2000 996 - low mileage
02-06-2018, 05:18 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
2000 996 - low mileage
I am going to go look at a 2000 996 with 45000 miles. It is at a used luxury car dealer. Asking is $26K ($32K Canadian). It is a 5 owner car according to carfax.
I have read about IMS, RMS etc. What can I really expect from servicing perspective?
I consider myself with decent amateur car repair skill level: Ex. I have replaced, modified all the suspension on my mustang myself. I've built a new rear end, did a brake disc conversion etc. I can do complex electrical etc. Will I be able to do most of the maintenance? I also have a 4 post lift in my garage.
So, I would never consider doing IMS or RMS myself, or the clutch.
Am I doing to be able to maintain this car myself?
I am in Canada, in the Toronto area. Let's just say, I have never been impressed with the level of repair shops in the Toronto area. The one's that I have reached out that will actually speak to you are at least 2.5 hours away, only open M-F days. The other's are dismissive when being asked about PPI's etc. Forums speak to local Porsche dealers (4 in Toronto area) not doing PPI's and/or IMS fixes. My complaints with respect to Porsche service is a common experience for a lot of different things here in Canada. It applies to most hobby items. I know you gotta pay to play. In Canada, I even find it hard to find somebody to pay to....Saw a 997 a month ago. 65K miles. Really good cosmetics. Not perfect like it was just detailed. Very, very clean. Car didn't start. All dealer booster boxes are dead. Ok. So, see service history to about 45K miles. Ask about remainder of history. They say will get it from another dealer where the car was serviced. I follow up with them. Nothing. Follow up again, Not even a statement we can't get service history. Not too interested in selling it I guess.
That's most things here in Canada. I used to work in the U.S. so I know how much better customer service is and always someone to take your money. LOL.You go to Home Depot in the U.S. staff takes you to the aisle for what you are looking for. In Canada, standard response is "Oh, that is probably in aisle 4" - employee walks away.
I know that I am going to struggle to get the car repaired for the repairs I can't do. Question is, can I do most of it? What is going to break. This will be a weekend car, driven 3000 miles annually (mostly drives to the cottage, 100 miles away).
Here's the car:
https://www.worldfinecars.ca/all/veh...-id8616715.htm
I have read about IMS, RMS etc. What can I really expect from servicing perspective?
I consider myself with decent amateur car repair skill level: Ex. I have replaced, modified all the suspension on my mustang myself. I've built a new rear end, did a brake disc conversion etc. I can do complex electrical etc. Will I be able to do most of the maintenance? I also have a 4 post lift in my garage.
So, I would never consider doing IMS or RMS myself, or the clutch.
Am I doing to be able to maintain this car myself?
I am in Canada, in the Toronto area. Let's just say, I have never been impressed with the level of repair shops in the Toronto area. The one's that I have reached out that will actually speak to you are at least 2.5 hours away, only open M-F days. The other's are dismissive when being asked about PPI's etc. Forums speak to local Porsche dealers (4 in Toronto area) not doing PPI's and/or IMS fixes. My complaints with respect to Porsche service is a common experience for a lot of different things here in Canada. It applies to most hobby items. I know you gotta pay to play. In Canada, I even find it hard to find somebody to pay to....Saw a 997 a month ago. 65K miles. Really good cosmetics. Not perfect like it was just detailed. Very, very clean. Car didn't start. All dealer booster boxes are dead. Ok. So, see service history to about 45K miles. Ask about remainder of history. They say will get it from another dealer where the car was serviced. I follow up with them. Nothing. Follow up again, Not even a statement we can't get service history. Not too interested in selling it I guess.
That's most things here in Canada. I used to work in the U.S. so I know how much better customer service is and always someone to take your money. LOL.You go to Home Depot in the U.S. staff takes you to the aisle for what you are looking for. In Canada, standard response is "Oh, that is probably in aisle 4" - employee walks away.
