1999 996 IMS ****if this subject bothers you then do not read***
02-22-2019, 07:47 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
1999 996 IMS ****if this subject bothers you then do not read***
After all of my research I come away with a pretty idea of what we are talking about but I want to get your insight. So the 1999 has the double row IMS along with some of the 2000 cars. After that Porsche really screwed their customers by stepping down to a single row. I believe this is where and when all of the problems began. To make matters worse in 2006 not only did they stay with the single row while supposedly making it a bit stronger stronger but it cannot receive any cure without ripping down the motor, in other words it is internal.
Nothing new there, right?
To the point my research tells that 1% of the double row cars had a problem while the single row cars up to 2006 are at 8%ish failure which is very high I think. I don’t want to replace mine if I don’t have to. This thread is more about something I just uncovered for myself. There is or was a monitoring system available.
Has anyone installed this?
What do you think of it?
How much did you pay to install or did you do it yourself? I see it used to be around a grand.
***Disclaimer***
If you do not like discussing this topic then just move along please don’t post negative comments here. I know this subject has been beaten to death and it deserves to be. We are discussing the life and death of our engines. I’m trying to gather facts so I can decide what course of action I am going to take. Newcomers to the 996 should know the facts and the options.
Enjoy!
Nothing new there, right?
To the point my research tells that 1% of the double row cars had a problem while the single row cars up to 2006 are at 8%ish failure which is very high I think. I don’t want to replace mine if I don’t have to. This thread is more about something I just uncovered for myself. There is or was a monitoring system available.
Has anyone installed this?
What do you think of it?
How much did you pay to install or did you do it yourself? I see it used to be around a grand.
***Disclaimer***
If you do not like discussing this topic then just move along please don’t post negative comments here. I know this subject has been beaten to death and it deserves to be. We are discussing the life and death of our engines. I’m trying to gather facts so I can decide what course of action I am going to take. Newcomers to the 996 should know the facts and the options.
Enjoy!
02-22-2019, 08:15 PM
#2
Drifting
IMS Guardian. It’s in the Wayne Dempsey 101 projects book. No idea if it is still available, try LN Engineering and Pelican Parts. Based on the article, it looks like it just goes in place of the drain plug, and the wires are run up into the cabin, where you grab power out of the fusebox, and install the indicator into a switch blank in the horseshoe. Sounds like a two bananna job to me.
https://www.pelicanparts.com/techart...S_Guardian.htm
https://www.pelicanparts.com/techart...S_Guardian.htm
02-22-2019, 08:16 PM
#3
Burning Brakes
The system you are talking about was made by flat six I think (I might be wrong) but is now discontinued. I believe it worked by having a different drain plug in the sump that was magnetic with 2x probes, if the IMS started failing the idea was to attract any metal flakes which would stick to the magnet and bridge the two probes, completing a circuit and putting a light ON in the dash.
My guess is it was not a great solution; as by the time you got a warning your engine might be full of damaging particles.
These days its just a better option to drop your tranny, put a good aftermarket IMS bearing in and a new clutch/RMS and forgettaboutit. I did mine myself in my less than stellar garage space, not too difficult.
I have a ceramic LN engineering IMS in mine, dual row. I also have powerful magnets wrapped around my OEM filter housing which I check on each 5-6k mile oil change, they capture anything ferrous so I can check it. Last oil change was a small amount of smooth ferrous spooge which is good...
My guess is it was not a great solution; as by the time you got a warning your engine might be full of damaging particles.
These days its just a better option to drop your tranny, put a good aftermarket IMS bearing in and a new clutch/RMS and forgettaboutit. I did mine myself in my less than stellar garage space, not too difficult.
I have a ceramic LN engineering IMS in mine, dual row. I also have powerful magnets wrapped around my OEM filter housing which I check on each 5-6k mile oil change, they capture anything ferrous so I can check it. Last oil change was a small amount of smooth ferrous spooge which is good...
