View Poll Results: Has YOUR car suffered an IMS failure
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IMS bearing failure for your 996, Y or N? tell us (yr, 996 Mk1 or MK2 failure mode)
11-05-2017, 08:10 AM
#916
Rennlist Member
Being new here, I'll post to help track our cause...
1999 (7/98 build) C2, No failure of Dual row IMSB, but preemptively replaced with LN at 34,000 miles in 2016.
Original IMSB still sealed and showed no signs of wear when removed.
This info is all based on records and my speaking to the tech that did the IMS last year. The car was a very low mile car with partial service records, so I don't know how it was driven and if there were more oil changes than what the car fax shows.
1999 (7/98 build) C2, No failure of Dual row IMSB, but preemptively replaced with LN at 34,000 miles in 2016.
Original IMSB still sealed and showed no signs of wear when removed.
This info is all based on records and my speaking to the tech that did the IMS last year. The car was a very low mile car with partial service records, so I don't know how it was driven and if there were more oil changes than what the car fax shows.
11-08-2017, 08:18 PM
#917
5th Gear
2002 Targa - Engine was replaced by Porsche at 55 000km due to crankshaft out of spec in 2005 with a remanufactured M96 motor. At least that's what the records say. I'm sure you all have heard that that was during that period when the rear mains were leaking a lot and Porsche just replaced the engines instead of fixing them. I bought it at 72 000km and now it's at 128000km and runs perfectly. Im hoping that the remanufactured motor in 2005 had all the issues addressed. I still hold my breath everytime I cut open the oil filter though.
11-17-2017, 09:08 AM
#919
Rennlist Member
2003 C4s with 99k on it's original IMSB. Car is bone dry underneath, no smoke at start up and an oil change last weekend revealed zero particles in the pan, on the magnetic drain plug or the the cut open oil filter.
11-20-2017, 09:16 AM
#920
An update, please
This is an update to my 09-29-2014 posting...way down below.
At 81K miles (August, 2016), the original IMSB was replaced with the LNE Dual Row Pro. The original bearing was not leaking and it turned freely with no discernible play. At the same time, the clutch, AOS, RMS, DMF, clutch thrust bearing, one tensioner, and main input shaft seal were replaced. (The original DMF was definitely worn, and the input shaft was leaking.) I may have spent too much money/too soon, but it now drives like a new 911, and I sleep like a baby. Life is good.
relinuca
At 81K miles (August, 2016), the original IMSB was replaced with the LNE Dual Row Pro. The original bearing was not leaking and it turned freely with no discernible play. At the same time, the clutch, AOS, RMS, DMF, clutch thrust bearing, one tensioner, and main input shaft seal were replaced. (The original DMF was definitely worn, and the input shaft was leaking.) I may have spent too much money/too soon, but it now drives like a new 911, and I sleep like a baby. Life is good.
relinuca
11-20-2017, 08:40 PM
#921
Burning Brakes
Has the failure rate data been broken down by year and type of original dual- or single-row bearings?
I've read that Porsche settled its lawsuit without necessity of repairing/replacing such bearings on pre-2001 cars, reporting that such failures were quite rare with dual-row bearings in the early cars, and the trouble is pretty much limited to later single-row bearings post-2001. I'm considering purchase of a 1999 car.
Are the original early-version dual row bearings still available? Price and source?
I've read that Porsche settled its lawsuit without necessity of repairing/replacing such bearings on pre-2001 cars, reporting that such failures were quite rare with dual-row bearings in the early cars, and the trouble is pretty much limited to later single-row bearings post-2001. I'm considering purchase of a 1999 car.
Are the original early-version dual row bearings still available? Price and source?
11-20-2017, 09:08 PM
#922
Track Day
Join Date: Sep 2017
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Has the failure rate data been broken down by year and type of original dual- or single-row bearings?
I've read that Porsche settled its lawsuit without necessity of repairing/replacing such bearings on pre-2001 cars, reporting that such failures were quite rare with dual-row bearings in the early cars, and the trouble is pretty much limited to later single-row bearings post-2001. I'm considering purchase of a 1999 car.
Are the original early-version dual row bearings still available? Price and source?
I've read that Porsche settled its lawsuit without necessity of repairing/replacing such bearings on pre-2001 cars, reporting that such failures were quite rare with dual-row bearings in the early cars, and the trouble is pretty much limited to later single-row bearings post-2001. I'm considering purchase of a 1999 car.
Are the original early-version dual row bearings still available? Price and source?
11-21-2017, 01:49 PM
#923
Burning Brakes
After all, Porsche litigation data said less than 1% of the early double row bearings were faulty, and looking at data on this thread seems to corroborate that such double row bearings have been found to be good, when replaced with expensive aftermarket units.
Granted, the aftermarket bearings have been well researched and developed, but are they really necessary in the early 996 cars whose factory bearings historically seem OK?