I know that I am going to struggle to get the car repaired for the repairs I can't do. Question is, can I do most of it? What is going to break. This will be a weekend car, driven 3000 miles annually (mostly drives to the cottage, 100 miles away).
Here's the car:
https://www.worldfinecars.ca/all/veh...-id8616715.htm
02-06-2018, 05:30 PM
#2
Drifting
If you can't/won't do a clutch/IMS/RMS (indicative of a certain level of repair involvement/complexity), you don't have a good local shop and you can't even reasonably transport the car to one nearby, I'd steer away from these cars.
In my searches, $26K USD will buy a lot nicer, newer 996, but that is in the US.
In my searches, $26K USD will buy a lot nicer, newer 996, but that is in the US.
02-06-2018, 06:53 PM
#3
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Seems the big problem is you want a PPI but no one will do it. Maybe you want to look at cars closer to the reputable shops that will do a PPI.
Given what you've described, I say you should be able to do the basic maintenance and trouble shooting...as I had less experience wrenching on cars than you. The problem with these cars is that things can go catastrophic unexpectedly...which it sounds like you're looking to transport your car a fair distance to get it serviced for major items (IMS, RMS, scoring, clutch, etc). If that's an issue, then ya, what CDS said.
Given what you've described, I say you should be able to do the basic maintenance and trouble shooting...as I had less experience wrenching on cars than you. The problem with these cars is that things can go catastrophic unexpectedly...which it sounds like you're looking to transport your car a fair distance to get it serviced for major items (IMS, RMS, scoring, clutch, etc). If that's an issue, then ya, what CDS said.
02-06-2018, 07:20 PM
#4
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Toronto is a strange place. Claim to be world class, but lot’s of things are non sensical. Only certified installer for the ims solution is 35 miles away. In most places, that’s a 45 minute drive. Since the shop is only open 8 to 5, Monday to Friday. This becomes a 2.5 hour adventure. The other shops that I have called and googled, lots of mixed reviews. One outfit that does race prep for Porsche’s says motor has to be pulled for ims.
Typical isues here in Canada. A couple years ago, I dropped off my atv at the local and largest Honda atv dealer for a valve adjust. Took 10 days. That was a rush. John Deere lawn mower stopped running. Again, local dealer. 2 weeks for a carb rebuild. My espresso maker took 4 weeks for maintenance. He had the parts in stock.
Here dealers challenge you for test drives. Even for daily drivers. I think it is a Canadian quirk. I might just go 997.2 and take it to the local dealer.
Typical isues here in Canada. A couple years ago, I dropped off my atv at the local and largest Honda atv dealer for a valve adjust. Took 10 days. That was a rush. John Deere lawn mower stopped running. Again, local dealer. 2 weeks for a carb rebuild. My espresso maker took 4 weeks for maintenance. He had the parts in stock.
Here dealers challenge you for test drives. Even for daily drivers. I think it is a Canadian quirk. I might just go 997.2 and take it to the local dealer.
02-06-2018, 07:49 PM
#5
Rennlist Member
Price seems high. When I saw a post about “low mileage,” I was expecting something in the 20,000 mike range or lower.
I bought my 99 for $17,600 and it had 48,000 miles on it in December 2016.
I bought my 99 for $17,600 and it had 48,000 miles on it in December 2016.
02-06-2018, 07:56 PM
#6
That seems high for a 2000. I bought my '99 from the same place 10yrs ago for 27k (mind you it had 100k I'm on it too). World fine doesnt like to negotiate much on their price unfortunately...although who knows, It is February and they might be hungry.
Come over to the Canadian section...there you will hear about lots of garages in the GTA east West or North that will work on a 996 and do a PPI.
Come over to the Canadian section...there you will hear about lots of garages in the GTA east West or North that will work on a 996 and do a PPI.
02-06-2018, 08:47 PM
#7
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
That seems high for a 2000. I bought my '99 from the same place 10yrs ago for 27k (mind you it had 100k I'm on it too). World fine doesnt like to negotiate much on their price unfortunately...although who knows, It is February and they might be hungry.