02-22-2019, 08:18 PM
#4
Three Wheelin'
General question, what is considered a high failure rate for a car?
02-22-2019, 08:51 PM
#6
Three Wheelin'
02-23-2019, 01:43 AM
#7
Rennlist Member
I have heard of Porsches with low mileage, high mileage and in between having failures. Obviously if your Porsche falls in the 1% group, and there were over 20,000 '99 Boxsters produced, then there are perhaps at least 2000 that could have failed bearings. Since you will never know whether your fall into the group with failures or the group without failures, it seems logical to replace the IMS, unless you feel comfortable living with the risk. I decided to mitigate risk on my 9,000 km '99 Boxster, because I wasn't happy with the risk. By the way, the bearing was in perfect condition on replacement.
Sorry, I was just reading about Boxsters, and then realized I was in the 996 forum, but the logic still applies, which is why on my 996 targa, I was either buying a car with a replaced IMS bearing or planning to replace it (as I bought the targa used, unlike the Boxster which I bought new).
Sorry, I was just reading about Boxsters, and then realized I was in the 996 forum, but the logic still applies, which is why on my 996 targa, I was either buying a car with a replaced IMS bearing or planning to replace it (as I bought the targa used, unlike the Boxster which I bought new).
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02-23-2019, 01:48 AM
#8
Racer
Thread Starter
I have heard of Porsches with low mileage, high mileage and in between having failures. Obviously if your Porsche falls in the 1% group, and there were over 20,000 '99 Boxsters produced, then there are perhaps at least 2000 that could have failed bearings. Since you will never know whether your fall into the group with failures or the group without failures, it seems logical to replace the IMS, unless you feel comfortable living with the risk. I decided to mitigate risk on my 9,000 km '99 Boxster, because I wasn't happy with the risk. By the way, the bearing was in perfect condition on replacement.
Sorry, I was just reading about Boxsters, and then realized, I was in the 996 forum, but the logic still applies, which is why on my 996 targa, I was either buying a car with a replaced IMS or planning to replace it (as I bought this Porsche used, unlike the Boxster which I bought new).
Sorry, I was just reading about Boxsters, and then realized, I was in the 996 forum, but the logic still applies, which is why on my 996 targa, I was either buying a car with a replaced IMS or planning to replace it (as I bought this Porsche used, unlike the Boxster which I bought new).
02-23-2019, 08:14 AM
#9
$400 and five hours to "monitor the potential problem" or $2500 and not worrying about it again. What baffles me is all the people who own these cars and then are paranoid about the IMS??? Information on this is abundant on the internet show why wouldn't you buy a year that is not problematic?
Personally for me 2-3k is cheap money for peace of mind, just replace it.
Personally for me 2-3k is cheap money for peace of mind, just replace it.
02-23-2019, 08:20 AM
#10
Drifting
I suspect it is a very small segment of the porsche owning population: probably more prevalent in people that hang out in model specific internet forums and have fears reinforced by the echo chamber. The same people that are losing sleep over this are probably going to start losing sleep over bore scoring next.
A lot of the rest of us just enjoy our car. I suspect we are underrepresented in the self selected group that posts these questions and comments.
A lot of the rest of us just enjoy our car. I suspect we are underrepresented in the self selected group that posts these questions and comments.
02-23-2019, 09:47 AM
#11
For me, the 996 represents an interesting, moderately complex, and notably elegant machine - that for various reasons can be had for about half what it should cost. I feel that when you own any machine like that, you owe it a "duty of care". If it has a weakness (as it does), it becomes part of your duty to address that - perhaps the more so because that weakness is a big part of the reason the car was affordable.
Having installed the IMS Solution (an interesting project) I find the car more enjoyable to drive. I did my part by giving it the care it needed (along with clutch, RMS, AOS, etc.); in return, it does its part on the road - conspicuously well. I would not enjoy the driving as much if I felt I hadn't held up my side of the bargain - it would feel disloyal, and the car would not owe me the performance it consistently delivers.
