Transmission out - what to replace?
03-21-2019, 05:01 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
Transmission out - what to replace?
Hi,
My car is a 1999 C2 6spd Cab with 100k miles.
I have my transmission out, while it is out I figured I will address some other things:
- Clutch. Works but maybe get a new one (was replaced 40k ago by PO)
- IMS (currently have the LN, might be due for a new one or solution)
- RMS (I suspect there is a leak from this, has been replaced by PO. Is this a service item?)
Is there anything else that is easy to replace while the tranny is out? Throwout bearing?
I should replace my timing chain pads but I assume that requires dropping the engine.
My car is a 1999 C2 6spd Cab with 100k miles.
I have my transmission out, while it is out I figured I will address some other things:
- Clutch. Works but maybe get a new one (was replaced 40k ago by PO)
- IMS (currently have the LN, might be due for a new one or solution)
- RMS (I suspect there is a leak from this, has been replaced by PO. Is this a service item?)
Is there anything else that is easy to replace while the tranny is out? Throwout bearing?
I should replace my timing chain pads but I assume that requires dropping the engine.
03-21-2019, 05:10 PM
#2
Captain Obvious
Super User
Super User
Slow down tiger! Instead of replacing everything, how about first inspect and measure before considering changing anything? Measure and inspect the clutch. If all looks normal, leave it alone. This goes for the intermediate shaft bearing too. It's a hybrid double row so it should last forever. As for the rear main seal, if it sin't leaking, leave it alone.
Why did you pull the transmission anyways?
Why did you pull the transmission anyways?
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jim gee (11-20-2021)
03-21-2019, 06:03 PM
#3
Drifting
A lot depends on whether you like working on your car including dropping the transmission, and I guess your financial situation. If this is easy/fun for you to do this work, or you don’t mind paying someone to do it for you, then you can postone it. Otherwise, this is an ideal time to do this work since you are in there and everything is accessible. To get back to this area, you’ll need to pull it all apart again. For some of us that kind of work isn’t a big deal, others it is a huge deal.
If you want to do stuff “while you are in there”:
If your IMS bearing is near it’s service interval, then replace it while you are in there.
If your rear main seal is leaking, replace it with the most recent version.
If the clutch (or any clutch components) are going to need service, now is the time to do it.
Depending on the condition of the flywheel, pilot bearing, throwout bearing, transmission input seal, pivot, clip, arm, etc, you can replace the pieces that need it.
If you want to do stuff “while you are in there”:
If your IMS bearing is near it’s service interval, then replace it while you are in there.
If your rear main seal is leaking, replace it with the most recent version.
If the clutch (or any clutch components) are going to need service, now is the time to do it.
Depending on the condition of the flywheel, pilot bearing, throwout bearing, transmission input seal, pivot, clip, arm, etc, you can replace the pieces that need it.
03-21-2019, 06:07 PM
#4
Racer
Thread Starter
Slow down tiger! Instead of replacing everything, how about first inspect and measure before considering changing anything? Measure and inspect the clutch. If all looks normal, leave it alone. This goes for the intermediate shaft bearing too. It's a hybrid double row so it should last forever. As for the rear main seal, if it sin't leaking, leave it alone.
Why did you pull the transmission anyways?
Why did you pull the transmission anyways?
Regarding the IMS, why do you say it lasts forever? LN recommends replacing them every 5year/50k miles. (And if the PO didn't install the LN bearing then I have OEM)
As for the RMS, if this is a service item I might as well do it know? The RMS have been replaced once, is the replacement a life time item?
I had an annoying drive train issue. I have checked wheel bearings, CV joints, diff etc. I now suspect the pinion bearings, when rotating the "output shaft" there is a little bit of noise. I also ran the car with the diff out and it feels like it sounded like the drivetrain noise I heard earlier.
ill open up the transmission to have a look.
03-21-2019, 08:16 PM
#5
Drifting
The RMS is not a lifetime item. It is an inexpensive part, and is easy to replace. The part itself has been superceeded (and improved) several times. If it *is* leaking, it is a no brainer to replace it.
