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My 3.4L Engine Rebuild
I'd like to share my first Porsche rebuild experience. So Long story short, I bought a 99 C2 coupe and now there is oil in my coolant. I made a few calls and visited a few dedicated Porsche repair shops. I chose 9XX Motors in Long Beach because I read good reviews on on this forum, its near my home, and Jason, the owner, is very knowledgeable.
Since I asked nicely, Jason, allowed me to take pics of the rebuild process. The engine of my car will not be out until Monday. So I guess I'll start with the pic of the night I found the oil in my coolant reservoir. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps80fd0b86.jpg On the way to the shop http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...pscd8221da.jpg 9XX Motors facility http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps4c419026.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps9d7cc432.jpg Customer's Boxster 3.8L hybrid http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps799b240c.jpg More pics to come..... |
Even on the trailer it looks great. Love the wheels.
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Sounds like you and your Porsche will be on the road again soon. Lots of Porsches being worked on in the photo, nice to know that the shop is familiar with the brand and its inherent foibles.
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How about a little history? Mileage, how long have you owned it, extent of rebuild / refresh you're going for?
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Very nice ride. Now I understand why you can't let it go. Good luck with the rebuild and I look forward to all the pics!
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Originally Posted by RDykmans
(Post 11456517)
How about a little history? Mileage, how long have you owned it, extent of rebuild / refresh you're going for?
Thanks everyone! I will try to document and take pics of as much of the rebuild process as possible. |
If I may ask, what kind of wheels are those? They look great!
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Originally Posted by bcrdukes
(Post 11456808)
If I may ask, what kind of wheels are those? They look great!
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Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11456754)
Owned it for exactly one week today, 129k miles, the rebuild will consist of new chains, water pump, ims, seals, gaskets, rings, AOS. I might be missing a few things but I will take pics of everything as the build comes along.
Thanks everyone! I will try to document and take pics of as much of the rebuild process as possible. Keep us informed. There's a lot of us with 996 engine rebuilding experience here.... |
Jdm538 sorry to hear about your car have these issues so soon after your purchase but rest assured your car will be up and running stronger than ever here soon. Jason at 9XX Motors knows these engines very well.
BTY that's my silver 996 in the lift next to yours :) |
Originally Posted by bcrdukes
(Post 11456808)
If I may ask, what kind of wheels are those? They look great!
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any budgetary number$?
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Great looking ride car jdm :thumbup: Good luck with the rebuild.
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Thanks everyone for the kind words.
Visited 9XX Motors today and saw my car on the lift getting prepared to drop the engine. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps8681cb63.jpg An upskirt shot http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps5d06caee.jpg Car came with an updated oil pan. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psd4c9dfce.jpg So the previous owner's mechanic decided to break the throttle cable clip and JB quick weld it back. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps122d14f5.jpg More updates to come...... |
Send that cable TB to Maxbore.com and for $100. he'll bore it out a few mm for you....
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Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11464021)
Send that cable TB to Maxbore.com and for $100. he'll bore it out a few mm for you....
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Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11464021)
Send that cable TB to Maxbore.com and for $100. he'll bore it out a few mm for you....
rich |
Originally Posted by RDykmans
(Post 11464482)
Does that offer a noticeable improvement vs a plenum? I have 200 cel cats, headers and aftermarket exhaust but that's it. I'm looking for all the cheap hp I can get out of a 99 3.4L.
rich |
Updates....
Engine has been dropped http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps4c8ed7dc.jpg What a dirty engine http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps5d601c8b.jpg some water deposit http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps0067d8ed.jpg pretty sure this is bad http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psf830786e.jpg wow ghetto rigged by previous mechanic http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps717d64d9.jpg there shouldn't be oil/water going into there http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps8253c746.jpg the oil cooler was replaced before http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psa24139cd.jpg the clutch is pretty much done http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps220b7454.jpg scored flywheel http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps16d841b7.jpg |
My camera ran out of batteries so I was only able to take a few photos.
