going fast in a straight line or fast around corners in a point-and-shoot car, then all the electronic supporting cast that allows this to happen will be applauded. In this case the driving enjoyment is not generally about the driver's skills, but rather about the electronic's "skills". If on the other hand, one's driving enjoyment comes from the application of the skills required to master a machine that is minimally equipped with the "save me electronics" across the dynamic spectrum of driving, being in control and being smooth in all aspects (even when driving slow), then the driving enjoyment is driver centered. The driving enjoyment is from the "art form" aspect; the challenge of mastering the machine.

I remember several early (2001-2001) auto magazine reviews of the 996 Turbo where the consensus was that the car was too soft, and was simply "an appliance for speed". It was viewed as muted, isolated, and without a proper soul (all as compared to earlier 911 Turbo's).

"02996ttx50

there's a world of difference imo, btw a stock 996 turbo and one that has been modded "a bit" to dial out some of its more "genteel and soft" characteristics..which, if anyone remembers their 996 turbo as "stock"? will remember.. my point is it's a lot "easier" to dial out the settings and oem specs of the build of the 996t car - that harken back to the more visceral experience of what "porsche turbo's" have been traditionally "about" - than it is to make a 991 anything "as "raw". not as easy to do, with the later iterations. eg 991. i think that, in many ways the 996/997 turbo's are the "sweet spot" btw the manic drivability of the 930 widowmakers, and the newer "anyone can drive 'em" 991's.

pfbz

I think It's a bit more complicated than that...

ABS brakes? Now, but not always, accepted as a standard 'save me' feature. Would you prefer your 996 Turbo without? Perhaps with adjustable brake bias so you can better control lockup without electronic aids and really master that skill?

Does a TPC DSC module on a PASM car that can provide calibrated shock dampening on an active basis detract or add to the art of 'mastering the machine'? It's not like an 'analog' driver could just reach out and crank the **** on top of his koni's going into a corner... it simply increases the capability of the machine.

Is a mechanical limited slip cheating because it helps you manage traction and braking? If so, than is achieving a similar or more advanced traction management effect that is achieved with computers, yaw sensors, and individual brake caliper control 'cheating' and ruining the challenge of skill mastery?

I actually agree with your overall philosophy, and I am all about the mastery and the enjoyment, but my point is that some technologies simply allows the car to perform at a level beyond what even an expert driver could obtain without them.

"02996ttx50

true enough. try "outshifting" a pdk.