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PS: fwiw, I once rebuilt the alternator in a BMW 535i, replacing the bearings. Local auto parts stores quoted ~$26 for the main bearing, and ~$12 for the small one. Curious, I took the old bearings to a Case farm implement store, and they had the exact same bearings in stock for $6 and $2, respectively. Similar prices quoted at John Deere tractor dealership. These were not cheap Chinese knockoffs, but the exact same maker (Timkin, I think) with the exact same serial numbers. Farm equipment has to be pretty reliable, else Old McDonald doesn't get paid for this year's crop, so Case and Deere sell reliable stuff. Moral of the story: There may be excellent, high quality bearings suitable and sized for this application out there somewhere at very reasonable prices, we just need to find them.
11-21-2017, 01:56 PM
#924
Rennlist Member
From what I read, Porsche doesn't not sell OEM replacement IMS bearings.
And I agree with you, that the research seems to indicate that early `99 motors were less prone to problems. That's why I jumped on the `99 that I just bought. Oh, and when the PO had the bearing upgraded as a preventative measure, the tech who did the work said the OEM bearing looked great at 35k miles on a 17 year old engine (a combo that would presumably be hardest on the IMS). I spoke with him personally before buying the car.
As for buying cheaper versions of the part, sure, that would be nice. But at this point, $700 every 6 years for a dual row IMS is not that bad IMO.
And I agree with you, that the research seems to indicate that early `99 motors were less prone to problems. That's why I jumped on the `99 that I just bought. Oh, and when the PO had the bearing upgraded as a preventative measure, the tech who did the work said the OEM bearing looked great at 35k miles on a 17 year old engine (a combo that would presumably be hardest on the IMS). I spoke with him personally before buying the car.
As for buying cheaper versions of the part, sure, that would be nice. But at this point, $700 every 6 years for a dual row IMS is not that bad IMO.
11-21-2017, 04:05 PM
#925
Race Car
But what about the original factory double row bearing--is that or generic equivalent still available?
After all, Porsche litigation data said less than 1% of the early double row bearings were faulty, and looking at data on this thread seems to corroborate that such double row bearings have been found to be good, when replaced with expensive aftermarket units.
Granted, the aftermarket bearings have been well researched and developed, but are they really necessary in the early 996 cars whose factory bearings historically seem OK?
-----------
PS: fwiw, I once rebuilt the alternator in a BMW 535i, replacing the bearings. Local auto parts stores quoted ~$26 for the main bearing, and ~$12 for the small one. Curious, I took the old bearings to a Case farm implement store, and they had the exact same bearings in stock for $6 and $2, respectively. Similar prices quoted at John Deere tractor dealership. These were not cheap Chinese knockoffs, but the exact same maker (Timkin, I think) with the exact same serial numbers. Farm equipment has to be pretty reliable, else Old McDonald doesn't get paid for this year's crop, so Case and Deere sell reliable stuff. Moral of the story: There may be excellent, high quality bearings suitable and sized for this application out there somewhere at very reasonable prices, we just need to find them.
After all, Porsche litigation data said less than 1% of the early double row bearings were faulty, and looking at data on this thread seems to corroborate that such double row bearings have been found to be good, when replaced with expensive aftermarket units.
Granted, the aftermarket bearings have been well researched and developed, but are they really necessary in the early 996 cars whose factory bearings historically seem OK?
-----------
PS: fwiw, I once rebuilt the alternator in a BMW 535i, replacing the bearings. Local auto parts stores quoted ~$26 for the main bearing, and ~$12 for the small one. Curious, I took the old bearings to a Case farm implement store, and they had the exact same bearings in stock for $6 and $2, respectively. Similar prices quoted at John Deere tractor dealership. These were not cheap Chinese knockoffs, but the exact same maker (Timkin, I think) with the exact same serial numbers. Farm equipment has to be pretty reliable, else Old McDonald doesn't get paid for this year's crop, so Case and Deere sell reliable stuff. Moral of the story: There may be excellent, high quality bearings suitable and sized for this application out there somewhere at very reasonable prices, we just need to find them.
Save your time and effort, this is an engine not an alternator.
11-30-2017, 07:36 AM
#927
Rennlist Member
Bought my '02 C2 Cab in October with 67,000 on the clock. I drove it home from NC, 1,000 miles, being very worried that the IMS would fail on the trip...it didn't. I immediately made an appointment to have the IMS changed along with the failing clutch and leaky RMS. The OEM IMS bearing looked brand new with no noticeable deterioration of the seals. IMS was replaced with the EPS version. The car is tucked away for the winter in my basement and cannot wait for spring to wring it out!
12-04-2017, 03:29 PM
#929
Bought my 03 C4S last week, Tip and little over 82k miles. IMS not replaced and no issues underneath or with exhaust. Still may upgrade, but haven't decided yet. This was a short-distance DD for the last few years so opening it up this past week has 'loosened it up' a tad, or it feels like it anyway. Will be changing oil at every 5k miles just in case, as I've read that's advised to do.
12-05-2017, 05:54 AM
#930
Advanced
Bought my 03 C4S last week, Tip and little over 82k miles. IMS not replaced and no issues underneath or with exhaust. Still may upgrade, but haven't decided yet. This was a short-distance DD for the last few years so opening it up this past week has 'loosened it up' a tad, or it feels like it anyway. Will be changing oil at every 5k miles just in case, as I've read that's advised to do.
5k for engine oil could be slight overkill but see what you think at next change.