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BTW, just want to further comment on intake lifters.
I believe due to cost, most rebuilders reuse them as they are not known to cause problems (unless the engine was not well maintained and has used dirty oil). In fact, I'm reusing mine in my rebuild also. Hard to justify spending $1,680 for them if they run fine. Another parts are the lifter cradle, which are also wear items (mated with the lifters) but seldom replaced also due to cost ($800 for both).
When a mechanical component is reused, there's always risk and that's why Jake always says he only reuses 6 components...to minimize any tail end failure. When deciding what to replace, it's always a trade-off between cost and long term reliability.
If the oil from the original engine had metal flakes in it to IMSB failure, those flakes could be all over the engine.
I haven't fully figured out how the intake valve lifters work. Could metal flakes get inside and cause it to intermittently jam?
If the oil from the original engine had metal flakes in it to IMSB failure, those flakes could be all over the engine.
I haven't fully figured out how the intake valve lifters work. Could metal flakes get inside and cause it to intermittently jam?
Usually the filter will catch all of the smaller debris...unless the oil filter bypass valve opened at some point. That would be very very bad as the debris laden oil will go everywhere, to all the crank and cam bearing journals as well making the engine not salvageable.
When the engine is rebuilt, the case, the heads and everything else should be thoroughly cleaned so it's unlikely.
BTW, are you still seeing intermittent misfires on cyl#1 and are the symptoms same as before?
Hi Martin, thanks for you words and I'm flattered. I'm just another enthusiast on this forum and I just happen to like helping people out with car problems...
Regarding your photo, I saw new exhaust lifters. There seems to be cam lobe wear marks on the intake lifters though. Are you saying those are new also?
A brand new one from ECS tuning for comparison here. Sorry if I missed anything.
Thank you for your response Ahsai, you have proved again that you're smart and perceptive. As you said earlier, we can see in this picture that intake valve lifters are used. You also said some rebuilders reuse them to save money. I would understand that if the rebuild would cost $10,000...
In Kirt's case those intake valves were replaced with new ones because original intake valves had scoring due to IMS failure. I will not let anyone call me a thief or budget Martin, or say (quote: "Well now isn't this getting interesting. It appears as MB is re-using some parts in his builds. I guess at that price point one would do that." -Sneaky Pete)
Re Sneaky Pete's post#198 "I'm seeing the same."
Sneaky Pete, I have to praise you for being perceptive! Please answer this question: Who do you call a guy who charges 20k plus for engine rebuild? Thief or worse? It just so happens that this picture is from Flat Six Facebook and it's Jason's 4.0l track performer under construction!
Pete, I also have a picture of your "apples and oranges 4.0l". I wonder if you still believe Jake throws out everything and reuses only 6 elements? Take a good look at another screen shot below which shows your valve lifters. Same thing! You only have new exhaust valves because they were cheaper, intake valves are reused to save $1800 on 20k+ rebuild. Not to mention your dirty cases.
BTW, are you still seeing intermittent misfires on cyl#1 and are the symptoms same as before?
Back on post 152, I posted Duramatric output of misfires and rough running with a cold engine for 50 seconds and warmed up engine for 100 seconds.
When cold, the reading said it was rough and there were a few misfires on cylinders 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. When warmed up, the reading was no longer rough and there were zero misfires. But I could feel the car vibrating.
You sneaky devil I bet you thought you just dropped a bomb.....Yep that is correct the intake lifters were not replaced per my FSI quote. It is fully documented in our signed agreement so there is no smoking gun there.
Did you document to your customer what was being replaced and what was not?
You sneaky devil I bet you thought you just dropped a bomb.....Yep that is correct the intake lifters were not replaced per my FSI quote. It is fully documented in our signed agreement so there is no smoking gun there.
Did you document to your customer what was being replaced and what was not?
Documented or not bottom line is these lifters were reused. It's easy to accuse someone else of reusing parts and laugh at them or call them budget rebuilds while Jake does it himself! Now everyone can see for themselves.