I got some overnight parts for the car today. New flywheel http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps7cf4aaae.jpg New clutch http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...pscb51f2fd.jpg Visited the 9XX and found the engine partially torn down Some oil deposit on the intake side http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psdddc520e.jpg not the parts for my engine but I thought it was worthy of a photo. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps5c72590d.jpg stay tuned for more updates ... |
Do you have any plans for the old clutch setup?
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Do you have any plans for the old clutch setup? I hope the OP knows how much this repair is really going to cost. I repeat, who buys a roller to bring to a shop?? :( |
Originally Posted by Imo000
(Post 11480819)
Do you have any plans for the old clutch setup?
Originally Posted by KrazyK
(Post 11481831)
I hope the OP knows how much this repair is really going to cost. I repeat, who buys a roller to bring to a shop?? :(
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I did not realize the OP knew there was an engine problem when the car was purchased?
It does not reflect that in the 1st post. |
Originally Posted by ZX9RCAM
(Post 11481959)
I did not realize the OP knew there was an engine problem when the car was purchased?
It does not reflect that in the 1st post. |
I did not realize the OP knew there was an engine problem when the car was purchased? It does not reflect that in the 1st post. I would still like to see more rebuild updates posted and costs. Great info for myself and others interested in these engines. So thanks for posting the updates. :thumbsup: |
I was unaware there was another thread....
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Originally Posted by KrazyK
(Post 11482018)
Great info for myself and others interested in these engines. So thanks for posting the updates. :thumbsup:
+1 As someone who's just getting into these cars and motors, it's much appreciated. Good luck on the rebuild & keep the pictures coming. |
I did not realize the OP knew there was an engine problem when the car was purchased? It does not reflect that in the 1st post. I was unaware there was another thread.... https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...xperience.html |
:thumbsup:
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Thanks for sharing! Is part of the oiling piston ring missing? Any idea where the intermix was occurring?
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Thanks for actually taking out the balls, unlike most that just turn them and check it for play. Based on the condition of a few, looks like a rebuild was inevitable soon anyways.
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That oil ring gap is supposed to be there.
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Thanks for actually taking out the balls Anyway, yeh looks like the trans was about to self destruct which would have upped your costs even more. Curious, what kind of estimate are they giving you for the total bill? Keep the pics coming. Awesome job! On a side note, looks like another DR IMSB failure was coming. Thought these were rare but it seems theres been a few posted recently of the "low risk" engines. |
Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11481950)
no plans for the clutch/flywheel.
I guess I am the type that buys a roller to bring to a shop.:rockon: :thumbsup: |
Originally Posted by KrazyK
(Post 11483789)
Never thought I would see you type that Alpy. :thumbsup:
Anyway, yeh looks like the trans was about to self destruct which would have upped your costs even more. Curious, what kind of estimate are they giving you for the total bill? Keep the pics coming. Awesome job! On a side note, looks like another DR IMSB failure was coming. Thought these were rare but it seems theres been a few posted recently of the "low risk" engines.
Originally Posted by Imo000
(Post 11483948)
If you are willing, for the cost of a couple cases of beer and the cost of shipping, I'll take it off your hands. Let me know if you are intrrested in this and I'll PM you.
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Originally Posted by KrazyK
(Post 11483789)
Never thought I would see you type that Alpy. :thumbsup:
Now let's see that big IMS shaft big boy... :D |
My build Monday update....
Thrust washer old and new. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps03a3a620.jpg before Jason took off the right side guide rails http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psb141baba.jpg Right guide rail old vs new. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps72409c8c.jpg The left side is abnormally not as bad as the right side. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psd45b9eac.jpg The IMS bearingas a lot of play http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psad5d95df.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** The following is random photos ** Track 996 with Leather Recaros http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps1f195eef.jpg Boxster engine bay with the 3.8L build http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps2e0424a0.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps526be3cf.jpg View from interior http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psa9dbfc13.jpg |
So the chain rails were really grooved down. And the IMSB had a lot of play! What did the bearing itself look like?
2002 Turbo - Basalt Black Metallic / 2003 Carrera 4S - Speed Yellow / 1955 356 Continental 1500 - Rust Red |
Are you going to tell us what caused the intermix? It should be obvious by now....