The LN bearings DO have a service interval, and it is wise to replace it while you have it apart, IMO.
The LN bearings DO have a service interval, and it is wise to replace it while you have it apart, IMO.
03-21-2019, 08:23 PM
#6
Burning Brakes
RMS is cheap, put in a new one.
AOS can be easier to swap from the rear
Perhaps oil cooler oil rings, easier to get to from the rear
Clutch disc, throwout bearing. Clean and lube spline etc
AOS can be easier to swap from the rear
Perhaps oil cooler oil rings, easier to get to from the rear
Clutch disc, throwout bearing. Clean and lube spline etc
03-21-2019, 08:26 PM
#7
Drifting
I’ll plug it for him: Chris (MA) above has a 3D printed RMS tool that is inexpensive and works great. I’d recommend it without hesitation.
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03-22-2019, 10:42 AM
#8
Captain Obvious
Super User
Super User
The RMS is not a lifetime item. It is an inexpensive part, and is easy to replace. The part itself has been superceeded (and improved) several times. If it *is* leaking, it is a no brainer to replace it.
The LN bearings DO have a service interval, and it is wise to replace it while you have it apart, IMO.
The LN bearings DO have a service interval, and it is wise to replace it while you have it apart, IMO.
If the clutch feels weird, take the clutch set to a transmission shop and have them inspect the dual mass flywheel and the pressure place. The rear main seal is cheap but that doesn't mena you need to replace it. If it doesn't show any sign of leak then leave it alone.
03-22-2019, 03:24 PM
#9
Burning Brakes
I consider the dual row hybrid LN bearing to be a lifetime part. The OE bearings had a very low failure rate and were pretty robust. Even the experts admitted that the problem wasn't really the dual row but the single row bearings. If this has been replaced with a much stronger hybrid unit and is from LN (a reputable company) then I wouldn't bother worrying about it ever again. Years ago people demanded a service interval for all the LN bearings so the way I see it, an interval was set to satisfy the crowds. This is also good for business too.
If the clutch feels weird, take the clutch set to a transmission shop and have them inspect the dual mass flywheel and the pressure place. The rear main seal is cheap but that doesn't mena you need to replace it. If it doesn't show any sign of leak then leave it alone.
If the clutch feels weird, take the clutch set to a transmission shop and have them inspect the dual mass flywheel and the pressure place. The rear main seal is cheap but that doesn't mena you need to replace it. If it doesn't show any sign of leak then leave it alone.
My original IMS bearing ran for 102k miles and was in good shape, so I'm assuming my IMS run out is good. I also do quick frequent oil changes to keep my oil clean and avoid any condensation issues; so I'm going to chance my LN bearing lasting for the lifetime left on the motor
03-22-2019, 03:47 PM
#10
Rennlist Member
"I consider the dual row hybrid LN bearing to be a lifetime part. The OE bearings had a very low failure rate and were pretty robust. Even the experts admitted that the problem wasn't really the dual row but the single row bearings."
Oh you do, eh? And what makes your opinion the be all and end all on IMS Bearings? Perhaps you'd like to quote the "experts" that "admitted" that the dual row bearing wasn't a problem? The bottom line is that all replacement bearings have a service interval of a specified time or mileage except for The Solution which is a permanent replacement. Whether the service interval is based on the desire of LN Engineering to sell more bearings is pure conjecture. According to their research and development the service interval they set, is what they consider to be safe operating parameters for the bearing - FWIW, they don't say anything about having to replace your bearing with one of theirs...This is how misinformation gets started
Oh you do, eh? And what makes your opinion the be all and end all on IMS Bearings? Perhaps you'd like to quote the "experts" that "admitted" that the dual row bearing wasn't a problem? The bottom line is that all replacement bearings have a service interval of a specified time or mileage except for The Solution which is a permanent replacement. Whether the service interval is based on the desire of LN Engineering to sell more bearings is pure conjecture. According to their research and development the service interval they set, is what they consider to be safe operating parameters for the bearing - FWIW, they don't say anything about having to replace your bearing with one of theirs...This is how misinformation gets started
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jim gee (11-20-2021)
03-22-2019, 04:25 PM
#12
Captain Obvious
Super User
Super User
"I consider the dual row hybrid LN bearing to be a lifetime part. The OE bearings had a very low failure rate and were pretty robust. Even the experts admitted that the problem wasn't really the dual row but the single row bearings."
