Eternal IMS Fix?
11-20-2013, 03:47 PM
#46
I don't really see the value in why you are researching this when other's have already gone through it in exhaustive lengths. 
But if you have all the time in the world and endless resources, more power to ya. I don't really know what purpose though it will serve in the end.
But if you have all the time in the world and endless resources, more power to ya. I don't really know what purpose though it will serve in the end.
11-20-2013, 04:57 PM
#47
Pro
I am continuing my research. I may start a Ball Bearing thread when I have more information. Just wish I could get a look at the 987 bearing cage.
The cage on the left is the cage I think would be very helpful with the IMS bearing. The cages in the middle are typical of what is used on the size bearing that the IMSB is (6204). The photo on the right is what can happen when the cage comes apart.
The cage on the left is the cage I think would be very helpful with the IMS bearing. The cages in the middle are typical of what is used on the size bearing that the IMSB is (6204). The photo on the right is what can happen when the cage comes apart.
11-20-2013, 05:12 PM
#48
05-31-2014, 08:56 PM
#50
Thanks to all for their comments. I'm thinking about getting a 996/997 and find this info very helpful since I'm a novice at it even though I've owned and driven a Porsche, my 944, since new in 84. Ralph
06-01-2014, 10:43 AM
#51
Nordschleife Master
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Just looked at the "eternal solution" and it has some serious engineering flaws. The 'thrust control' is just two (hardened, I presume) washers that run on the outer face of the race. The load capacity of the bearing is not even close to design limits of the ball bearing, so 'five times the load limit' means nothing.
Just go with a ceramic bearing replacement. No need to spend thousands on 'magic' solutions.
Just go with a ceramic bearing replacement. No need to spend thousands on 'magic' solutions.
08-23-2017, 03:17 PM
#53
I saw the ad for the Eternal IMS fix also and this got me to looking at what people were saying about it and the other fixes. I have not weighed in on this topic much, until the last few days. I thought I'd weigh in on this one too.
Frankly the Eternal IMS fix from Vertex scares me. No data, no information to really back up their product, not a word.
1. The roller bearing is traditionally great for radial loads but bearing manufacturers rate it as "unsuitable" for thrust loads. Vertex calls it a "thrust" roller bearing but does not explain (again no technical detail) how it handles thrust loads. The bearing at the other end of the IMS was not made to handle thrust loads. The stock ball bearing that is so much trouble was indeed made to handle thrust loads. So the stock bearing is weak when it comes to radial loads, but probably sufficient for the limited axial loads you would see. The Eternal IMS addresses the one issue - radial loads, but fails to provide a means to handle the axial loads.
2. This is a steel bearing with even greater contact area than a ball bearing, but still with marginal, at best, lubrication. This bearing needs MORE lubrication than the stock bearing and a lot more than the ceramic ball bearing. The fact that no provision is given for additional lubrication likewise scares me.
I don't think this is a viable option... best to look at the other ball bearing options, direct oil feed, or plain bearing. Now IF there was a provision to handle thrust and a direct oil feed was added, then this might be a very nice solution. Without those two issues addressed though I would not dare put this product in either of my cars needing an IMS fix.
Kirk Bristol
Frankly the Eternal IMS fix from Vertex scares me. No data, no information to really back up their product, not a word.
1. The roller bearing is traditionally great for radial loads but bearing manufacturers rate it as "unsuitable" for thrust loads. Vertex calls it a "thrust" roller bearing but does not explain (again no technical detail) how it handles thrust loads. The bearing at the other end of the IMS was not made to handle thrust loads. The stock ball bearing that is so much trouble was indeed made to handle thrust loads. So the stock bearing is weak when it comes to radial loads, but probably sufficient for the limited axial loads you would see. The Eternal IMS addresses the one issue - radial loads, but fails to provide a means to handle the axial loads.
2. This is a steel bearing with even greater contact area than a ball bearing, but still with marginal, at best, lubrication. This bearing needs MORE lubrication than the stock bearing and a lot more than the ceramic ball bearing. The fact that no provision is given for additional lubrication likewise scares me.
I don't think this is a viable option... best to look at the other ball bearing options, direct oil feed, or plain bearing. Now IF there was a provision to handle thrust and a direct oil feed was added, then this might be a very nice solution. Without those two issues addressed though I would not dare put this product in either of my cars needing an IMS fix.
Kirk Bristol
Thank you for your interest in our product. We apologize for not responding and commenting sooner.