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Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11494253)
Are you going to tell us what caused the intermix? It should be obvious by now....
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not much to update but Jason did show me that my IMS bearing was pretty much falling apart.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps2f623a83.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps5a533bf2.jpg |
Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11498440)
not much to update but Jason did show me that my IMS bearing was pretty much falling apart.
2002 Turbo - Basalt Black Metallic / 2003 Carrera 4S - Speed Yellow / 1955 356 Continental 1500 - Rust Red |
Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11498426)
There were no obvious signs of what the intermix problem could have been. The heads were sent out to be pressure tested and resurfaced. I will find out tomorrow or Thursday when the heads come back from the machine shop.
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Maybe it's the camera angle, but notice the unequal ball spacing @ 6 oclock as these are supposed to be equidistant caged balls . Also the designed ball population for this application seems sparce offering marginal support.
Bob 01 C4 31 Ford cp chp & ch, 302/350 40 Willys, 302/350, IFS 38 Ford cp, 327/350, IFS 57 Belair 62 356B --long ago |
cool update!
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Originally Posted by ZX9RCAM
(Post 11498858)
According to my time stamp, this was posted late Wednesday night according to Cali time?
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Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11499039)
That is correct. Posted Wednesday night.
Seeing as it was Wednesday night when the post was made, "Tomorrow" would have been "Thursday". |
Originally Posted by ZX9RCAM
(Post 11499210)
Sorry, my only reason to point this out is because you said you would find out "tomorrow or Thursday".
Seeing as it was Wednesday night when the post was made, "Tomorrow" would have been "Thursday". |
Originally Posted by DaveCarrera4
(Post 11493554)
So the chain rails were really grooved down.
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So...the line of thinking is that in the absence of obvious component failure that head warpage or a failed gasket could be the cause?
JRGordon, any speculation? |
Originally Posted by coffeehead
(Post 11499450)
So...the line of thinking is that in the absence of obvious component failure that head warpage or a failed gasket could be the cause?
JRGordon, any speculation? |
If the head warped then there is a very good chance the engine severy over heared.
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Update....
Jason called the machine shop and they told him no cracks BUT the head is warped. the bottom end is assembled http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps2ce041eb.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...pscaa0bd00.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps6297087d.jpg new IMS bearing in place http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps2ebc959e.jpg some of the things that will be replaced: new chains, piston rings, bolts, gaskets, bearings, seals, air oil separator, water pump, thermostat. I know I am forgetting stuff http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps43d7355c.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- random stuff... http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps6955e7ba.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psc7333903.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps44f2d54f.jpg |
Wow that sucks. Glad you're sticking with this, you're going to have a very nice and well sorted car when this is all said and done.
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oooh...pretty. A clean, well-lit, well-organized shop does so much for my confidence level...
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New Update...
My heads are back from the machine shop. Valves lapped and inspected. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps7a691ded.jpg My engine is ready to be assembled. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psde101f62.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Random stuff again.. difference between 3.4 head & 3.6 head http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps72c072f8.jpg 3.4 on the left 3.6 on the right http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps5df0fff3.jpg check it out LN on top & OEM on bottom http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps4e09d87d.jpg from oldest to latest IMS bearing styles http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps6d100f6b.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psc3eee4f9.jpg |
Thanks for the updates. Looks like you'll be running in a week or so...
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Nice pictures. How much were the heads warped and do you have any close up pictures of the pistons?
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Originally Posted by Imo000
(Post 11509716)
Nice pictures. How much were the heads warped and do you have any close up pictures of the pistons?
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What a beautiful sight...
My engine is back in one piece. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps9d1e4668.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- RANDOM STUFF AGAIN... Remember to change your oil http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps21eed0a6.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psf4fd00e0.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps0d0e48df.jpg look at that gunk http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...pscce11410.jpg |
Good news!!
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this has been a great thread, keep up your reports once you're using the car. This might end up being a good advertisement for 9XX.