Oh you do, eh? And what makes your opinion the be all and end all on IMS Bearings? Perhaps you'd like to quote the "experts" that "admitted" that the dual row bearing wasn't a problem? The bottom line is that all replacement bearings have a service interval of a specified time or mileage except for The Solution which is a permanent replacement. Whether the service interval is based on the desire of LN Engineering to sell more bearings is pure conjecture. According to their research and development the service interval they set, is what they consider to be safe operating parameters for the bearing - FWIW, they don't say anything about having to replace your bearing with one of theirs...This is how misinformation gets started
Oh you do, eh? And what makes your opinion the be all and end all on IMS Bearings? Perhaps you'd like to quote the "experts" that "admitted" that the dual row bearing wasn't a problem? The bottom line is that all replacement bearings have a service interval of a specified time or mileage except for The Solution which is a permanent replacement. Whether the service interval is based on the desire of LN Engineering to sell more bearings is pure conjecture. According to their research and development the service interval they set, is what they consider to be safe operating parameters for the bearing - FWIW, they don't say anything about having to replace your bearing with one of theirs...This is how misinformation gets started
The Solution is a bearing too and will wear out over time too but it will probably happen past the life expectancy of the engine. I believe, the dual row LN hybrid bearing will do the same and outlast the life of the engine as well. If you go back far enough with you will see how the replacement interval came to be. At first there really wasn't any or at least that's how I remember.
03-22-2019, 11:42 PM
#13
Drifting
The clutch fork and the clutch slave have both been updated to 997 parts so I would recommend changing both of those even if they are currently operating ok. Sometimes we slowly grow callused to the condition of a car and it’s mechanisms and don’t realize how much they’ve actually deteriorated over time. I certainly experienced that this Fall when I changed the clutch, pilot bearing, throwout bearing, flywheel, pressure plate, fork, slave, trans fluid, and clutch fluid. It was a night and day different.
03-23-2019, 12:43 PM
#14
Rennlist Member
"You've cut my quote short by a sentence or two and took it out of context."
I was simply addressing the the part of your quote that I found objectionable - I don't see how it was "taken out of context".
"I consider the dual row hybrid LN bearing to be a lifetime part."
^^This certainly doesn't help your argument... (the first sentence I cut short).
"or at least that's how I remember."
^^ I think this is key to your argument ^^ I only entered the 996 world in 2014 so I don't go back to the very beginning of the IMSB retrofits. I know there were early products that had different recommendations (including LNE/FSI products) regarding service life. I'm not even saying your opinion is "wrong", just that it is an opinion and not "fact" which someone just coming to the argument may take it as. This is often the problem with internet forums - opinions turn into facts and get repeated as such.
I was simply addressing the the part of your quote that I found objectionable - I don't see how it was "taken out of context".
"I consider the dual row hybrid LN bearing to be a lifetime part."
^^This certainly doesn't help your argument... (the first sentence I cut short).
"or at least that's how I remember."
^^ I think this is key to your argument ^^ I only entered the 996 world in 2014 so I don't go back to the very beginning of the IMSB retrofits. I know there were early products that had different recommendations (including LNE/FSI products) regarding service life. I'm not even saying your opinion is "wrong", just that it is an opinion and not "fact" which someone just coming to the argument may take it as. This is often the problem with internet forums - opinions turn into facts and get repeated as such.
03-24-2019, 10:20 AM
#15
If you haven't done so already I'd recommend replacing the 2nd gear detent while you have the transmission out. Before replacing mine I (very) occasionally missed 2nd gear because the transmission didn't engage fully. The 2nd gear detect upgrade from a company called GBox completely solved the problem. It isn't that expensive and improves the feel getting into 2nd gear slightly. It is apparently possible to replace when the transmission is in the car, but but much easier when it is out.