JC in NY

More evidence that we USA buyers are not ready for the Porsche Rennsport versions. Porsche left us out of the RS versions for decades, only attempting to sell us the anemic RS America which languished on dealer lots. We cried and cried "bring us the sport versions, we know better".

Now, they try again (GT3) and once again we don't want them. This is it folks, the last chance. After this it will be pure bloated luxury models coming here. If you want a Rennsport in the future you'll need to import one.

Porsche will be saying "Fool us once..."

Greg Fishman

Watt,
That Ruf sounds like a great ride.
I agree with EJ. If you ever get a chance to ride with a pro driver in a high hp car that has good handling you will be amazed at what they can do with it. I think part of EJ's point is that your chances of becoming a better than average track driver in a high hp car is lower than if you started in a "momentum car".

E. J. - 993 Alumni

Hey watt my old friend. You are the exception to the rule.

Seriously, I think the 996RGT would be a very cool car. We have a fast driver member in our region who got one. He went from a 993 Cup to it. I saw it run at VIR and it was fast. But according to him, it was a fast street car. He sold it and got a 996 cup car. So if you can take some out of the 'street' out of her, you may have a great open road car. I believe he was talking about plushiness in the inside, not suspension and running gear and stuff. Will the rules allow you to remove inside creature comforts? I hate to hear of mandatory AC costing almost 40 pounds, but if you have to keep it.

Out of curiousity, what is wrong with the GT2 on the ope road racing? I would imagine too much extended boost would really heat up the motor. But I don't know crap about water pumpers with turbos.

E. J.

PS - Greg got my point right on. Any idiot can drive fast in a straight line. It takes a really talented driver to do it in the corners. And learning to do it in the corners with an incredibly unforgiving high HP car is not the way to do it. But there are plenty of people who don't give a crap about the corners and wish the world was one big straight away. Thats fine for them, but I would jump off a bridge if it were the case. And there are lots of High HP, knock the wind out of you cars that can go at least as well in a straight line as the GT2 for a ton less money. Man, if I wanted to go straight, I would build a 1000 hp Viper for less than a GT2 and put the savings into the rear tire fund.

Sun Ra

greg,

you guys are right.. that track learning w/o the extra power is good. we're tracking a few days this fall.

i'm just enjoying the thread.... and kidding around.

btw, got the suspension sorted out. and thanks for your help. and how are boxsters on the track???

mooty

GT3 is fast and HAS torque down low. but watts is right, next to GT2, GT3 doesn't have much low end. both are great cars IMHO.

greg's comment on learning on momentum car is right on. i tracked various 996's in the past. but my biggest improvment came when i switched to a semi spec miata. now i can't cheat. if i don't over take you on corners, i am toast ;o)

Sun Ra

EJ,

i thought you were straight!!! don't get mmm308 questioning your predilections!!!!


seriously on ORR,

both Alois and CFR maintain that the high speed instability i have encountered is inherent in the gt2, part of course being no 4wd but most being design. and of course part of the "instability" is my evolving skills. and crosswinds/ruts/crowns/bumps..... they prescribe RTurbo.

high HP is a prerequisite to sustain those average speeds. ie, when you have corners at 125 and you're trying to average 150, the grunt is vital!!! but your point obtains ORR as well. Knowing the road and driving skill pays: while we keep cornering g's below 1/2 g... e.g., if you have the skill to raise that 125 corner speed to 135... less power in needed... but it is definitely a power [and safety, skill and handling] game at the higher speeds that CFR runs.

i'm thinking about the next evolution and the RGT is a fun track/daily idea, and RTurbo is a massively expensive way to optimise ORR and both would be fun in the canyon hillclimbs...

all the best

E. J. - 993 Alumni

Hey watt, my ps was not meant towards you at all. Seriously.

I am surprised that a big splitter on the front of the GT2 wouldnt help cure some of the high speed wandering. Man, sometimes I wish I could be in the right seat for one of your runs. It must be crazy white knuckle exciting.

So if the RGT is a fun car and the other Ruf is too expensive, what are you going to do for ORR?

E. J.

PS - I think you should take some creative license from the writers of the great book and change your sig to:

____________
"I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great turbo power; and the earth was lightened with his glory" REVELATION 18:1

Johninrsf

I think my attempt at humility, talking about using power on the straights to offset my inabilities in the turns, was probably too subtle for the few who took me literally.
I had the pleasure of being instructed in my Cobra by living legend, John Morton, multi-year SCCA, IMSA and Can-Am Champ.
As we got into the car the first time, John said, "if you can learn to drive this car fast, you can drive any car fast".
Since that time I accumulated track time in a number different vehicles including a pretty stock Celica GT. Frankly, learning to drive the Cobra fast, with no power steering, a very short wheel base and lots of oversteer made me a much better driver in every other car I have driven.

graham_mitchell

And the GT3 you are driving in the states is not even an RS. There is a GT3 RS but I doubt it will make the states. (See GT magazine Sept 2003 issue)

ADOGNY

This GT3 vs Turbo saga will never end. Turbo owners will choose theirs, GT3 stand behind the NA car. I switched from a Stage1 993TT to GT3 - I miss the turbo power, but the GT3 does everything else much better.

In my case and level of experience, I would be SLOWER in a GT2 because it is too much for me. You might want to think about that before spending 180K on that car.

Sun Ra

ej,

i know your ps wasn;t for me, just having fun and making fun of myself!!! you should come out to nevada next year. CFR and I can help arrange.... it'll probably be RTurbo...

and i have GT2 after my sig, so to me it's obvious that the scripture is describing one!!!

e-man on flat-6.net has "...and behold a great silver dragon..." also from Book of Revelation followed by a pic of a silver gt2... so now you know, the Lord foresaw the coming of the GT2!!!!!

and my rennlist sig: GT2, on the right hand of Dog...

it goes on and on..., shall i say, dare i say... ad nauseum!!!

GrantG

When your son drove the GT3 near Boulder, do you mean Boulder, CO? If so, remember that you've lost over 20% of the GT3's power at Boulder's 6,000ft elevation. Especially relevant if you're comparing to cars you've driven in Cali. Might be the reaon for the "no low end" comment...

Johninrsf

Grant,
Yes to Boulder, CO
Excellent point!
Sometimes you can't see the forest for the trees!
Thanks, I'm sure this was a factor!!

Greg Fishman

Watt, Glad to hear you got it sorted. What did you end up settings wise.

The Boxster is a fun car IMO and it brakes and turns very well. I have a friend that does a quite a few track days with his and it holds its own against bigger hp cars. He runs a stock suspension (really would be better with some coilovers and more aggresive spring rate) and BFG KD tires. He has had to learn to carry speed through the corner because with his lack of hp he can not correct a bad turn with his right foot.

Sun Ra

thanks greg,

i was wondering about throwing a gt3 engine in a boxster....

i dropped my bars from 4/4 to 2/3 f/r, and went to mild toeout at edge of factory settings and factory range all else... works fine. will paly with track settings next week.