That last picture of the sump . . . OMG! Luckily when I pulled mine, which was original, it looked like it was on it's first oil change! Running the oil to long in these cars is a death sentence! |
And the manual recommends 15,000 miles, lol.....
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Based on the sump pic, I'm wondering if any of the PO's used dyno oil for awhile.
Glad your engine is coming along nicely(and quickly).:) |
Originally Posted by alpine003
(Post 11516007)
Based on the sump pic, I'm wondering if any of the PO's used dyno oil for awhile.
I removed my oil pan yesterday to install a deep sump kit and baffle. Was relieved to find no sludge and no metallic fragments. Had been having nightmares about finding a quarter pound of timing chain pieces :-) |
Was that your sump or another engine at the shop?? Those pics are pretty unbelievable. I can't believe someone could let it get that far and not notice...
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Enjoy the newly rebuilt engine!
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I've seen engines with more sludge that that. It has little to do what oil was used but everything to do with NEVER changing the oil at all.....the owner just kept topping it off for years. I bet you that's the case here too.
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It has little to do what oil was used but everything to do with NEVER changing the oil at all.....the owner just kept topping it off for years. I bet you that's the case here too. Oh and BTW, that intake should always be covered, not open while the engine sits around. |
Originally Posted by Imo000
(Post 11517127)
I've seen engines with more sludge that that. It has little to do what oil was used but everything to do with NEVER changing the oil at all.....the owner just kept topping it off for years. I bet you that's the case here too.
The above pic looks like the PO took Porsche's 15k OCI but was too cheap and thought he could do those intervals with dyno oil.:rolleyes: |
Wow, as a new 04 C2 owner I read the whole thread with great interest; thanks! Ralph
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Originally Posted by alpine003
(Post 11519518)
If you think about it, it kinda does as synthetic oil lets one neglect your OCI intervals longer since it doesn't break down as fast as dyno and can provide better protection even in extended situations over dyno.
The above pic looks like the PO took Porsche's 15k OCI but was too cheap and thought he could do those intervals with dyno oil.:rolleyes: Bob 01 C4 31 Ford cp chp & ch, 302/350 40 Willys, 302/350, IFS 38 Ford cp, 327/350, IFS 57 Belair 62 356B --long ago |
Originally Posted by STAGGERWING
(Post 11519796)
As probably most know, another way to sludge & ruin an engine is not allowing the block & oil temps to get hot enough ---long enough, for the oil to do its cleansing & release of moisture----inherent in synthetic lubricants when cooled. (short trips)
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f3...e/1b679eb7.jpg |
The sump photo is nuts... When I dropped my oil pan it looked brand new after one cottons wipe the oil was gone and sump was clean!
No wonder people end up having engine problem when you see thing like these!!! |
Btw any cost range for the work at 9xx?
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Back from Vegas to see the car started and running!
Thursday.... http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps15a99dcd.jpg Monday.... http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps623378de.jpg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- More random photos. Engines arriving for rebuild http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps9783d6a2.jpg |
:thumbup::thumbup::cheers::cheers:
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Nice!!
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Originally Posted by eagle11401
(Post 11516250)
Was that your sump or another engine at the shop?? Those pics are pretty unbelievable. I can't believe someone could let it get that far and not notice...
Originally Posted by philooo
(Post 11520229)
Btw any cost range for the work at 9xx?
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Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11524108)
I was told $9,000 for rebuild and includes core for the cracked head. |
Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11524108)
I was told $9,000 for rebuild and includes core for the cracked head.
Do you have photos of the head damage you can post? That would explain the intermix.... |
Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11525037)
Wait what cracked head? You mentioned a heads was warped (post #55) but said the machine shop stated they weren't cracked.
Do you have photos of the head damage you can post? That would explain the intermix.... I want to see a video of the car running/driving. Excited! |
Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11525037)
Wait what cracked head? You mentioned a heads was warped (post #55) but said the machine shop stated they weren't cracked.
Do you have photos of the head damage you can post? That would explain the intermix....