Our EPS IMS Cylindrical bearing spreads out the pressure point, applying the load on approximately 15mm. Just to give you a little spec information, the IMS shaft turns at HALF the speed of the engine (max 3,500 RPM). Our EPS IMS Cylindrical bearings can operate at speeds up to 15,000 RPM. The speed that the IMS bearing is operating originally at (max 3,500) is a leisurely pace compared to its ability of 15,000 RPM. Also, our EPS IMS bearing differentiates from that of others because it is based on a completely different technology. While others use a ball bearing that applies the load on a pin point of about 1.0mm, our EPS IMS bearing is cylindrical, meaning that it applies the load across the total length of the cylinder, approximately 15mm.
Regarding any doubts on whether oil lubrication is the problem, here is why it isn’t. The bearing is positioned at the bottom of the oil an, so it is question about the oil lubrication being the problem, this is not the case. The bearing is positioned at the bottom of the oil pan, so it is essentially submerged in oil at all times. Lubrication is not the problem here. Hope this clarifies your doubts.
If you have any questions, please feel free to reach out to us.
Thanks,
EPS Team
epsauto.com
08-23-2017, 06:07 PM
#54
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Hi Bristol,
Thank you for your interest in our product. We apologize for not responding and commenting sooner.
Our EPS IMS Cylindrical bearing spreads out the pressure point, applying the load on approximately 15mm. Just to give you a little spec information, the IMS shaft turns at HALF the speed of the engine (max 3,500 RPM). Our EPS IMS Cylindrical bearings can operate at speeds up to 15,000 RPM. The speed that the IMS bearing is operating originally at (max 3,500) is a leisurely pace compared to its ability of 15,000 RPM. Also, our EPS IMS bearing differentiates from that of others because it is based on a completely different technology. While others use a ball bearing that applies the load on a pin point of about 1.0mm, our EPS IMS bearing is cylindrical, meaning that it applies the load across the total length of the cylinder, approximately 15mm.
Regarding any doubts on whether oil lubrication is the problem, here is why it isn’t. The bearing is positioned at the bottom of the oil an, so it is question about the oil lubrication being the problem, this is not the case. The bearing is positioned at the bottom of the oil pan, so it is essentially submerged in oil at all times. Lubrication is not the problem here. Hope this clarifies your doubts.
If you have any questions, please feel free to reach out to us.
Thanks,
EPS Team
epsauto.com
Thank you for your interest in our product. We apologize for not responding and commenting sooner.
Our EPS IMS Cylindrical bearing spreads out the pressure point, applying the load on approximately 15mm. Just to give you a little spec information, the IMS shaft turns at HALF the speed of the engine (max 3,500 RPM). Our EPS IMS Cylindrical bearings can operate at speeds up to 15,000 RPM. The speed that the IMS bearing is operating originally at (max 3,500) is a leisurely pace compared to its ability of 15,000 RPM. Also, our EPS IMS bearing differentiates from that of others because it is based on a completely different technology. While others use a ball bearing that applies the load on a pin point of about 1.0mm, our EPS IMS bearing is cylindrical, meaning that it applies the load across the total length of the cylinder, approximately 15mm.
Regarding any doubts on whether oil lubrication is the problem, here is why it isn’t. The bearing is positioned at the bottom of the oil an, so it is question about the oil lubrication being the problem, this is not the case. The bearing is positioned at the bottom of the oil pan, so it is essentially submerged in oil at all times. Lubrication is not the problem here. Hope this clarifies your doubts.
If you have any questions, please feel free to reach out to us.
Thanks,
EPS Team
epsauto.com
08-23-2017, 06:17 PM
#55
Nordschleife Master
Does he imply it will end up in the oil pan rather? hahaha
Can anyone explain what they mean by the bearing is position at the bottom of the oil pan???
08-23-2017, 06:27 PM
#56
Burning Brakes
I hope this answered your question. Please reply if not and maybe I can add some more clarity.
08-23-2017, 07:35 PM
#57
Instructor
Traditionally there is a top, middle, and bottom of "components". Based on his verbiage, I'd guess he means the lowest portion of the oil pan. The bottom. EPS IMS actually sits on the very bottom of the pan (purposely positioned for efficiency), submerged in oil, mind you it's also magnetic, collecting metal particles. This is the opposite location of the top.
I hope this answered your question. Please reply if not and maybe I can add some more clarity.
I hope this answered your question. Please reply if not and maybe I can add some more clarity.
08-23-2017, 09:06 PM
#59
Traditionally there is a top, middle, and bottom of "components". Based on his verbiage, I'd guess he means the lowest portion of the oil pan. The bottom. EPS IMS actually sits on the very bottom of the pan (purposely positioned for efficiency), submerged in oil, mind you it's also magnetic, collecting metal particles. This is the opposite location of the top.
I hope this answered your question. Please reply if not and maybe I can add some more clarity.
I hope this answered your question. Please reply if not and maybe I can add some more clarity.