purchasing a 2004 996 C4S
02-22-2012, 01:07 PM
#1
Cruisin'
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purchasing a 2004 996 C4S
Hello Everybody,
I discovered this forum a few days ago and I wanted to start by saying I love the sense of community that is across this forum. Its amazing to be surrounded by such good people that all share something they are passionate about.
That being said, a local BMW dealer has come across a 996 C4S which the previous owner traded in and is going up for sale soon. Here are the details that I know of so far:
2004 C4S Black on Black
11,800 miles
6spd manual
Full Leather
power seats, windows, etc
Bose audio
Navigation
Xenon lights
I drove the car the other night and I was blown away by the handling and the overall condition of the car. Dealer told me that the only thing on the record is that it's been involved in a fender-bender in the past, I was able to verify that the hood had been replaced/repainted, otherwise the car looks great. I've bought cars from this salesman before so he brought up this deal while we were in there other day shopping for a friend. The car hasn't actually gone up for sale yet.
Long story short, they are asking $42,000 for it. I haven't discussed the features/options in detail with him nor have we spoke about CPO, etc. He just emailed me the asking price as he found out from his manager. What do you guys think?? Is this a good deal?
Thanks!
Hov
I discovered this forum a few days ago and I wanted to start by saying I love the sense of community that is across this forum. Its amazing to be surrounded by such good people that all share something they are passionate about.
That being said, a local BMW dealer has come across a 996 C4S which the previous owner traded in and is going up for sale soon. Here are the details that I know of so far:
2004 C4S Black on Black
11,800 miles
6spd manual
Full Leather
power seats, windows, etc
Bose audio
Navigation
Xenon lights
I drove the car the other night and I was blown away by the handling and the overall condition of the car. Dealer told me that the only thing on the record is that it's been involved in a fender-bender in the past, I was able to verify that the hood had been replaced/repainted, otherwise the car looks great. I've bought cars from this salesman before so he brought up this deal while we were in there other day shopping for a friend. The car hasn't actually gone up for sale yet.
Long story short, they are asking $42,000 for it. I haven't discussed the features/options in detail with him nor have we spoke about CPO, etc. He just emailed me the asking price as he found out from his manager. What do you guys think?? Is this a good deal?
Thanks!
Hov
02-22-2012, 01:19 PM
#2
Race Director
First of all, welcome to Rennlist. Many will warn you about low mileage Porsches that can have their own set of issues due to inactivity. Second is pricing, its just so hard to determine 'value'. I would suggest driving a few before you commit, and I would want an expert to look over the previous damage to be sure there isn't any hidden damage after the fix. 42k is a bit dear, so maybe a CPO would sweeten the deal.GL and keep us in the loop.
02-22-2012, 01:50 PM
#3
Cruisin'
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thanks barn, I'll see if I can CPO it or get them to include some sort of warranty. I'll see if I can drive any others before committing. And I'll definitely be having a specialist look at it first. It is a BMW dealership so I'm somewhat assured they won't be as sneaky as some private dealers. The story is that a lady traded the car in for an bmw x3, she recently got divorced and wanted to have something more convenient for the kids.
KBB states that with the options and mileage if buying from a private seller...
Excellent: $46,742 , Very Good: $46,042 , Good: $45,142 , Fair: $42,442
Suggested Retail...
Excellent: $50,342
Certified Pre-Owned...
Excellent: $52,342
KBB states that with the options and mileage if buying from a private seller...
Excellent: $46,742 , Very Good: $46,042 , Good: $45,142 , Fair: $42,442
Suggested Retail...
Excellent: $50,342
Certified Pre-Owned...
Excellent: $52,342
02-22-2012, 02:37 PM
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02-22-2012, 03:10 PM
#8
Cruisin'
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good advice guys, love all the input here. Apparently someone had backed into her car when she was in a parking lot a there was minor damage to the front... The only way I was able to tell was by seeing some unpainted hood (underneath edge) which is right above the windshield. Besides this, the interior is totally free of any wear, looks and smells just about brand new.
What would you guys expect to pay for something similar to the car that I'm describing? At this point my only reference is KBB prices. Here's what it says under "Fair Condition" which is noted at $42,442:
Fair:
18% of all cars we value meet this criteria. This car has some mechanical or cosmetic defects and needs servicing, but is still in safe running condition and has a clean title history. The paint, body and/or interior may need professional servicing. The tires may need replacing and there may be some repairable rust damage.
What would you guys expect to pay for something similar to the car that I'm describing? At this point my only reference is KBB prices. Here's what it says under "Fair Condition" which is noted at $42,442:
Fair:
18% of all cars we value meet this criteria. This car has some mechanical or cosmetic defects and needs servicing, but is still in safe running condition and has a clean title history. The paint, body and/or interior may need professional servicing. The tires may need replacing and there may be some repairable rust damage.
02-22-2012, 03:25 PM
#10
Rennlist Member
Fair:
18% of all cars we value meet this criteria. This car has some mechanical or cosmetic defects and needs servicing, but is still in safe running condition and has a clean title history. The paint, body and/or interior may need professional servicing. The tires may need replacing and there may be some repairable rust damage.
18% of all cars we value meet this criteria. This car has some mechanical or cosmetic defects and needs servicing, but is still in safe running condition and has a clean title history. The paint, body and/or interior may need professional servicing. The tires may need replacing and there may be some repairable rust damage.
02-22-2012, 03:26 PM
#11
Cruisin'
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lol Gonzo, I come from a BMW background. 2002 M3, 2008 335i, and currently a 2003 540i. This would be a complete change of character for me but I welcome the opportunity to own and enjoy one of these fine machines if I can find a good deal. I just want to be sure I'm not getting shafted by the sneaky dealers.