Originally Posted by coffeehead
(Post 11526814)
I spoke to him offline, and the ~$9k was quoted for a potentially cracked head before the teardown. It would be interesting to see the final bill, which should be less(?)
I want to see a video of the car running/driving. Excited! |
Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11528247)
I'll have a video up soon. I found out the previous owner did a weird TT brake upgrade. He used stock c2 pads and hardware on TT calipers and GT3 rotors. The pads are barely hanging on the calipers. It very unsafe to drive so I ordered the correct pads and hardware.
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Originally Posted by alpine003
(Post 11528549)
Look on the caliper to make sure they are indeed TT caliper part number. What you are saying doesn't seem to make sense physically unless you also have custom bracket spacers on there. It could be some other kind of Brembo calipers possibly.
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Yes, IIRC the tt calipers mounting bolts are completely different spacing. They shouldn't bolt on...
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Originally Posted by coffeehead
(Post 11531750)
Yes, IIRC the tt calipers mounting bolts are completely different spacing. They shouldn't bolt on...
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Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11531763)
I spoke to Jason today and The rotors are definitely GT3 but the caliper is unknown. I bought TT pads and and hardware and they bolted right on. As of right now I am unsure how the previous owner did the swap as they are definitely bigger than stock C2 front/rear brakes.
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Delete
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Originally Posted by alpine003
(Post 11531803)
I know how he did it. Check the rear of the calipers and tell me if you see any markings. I'm currently in the process of doing the same poor man's gt3 brake mod myself.
to the OP when will you get to drive with the new motor? Like to hear about that as well. |
I should be getting the car back next week. I'll check the rear brakes when I get the car back home.
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:to_order: How much??
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Originally Posted by 210k911
(Post 11538229)
:to_order: How much??
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You've let this thread go to the second page so bump for an update. Running?....
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Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11545097)
You've let this thread go to the second page so bump for an update. Running?....
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As usual here are some random pictures.... http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...pscebf5dc1.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps1a124cfe.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psa0c8f91f.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psb92a00ff.jpg |
Awesome, glad to see you are up and running. How much was the damage?
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Nice, glad you're back up and running.
It's good to see that you're running the black cap mod instead of the orange. You'll sacrifice a couple ponies but it will be more reliable instead. |
Thanks for keeping us updated and congrats and having it back and up and running.
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Originally Posted by silotwo
(Post 11546640)
Thanks for keeping us updated and congrats and having it back and up and running.
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tell Crass hes a great director :)
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So... How's the car running after 10 days or so and are you going to tell us what your final rebuild costs were? Did he keep to his original proposal?....
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About the oil change, i just follow the 3k rule, always, no matter what car. Oil is soo cheap compared to fixing a car that that is no brainer for me.
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Originally Posted by alpine003
(Post 11531803)
I know how he did it. Check the rear of the calipers and tell me if you see any markings. I'm currently in the process of doing the same poor man's gt3 brake mod myself.
Originally Posted by jrgordonsenior
(Post 11567267)
So... How's the car running after 10 days or so and are you going to tell us what your final rebuild costs were? Did he keep to his original proposal?....
The quote of $9,000 stayed the same and yes He kept his original proposal. |
Great Thread
Thanks for the updates...Awesome Thread...
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I stopped by 9XX today to have Jason make sure everything is OK on my car.
I don't really have any updates on my car since its running well now so here are some random pics. Sorry for the low quality pictures I used my work camera today. Cracked 3.4L case..... http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps7aac5e60.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps04a50309.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps053c34ed.jpg Another cracked case all the way from Mexico http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps60362109.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...pscedda4ea.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps155bc89b.jpg Cracked 3.4L head (barely noticeable) http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psf7109ca8.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psfb87daa0.jpg My favorite... Cracked crank under black light and magnetized dye http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...psa299c599.jpg Anyone want to buy my B&M SSK? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...ps3564f009.jpg |
Originally Posted by jdm538
(Post 11568728)
I am very curious to know how. I was able to check the front caliper markings yesterday and the part number comes up as gt3 mk1 front calipers. I didn't notice any spacers or unusual bolts. I'll check the rear calipers this coming weekend.
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