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Fuming in my own juices: Coolant Pipes

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Old 01-13-2018, 01:18 PM
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Martin S.
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Default NO LONGER Fuming in my own juices: Coolant Pipes

NO LONGER Fuming in my own juices:

I need to vent...I am at the post where I'd like to take my car to the track for a Time Trial or two (Maybe 6 a year?). I have seen the video where the guy dumps coolant at the Nurburgring and causes a huge pile up, and flash forward, I'd hate to put coolant down on the track, or the highway/street for that matter. So I see several options:
1. Don't track the car (Not a viable option),
2. Track the car with the coolant removed and water with a water wetter used as a replacement, but it can get below 32 degrees F where I live...the car is stored inside, I suppose I could fire up (No pun intended) a space heater),
3. Pull the motor and have the coolant pipes welded up.

(My mechanic says not to bother, just drive....tough for me to buy that.)

Option 3 is clearly the best all around option, but we are talking $3,000 to $4,000 to get the job done. And then my dark side says, you are spending $$$ getting ready for a Time Trial:
A. XPEL covering, $1,500
B. Replacement rotors for the front (Putting the PCCBs on the shelf), GIROs for $1,200 and stock for about $300, and some $500 in labor,
C. Rennline radiator protection screens, about $300,
D. Roll bar and installation, about $2,000
E. Race seat, Profi XL, about $1,500
F. Steering wheel upgrade to Tech Art with air bag, $500,
G. Extra set of wheels, $1,500 to $4,000, I have a set of used stock GT3 wheels lines up for $1,500 thanks to a buddy off mine.
H. Set of race tires (Going to do a lot on Nitto NT-01, 245 and 305), about $1,000 a set

So far that's close to $10,500....now add the $4,000 to that...$14,500. Damn, I have thought for not too much more I could have bought a used Spec Boxster! I just try not to think about it....a Spec Boxster compared to a GT3? I don't think so.

Plus, one (1) blown motor, one trip to a guard rail slipping around my own coolant, not to mention death or injury in the process? What's that worth? I just needed to vent. I need to remind myself what a blast this car will be on the track, 380 HP, incredible brakes, stiff chassis...all the goodies that come with a 6GT3. There, there now, I feel better. Just spend the money....I can't take it with me, can I?

Dropping the engine, a master welder is doing the coolant pipes...feel better already.

Last edited by Martin S.; 02-01-2018 at 11:40 PM.
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Old 01-13-2018, 02:13 PM
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Marv
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Some here have had their pipes pinned and I don't think it is necessary to pull the motor.

You might consider that as another option.

Incidentally, my car has 127K miles on it, almost exclusively street miles and the coolant pipe on the top of my motor pulled out. I had that welded, but the motor stayed in the car. When I have the clutch done I'll have them pull my motor and weld the rest, but I realize I'm driving on a ticking time bomb.

My point is that even street cars can blow a fitting, but the odds are lower for it to happen or cause a significant accident on public roads.
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Old 01-13-2018, 04:14 PM
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tgavem
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Don’t forget to upgrade your LSD as well. Really helps to stabilize the car under breaking and acceleration
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Old 01-13-2018, 05:02 PM
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32krazy!
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pin the pipes with the motor in the car.
screw the xpel its just a car and your going to abuse it. repaint if needed at the end of the yr.
run oem steel rotors not the high dollar stuff you will burn them up in a yr anyway.
rad screens from mesh at home depot 25$
no need to upgrade the steering wheel for racing.

just saved you about 3k$. unless your doing full on hard core racing just keep it safe and simple
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Old 01-13-2018, 06:48 PM
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AudiOn19s
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The days of speculation on if there's going to be a coolant hose failure are long gone. They are going to fail and they are going to risk your safety and the safety of others if they fail on the track. It's a mandatory ownership responsibility in my mind to fix them if you are going to track the car.

You can track and learn the car on street tires, stock seats, no roll bar and stock steering wheel if you need to prioritize the order of mods. While this may sacrifice your own personal safety standards it doesn't sacrifice the safety standards of those you share the track with that have no choice in the matter.

That said...do it all and get it out of the way so that the only thing you need to worry about later is tires / brakes and fluids for many many happy miles of tracking.
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Old 01-13-2018, 07:47 PM
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Matt Lane
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Yup - you're into a GREAT car, make it safe for yourself and all the poor suckers behind you. Have a friend that whacked his car (also a GT3) on spilled coolant from the car in front. A real shame, and unnecessary. This is a movie we've seen before.

Yup, water wetter wont work in the cold (I ran it for one season out of an abundance of caution, in addition to pinned lines).

Bought my GT3 10K miles and mint - dropped the engine immediately and took care of the basics:

Pinned the lines
Guard LSD plates
LWFW and new clutch while you're in there - why delay the inevitable?
Locking toe links, lower and align.
Good track pads on inexpensive steel (Cayenne 350mm) rotors.

It's been 3 years and mission accomplished. I know the car, have a path to upgrades that I can understand and appreciate, and no one got hurt in the process.

Final point, your shop rates may vary, so shop around and do everything that needs access at the same time. Clutch, LWFW, LSD, RMS, pinning lines and replacing any suspect hoses.