Chao. I'll find out about tires, they looked new on the car but I'll check. The pics may be hard to come by but I'll find out more on my next visit to the salesman. Most importantly I wanted to share what I do know with you guys in case you had some suggestions to load me up with before I go see him again. He told my father about the car (he's helping him buy a BMW) and my father told me about the 911. So after work I stopped by for a test-drive. The car wasn't prepped for sale or anything, the salesman didn't even really know anything about the car at the time.
Chao. I'll find out about tires, they looked new on the car but I'll check. The pics may be hard to come by but I'll find out more on my next visit to the salesman. Most importantly I wanted to share what I do know with you guys in case you had some suggestions to load me up with before I go see him again. He told my father about the car (he's helping him buy a BMW) and my father told me about the 911. So after work I stopped by for a test-drive. The car wasn't prepped for sale or anything, the salesman didn't even really know anything about the car at the time.
02-22-2012, 03:38 PM
#12
Rocky Mountain High
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The difficult thing about buying a used Porsche is that if you don't have service and maintenance records from the previous owner, it's extremely difficult to find out anything about the car's history. This is true even at a Porsche dealer. There isn't a central network that allows a dealer to track down the car's service history. All they can really find in the system is whether a car was in for a TSB (Technical Service Bulletin) repair. Because you don't have much in the way of history on this car, you'll need to rely heavily on your PPI and on your own gut. If you like the car and the PPI checks out, then I say go for it. You can drive yourself crazy if you get too deep into the weeds here. On the other hand, if the PPI reveals some issues and if your gut starts telling you that there may be issues, then walk away. It's easy to get emotional when shopping for Porsches. If this isn't the one for you, there will be others.
Enjoy the process!
Enjoy the process!
02-22-2012, 03:59 PM
#14
Three Wheelin'
I'm going to point out the negative:
If the accident shows up on a carfax or similar report, that's a non-starter for me. Value is already effected and far more than the $42K asking price would suggest.
With that low mileage on a 8 year old car you can most likely assume:
1st, Tires are original - sure the tread is good, just don't ignore the dry rot!
make sure you check the date of manufacture of the tires. It's a 4 digit code in the side wall. first two numbers are the week in which the tires were produced, second 2 numbers are the year (etc 2105 means that the tires were produced in the 21st week of 2005).
2nd, the trans/differential fluid has never been changed.
3rd, the oil may have been changed 3 times (if your lucky)
4th This car sat, not being used for quite a long time.
5th The car has it's original IMS/RMS
None of these things are good when it comes to these cars (or any cars for that matter).
IMO, low mileage on these cars is a cause for concern.
No way they would get $42k from me on this car, regardless of mint condition appearance.
If the accident shows up on a carfax or similar report, that's a non-starter for me. Value is already effected and far more than the $42K asking price would suggest.
With that low mileage on a 8 year old car you can most likely assume:
1st, Tires are original - sure the tread is good, just don't ignore the dry rot!
make sure you check the date of manufacture of the tires. It's a 4 digit code in the side wall. first two numbers are the week in which the tires were produced, second 2 numbers are the year (etc 2105 means that the tires were produced in the 21st week of 2005).
2nd, the trans/differential fluid has never been changed.
3rd, the oil may have been changed 3 times (if your lucky)
4th This car sat, not being used for quite a long time.
5th The car has it's original IMS/RMS
None of these things are good when it comes to these cars (or any cars for that matter).
IMO, low mileage on these cars is a cause for concern.
No way they would get $42k from me on this car, regardless of mint condition appearance.
02-22-2012, 04:12 PM
#15
Chandler!
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I'm going to point out the negative:
If the accident shows up on a carfax or similar report, that's a non-starter for me. Value is already effected and far more than the $42K asking price would suggest.
With that low mileage on a 8 year old car you can most likely assume:
1st, Tires are original - sure the tread is good, just don't ignore the dry rot!
make sure you check the date of manufacture of the tires. It's a 4 digit code in the side wall. first two numbers are the week in which the tires were produced, second 2 numbers are the year (etc 2105 means that the tires were produced in the 21st week of 2005).
2nd, the trans/differential fluid has never been changed.
3rd, the oil may have been changed 3 times (if your lucky)
4th This car sat, not being used for quite a long time.
5th The car has it's original IMS/RMS
None of these things are good when it comes to these cars (or any cars for that matter).
IMO, low mileage on these cars is a cause for concern.
No way they would get $42k from me on this car, regardless of mint condition appearance.
If the accident shows up on a carfax or similar report, that's a non-starter for me. Value is already effected and far more than the $42K asking price would suggest.
With that low mileage on a 8 year old car you can most likely assume:
1st, Tires are original - sure the tread is good, just don't ignore the dry rot!
make sure you check the date of manufacture of the tires. It's a 4 digit code in the side wall. first two numbers are the week in which the tires were produced, second 2 numbers are the year (etc 2105 means that the tires were produced in the 21st week of 2005).
2nd, the trans/differential fluid has never been changed.
3rd, the oil may have been changed 3 times (if your lucky)
4th This car sat, not being used for quite a long time.
5th The car has it's original IMS/RMS
None of these things are good when it comes to these cars (or any cars for that matter).
IMO, low mileage on these cars is a cause for concern.
No way they would get $42k from me on this car, regardless of mint condition appearance.
I just turned 125,000 miles on my 2004 C4S.... would never buy a Porsche with miles that low, and in a fender bender - no matter how minor.
I mean 42k is pushing 2004 Turbo pricing.
Welcome to Rennlist, good luck!