I don't claim all this is fully rational, nor do I condemn alternate views. But this is how my thinking runs.
02-23-2019, 10:10 AM
#12
I suspect it is a very small segment of the porsche owning population: probably more prevalent in people that hang out in model specific internet forums and have fears reinforced by the echo chamber. The same people that are losing sleep over this are probably going to start losing sleep over bore scoring next.
A lot of the rest of us just enjoy our car. I suspect we are underrepresented in the self selected group that posts these questions and comments.
A lot of the rest of us just enjoy our car. I suspect we are underrepresented in the self selected group that posts these questions and comments.
02-23-2019, 10:43 AM
#13
Racer
Thread Starter
I suspect it is a very small segment of the porsche owning population: probably more prevalent in people that hang out in model specific internet forums and have fears reinforced by the echo chamber. The same people that are losing sleep over this are probably going to start losing sleep over bore scoring next.
A lot of the rest of us just enjoy our car. I suspect we are underrepresented in the self selected group that posts these questions and comments.
A lot of the rest of us just enjoy our car. I suspect we are underrepresented in the self selected group that posts these questions and comments.
I do appreciate everyone responding to this thread. Please keep them coming.
02-23-2019, 10:57 AM
#14
Drifting
Do whatever makes you happy.
I did the LN dual row classic in my 2000, and haven’t touched the IMS bearing in my 2002. The 2002 has an AT replacement with the latest large IMS bearing, which would require splitting the cases to replace.
You’ll never know if you have one of the unluckily ones unless and until it happens. Worrying about it won’t change that. Preemptive replacement might help you dodge a bullet on this particular mode of failure.
High or low percentages of historic failure rates have no impact on the likelihood of the failure on your car.
Fix it or don’t. Worry about it or don’t. Keep rehashing the most over discussed topic on this forum or don’t. It doesn’t really matter to me.
You roll the dice and you take your chances.
I did the LN dual row classic in my 2000, and haven’t touched the IMS bearing in my 2002. The 2002 has an AT replacement with the latest large IMS bearing, which would require splitting the cases to replace.
You’ll never know if you have one of the unluckily ones unless and until it happens. Worrying about it won’t change that. Preemptive replacement might help you dodge a bullet on this particular mode of failure.
High or low percentages of historic failure rates have no impact on the likelihood of the failure on your car.
Fix it or don’t. Worry about it or don’t. Keep rehashing the most over discussed topic on this forum or don’t. It doesn’t really matter to me.
You roll the dice and you take your chances.
02-23-2019, 11:06 AM
#15
Racer
Thread Starter
I am sorry you see it as “rehashing”. I think your missing part of the point. It’s 2019 and I am looking for more data. CDS72911 while you may not fully realize it you just provided me with recent up to date data. I’m sure others have more data.
Like how many of us have been in there to change the IMS only to find on that is totally fine?
In part this is the information I am looking for in particular relating to the double roller but not completely. I think if we look at this way there is more current information that can be provide along with which IMS solution did you use?
There is a huge spread in cost and not necessarily the same part. Some manufacturers use different material. Again more data. When Insearch this forum an absolute ton of data shows up. I spent several hours reading through it. Some of it 10 years or more older. That is not current as far as I am concerned.
It is my hope that folks with a negative attitude towards this subject just move along as they really have noting meaningful to contribute.
Like how many of us have been in there to change the IMS only to find on that is totally fine?
In part this is the information I am looking for in particular relating to the double roller but not completely. I think if we look at this way there is more current information that can be provide along with which IMS solution did you use?
There is a huge spread in cost and not necessarily the same part. Some manufacturers use different material. Again more data. When Insearch this forum an absolute ton of data shows up. I spent several hours reading through it. Some of it 10 years or more older. That is not current as far as I am concerned.
It is my hope that folks with a negative attitude towards this subject just move along as they really have noting meaningful to contribute.