NJ-GT

There is more than just weight saving by not having a sunroof.

Have you seen a car with a sunroof on a rollover accident? The metal roof cover moves, your head and hands will be rubbing pavement at speed, the sunroof itself becomes a razor.

A friend of mine cut his finger on a rollover accident in a BMW with a metal sunroof. I know from someone else that cut his forehead with the sunroof edge on a rollover accident.

There is the chassis rigidity factor as well. A stiff body improves handling, it's stronger and safer. Porsche claims a 40% stiffer body on the 997 C2 compared to the 996 C2. The new 997 C4 body is just 10% stiffer than the 996 C4 body, the 996 C4 body is the one used on the 996 GT3. I know the 997 GT3 RS will be based on the new 997 C4 body, but no idea about the body used for the 997 GT3. That 10% improvement in rigidity over the 996 GT3 will be gone the moment a sunroof is installed.

A car without sunroof is safer in an accident, by resisting deformation better than a car with sunroof.

It's interesting to watch the difference in body bending between Porsches with and without sunroof involved in accidents. There are plenty of pictures in the wreckedexotics website:

NOBLEGT3

well...how about the porsche LMP2 RS spyder?? is that car unsafe and not stiff??

NJ-GT

Porsche RS Spyder, Formula 1 cars, Champ cars, etc. These are race cars, optimized for their racing series, with a strong focus on safety.

My reference is to track day cars. These are street cars with an inherent ability for track days. Cars such as the F430, F360, GT2/GT3, Exige, Cayman S, MCoupe, Z06, etc.

NOBLEGT3

my point is they are all built to perfrom within their given realms. and if porsche puts 415 HP in a very fast GT track car i think the engineers have factored in what the sunroof would do and compensate accordingly.
The sky is falling panic on here is hilarious. i would prefer no sunroof but if the car is as fast and tight as it can be who gives a ****. Have you seen how the ford Gt's doors open or the enzo's? it leaves nothing but a strip up the middle of the roof not a full roof
Lotus elise has a removeable panel, F430 spyder is within tenths around a track of the coupe (see top gear test). ZO6 has a glue on panel over a frame that has hole like a sunroof in it....i think the doom talk around here is overdone. I guess this is a picture of a slow, dangerous,saggy non track car????

NOBLEGT3

DANGER DANGER...YOURE GOING TO DIE IN THERE...THE ROOF ISNT THERE!!

NOBLEGT3

HORROR....HORROR.....PEOPLE ARE SCRAPING THEIR HEADS AND HANDS....HORROR

NOBLEGT3

OK THIS ONE I WILL GIVE YOU. THIS IS A VERY UNSAFE SUNROOF ON A TRACK CAR.

GT2RS

You can't compare a unibodied or framed car to a monocoque carbon/kevlar composite tub like CGT, Enzo, or F50. These cars can have open tops without much negative impact because the rigidity of the "chassis" is facilitated by the inherently high rigidity of the carbon composite structure. However, if Porsche make a new GT1 with a fixed roof CGT chassis, I can guarantee you it will be stiffer and stronger than the CGT for obvious reasons.

Besides, have you guys ever seen most Ferraris in accidents? I'd hardly call them the icon of safety.

RonCT

I'm a little shocked at the rude responses to this post. A member raises a legitimate thought, shares it with the group, and is berated.

When I ordered my E46M3, I absolutely did not want a hole in the roof for many reasons, including helmet clearance, less weight at the top of the car, less noise, less chance of failure of parts and pieces / seals, roll-over protection, etc. Granted, we should all have full cages, but as the original poster suggested, this is not a race car we are talking about, but rather a "track day" car meaning a street car that is optimized for enjoying DEs, etc.

The resident heckler on this post points to other cars that have no roof, but consider that those cars were designed that way from the ground up.

I'm no engineer, but my gut suggests that I'd rather have a solid skinned roof over my head than one that started that way and then had a hold cut into it and a moving roof added.

enthusiast

I made a lot of points about the darn sunroof feature but I do not agree with this safety concern. Besides, what about Porsche Club of America driver education events where you are required to keep the driver's side door glass all the way down (for emergency extraction) while on track. With regular belts and no arm tethers... what keeps the arm inside in a major roll?

Rude comments. I assume it is the nature of humans to put less thought (how am I coming across) into their communications when they are not face to face.

With regards to NOBLEGT3 and some others on here that I have never met, I learned to look for their good remarks based on what appears to be their real experiences.

DrJupeman

Is the 10% stiffer comparing sunroof to sunroof, non-sunroof to sunroof, non-sunroof to non-sunroof? The details you provide aren't clear thus it isn't clear that installing a sunfroof on a 997 will lose the 10% gain. I assume the 10% number is at least a sunroof equipped 997 since that appears to be all they are making for street cars.

NOBLEGT3

i guess the GT3 wasnt designed from the ground up to have a sunroof? and you know this because you are a porsche engineer???
if they put a piece of tin over the hole on the outside and alcantara over the hole on the inside of the car would it make you happier not seeing a hole?? how much of your car has holes in it only covered by superficial bodywork not structural stuff.

NOBLEGT3

excellent point

NOBLEGT3

rude crude and fully stocked with lube.....good points from you as well. worrying about the sunroof is just plain fruity

NOBLEGT3

why not?? regardless of how they are built they are all designed for a certain level of stiffness when completed. sorta like my sex life