Cheers

Matt
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:26 PM
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Rootwitch
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I just bought a 996 GT3, hasn't even been shipped here yet.
It's going straight to a shop to have the engine pulled and coolant lines welded!
And who knows what else.
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:53 PM
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I would say you don't need all the items on your list.

A. Skip
B. Don't need to spend 1,200. Many good options for less than 1/2 that price
C. Skip for now or $25 option
D. Yes, safety
E. Yes. Make sure you have Hans on your list
F. Don't need this

Getting coolant potential issue fixed - Yes.
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:11 PM
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996FLT6
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I am glad I didn't add up the cost of so and so stuff. Anyway get the coolant pipes done. Those aftermarket safety stuff ie rollbar etc may need replacement when your coolant pipes burst i.e. nailing a wall. Mike
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Old 01-14-2018, 02:43 AM
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mooty
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1. martin if your spending is < $20k, you have forgotten something. trust me, i had 12 996gt3 with combined < 150k miles.
2. i dont care who tell you, PIN OR WELD the pipe, they will come off and you will crash (even if you use water wetter or just water) how do i know? i speak from experience.
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Old 01-14-2018, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mooty View Post
1. martin if your spending is < $20k, you have forgotten something. trust me, i had 12 996gt3 with combined < 150k miles.
2. i dont care who tell you, PIN OR WELD the pipe, they will come off and you will crash (even if you use water wetter or just water) how do i know? i speak from experience.
This.... If you DO NOT pin or weld your coolant pipes and your car takes a dump on the track, you will loose a lot of friends. If it happens off the track, you get to wait for AAA flatbed. I don't track my GT3 and had pipes pinned AND while the engine was out, had a Guard differential installed. Money well spent! You'll thank Mooty later.
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Old 01-14-2018, 08:32 PM
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That mileage means transmission also. These cars are special but still need "service"/ They still are Porsche. Keep a $$ reserve. And remember their age.
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Old 01-14-2018, 08:39 PM
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Martin S.
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Default Quit bitching Martin

I need to reflect on my good luck finding a 6GT3 in Carrera White.

A. XPEL covering, $1,500. (Done)
B. Replacement rotors for the front (Putting the PCCBs on the shelf), GIROs for $1,200 and stock rear for about $300, and some $500 in labor, (Got the GIRO front rotors knowing that the 350mm GT3 Cup Car rotors were $700 cheaper a set...had to try out 2 piece rotors)
C. Rennline radiator protection screens, about $300, (I got these but could have done it for a lot cheaper)
D. Roll bar and installation, about $2,000 (have the bar...will get it installed soon)
E. Race seat, Profi XL, about $1,700 with side mounts, sliders....(my buddy and I will be putting it in)
F. Possible steering wheel upgrade to Tech Art with air bag, $500, (I have the wheel from a pal, it's actually a little small at 320mm, may stick with the stock wheel)

G. Extra set of wheels, $1,500 to $4,000, I have a set of used stock GT3 wheels lines up thanks to a a fellow Rennlister. If that doesn't work, I have a set of 3 piece BBS wheels lined up.

H. Set of race tires Hoosier 245 and 295.

I. Having the cooling pipes welded incorporating the BBI kit, the curves metal pipes to be pinned.

Believe it or not, the GT3 purchase was nearly an impulse buy. I was lusting for 100HP more than my 993, same weight and monster brakes, my dream has come true. Thanks to all for their great advice.

Last edited by Martin S.; 01-30-2018 at 03:17 AM.
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Old 01-16-2018, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Martin S. View Post
I need to vent...I am at the post where I'd like to take my car to the track for a Time Trial or two (Maybe 6 a year?). I have seen the video where the guy dumps coolant at the Nurburgring and causes a huge pile up, and flash forward, I'd hate to put coolant down on the track, or the highway/street for that matter. So I see several options:
1. Don't track the car (Not a viable option),
2. Track the car with the coolant removed and water with a water wetter used as a replacement, but it can get below 32 degrees F where I live...the car is stored inside, I suppose I could fire up (No pun intended) a space heater),
3. Pull the motor and have the coolant pipes welded up.

(My mechanic says not to bother, just drive....tough for me to buy that.)

Option 3 is clearly the best all around option, but we are talking $3,000 to $4,000 to get the job done. And then my dark side says, you are spending $$$ getting ready for a Time Trial:
I agree, failed pipes are not a certainty, but PM ( prophylactic maintenance) is a good idea.
I can save you $3000. I'll just talk you through this process........................... pretty easy except for the Power steering reservoir / AC compressor / Alternator removal dance was a PITA.


Engine and Tranny ready for access

I think your plans for safety equipment / tyres / expel is wise.

LSD rebuild parts are $1040 as of last year (retail cost).
If your shop pulls the engine for welding, do LSD refresh now, labor costs will be 1/5 what they will be if engine / tranny still in.
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Old 01-16-2018, 08:55 PM
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With motor dropped I change out any rubber hoses as a preventive. 2 out of many inlet manifold hoses were borderline cracked i.e. Air leaks down the road i.e. a bad track weekend. Mike
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