"Sneaky devil" will be my next company name in your honor, lol. BTW Pete, don't you think your cases should look more like the ones below instead? All that money you paid for your engine rebuild...Probably still paying off your credit cards? My crew in Poland spends hours and hours on cleaning those cases after they are done. Once they are cleaned, next step is resleeving. They take the time on each rebuild to make sure everything is perfectly clean and up to our standards. If FSI would want to do the same work here in US each engine rebuild would easily cost $50k.
Once again MB has to go out of his way to drag me into this. Let's make this clear, Martin:
I am not the one here that's in question. My company isn't the one thats not standing behind the work. Your's is, and you damn sure better not make your problems into my problems. Don't even try that. Don't try to create diversionary comparisons about things you have no idea about, like you do every single time anyone brings anything up.
It is clear that I am your hero; your superstar, and that you want to be like me when you grow up.. We get that. Thats why you chase me around like a puppy, looking at every pic we post, trying to learn something new. BUT I have figured out Martin's motive and plan here... When he gets under the magnifying glass, he brings me up and forces me to reply, which then lightens the load on Martin.. He knows I am going to reply, to clarify things about my program, just like I am doing in this post.
So, what IF those lifter bodies that you referenced from my photo albums were disassembled and re- valved? What if the bodies were cryogenically enhanced? What if a jig was used to break new cam bodies in with their respective camshafts before the engine was built, just to ensure we'd not have problems after delivery, like you have? What if the internal springs were altered, and what if... What if?? Thats right, you don't know... You won't ever know. Everything I mentioned above is a possibility with what we build, but sometimes we simply reuse lifters, too. Like Pete said, my 14 page proposal (with zero fine print) with him even stated in bold font that this would occur.
Moreover, no matter what I have done, how, or when, you won't find a single one of my purchasers with a complaint of a bad lifter, so whatever the hell I have been doing has worked better than what you have done.
You are throwing darts in a dark room, trying to justify your failure to meet the customer's expectations, and then not standing behind the warranty that you always rave about.
Nope, again, this isn't about me, and it isn't about what we charge for anything. I am NOT the one here with a dis- pleased customer that has a warranty claim that is not being honored. No part of this thread has been about my customer, and time and time again Martin has referenced, and used us as a resource.
DrMems, if you need help, I'll help you. I'll be in your area next month instructing a class, and I might need your car for a prop.
Everyone else:
Lots of lessons to be learned here for purchasers, and vendors alike. One day I'll end up here with a less than pleased customer, and you guys will see how I handle this. Its going to happen, guaranteed, and I stand by, prepared for it every single hour of every single day.
All the pics on Facebook are being removed, and placed on our server, and will be copyright 2016 Raby Enterprises Inc, and may not be shared, or reproduced without written permission from Raby Enterprises Inc. We have zero to hide from our purchasers, or anyone else, which is why we post the pics of every build that the customer allows us to share publicly. This way I can protect them with copyright, unlike Facebook sharing. Copyright, Patents, and Trademarks are what we have to spend money on to protect our intellectual property, so one reason things cost so much is because of people like Martin who force us to spend money to apply this protection.
[quote=BTW Pete, don't you think your cases should look more like the ones below instead? .[/quote]
Doesn't bother me a bit. Ever hear of the saying "you can put lipstick on a pig but it's still a pig"? It's what's inside that case that makes the difference.
6months on an X51 rebuild. It hits the ****ter 12months in??
I smell the sense of entitlement here and a sense that you never ran a small business before. Misfires to me doesn't automatically equal engine hitting the $hitter, a classic RL knee jerk reaction.
That's all I'll say on the matter as we're all outsiders looking in with what we all think our own versions of the truth really are.
Take a look online for shipping from northern California to Florida. It would cost $3000+
Having it repaired locally is cheaper and should be safer less risky.
Dunno where you're getting quotes from but shipping a whole car is anywhere from $1k-$1200 from Cali to FL.
I guess having it repaired locally hasn't really worked out and IMO introduces more risk as more variables are introduced.
I'm not trying to knock you and I hope you can get to the bottom of your engine issues. There are two stories here and $hit can happen in life but I don't think witch hunts resolves anything either. I commend you for being very civil throughout this. I can't say the same for others.
05-26-2016, 05:13 PM