Come over to the Canadian section...there you will hear about lots of garages in the GTA east West or North that will work on a 996 and do a PPI.
Come over to the Canadian section...there you will hear about lots of garages in the GTA east West or North that will work on a 996 and do a PPI.
Any west end recommendations for a ppi? Wife has challenged me to buy a 911 this year. She doesn’t even drive. Lol.
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02-06-2018, 08:58 PM
#8
Rennlist Member
If you go to WFC speak to Patrick he is a good guy to deal with. Older gentleman that has been in car sales forever. They are negotiable on their prices so don't take the asking price at face value.
For PPI take it north of the city to Auto select in Newmarket they have a really good reputation.
For PPI take it north of the city to Auto select in Newmarket they have a really good reputation.
02-07-2018, 09:39 AM
#10
Rennlist Member
I have heard good things about both Keltech and Zorotech, although I have never used them. I went to GTEK once because I bought my car in Toronto and they were knowledgeable, but very expensive and missed putting some parts back on when doing the 60K service. They tried to tell me the IMS on my '99 had a much larger risk of failure than it appears to be and said the bearings on older cars blow all the time due to their age.
Anyways.. I use Auguste LeCourt (Auguste Automobile Services). He is in St. Catherines and is absolutely lovely to deal with. He is very honest and has a lot of experience with these cars. There are a few Porsche collectors here in Hamilton who swear by him and have been using him as long as he has been in Canada. I highly recommend searching him up if you are willing to make the trip!
Anyways.. I use Auguste LeCourt (Auguste Automobile Services). He is in St. Catherines and is absolutely lovely to deal with. He is very honest and has a lot of experience with these cars. There are a few Porsche collectors here in Hamilton who swear by him and have been using him as long as he has been in Canada. I highly recommend searching him up if you are willing to make the trip!
02-07-2018, 09:57 AM
#11
For maintenance you can use Oakville auto import at Winston Churchill and royal Windsor- Carlos used to do all the work on my 944. My 996 only goes to Ernie at Mantis in Oakville. They've done everything on my 996 including my IMS retrofit.
02-07-2018, 10:47 AM
#12
Rennlist Member
Is it possible to buy a car in the states and drive it back?
Honestly, that car is nearly $10,000 more than what you can here in the states (example here:https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...aff=share_text), or you can spend $26k and get a car with 1/3 of the mileage (example here:https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...aff=share_text)
I sold a 911 to a Canadian about 12 years ago. He just drove it on up from a Chicago. He enjoyed the troublefree (yet blizzard conditions) drive home.
Down here in a Chicago, there are so many 996s to choose from. I would work with someone here on Rennlist to go and check out a car for you remotely if you are interested in one. Then if it looks good, flights are cheap and you can buy the car after you have test driven it yourself. Yes, it can be a hassle, but the money you save and can defer for repairs will be worth it.
BTW, the black 911 there is from the same family of dealers I bought my car from, and I can tell you, they were great to work with, honest, and I’ve had no issues with my car. Folks that say you will spend $25,000 on a car no matter if you buy it for $17k and put $8k into it, or just Buy the $25k car and not have to put anything into don’t understand that sometimes the price of the car doesn’t have much to do with the condition of the car.
Pricing is Primarily based on what a car brings at auction, which is typically between $11-$13k at auction. Then, market data is collected from dozens of sources and run through a computer, comparing statistics with year, color, Coupe vs Cab, manual vs automatic, climate, geographic region, demand, average time to sell, etc. So the reason a high priced car is priced high has very little to do with the condition of the vehicle.
Honestly, that car is nearly $10,000 more than what you can here in the states (example here:https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...aff=share_text), or you can spend $26k and get a car with 1/3 of the mileage (example here:https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...aff=share_text)
I sold a 911 to a Canadian about 12 years ago. He just drove it on up from a Chicago. He enjoyed the troublefree (yet blizzard conditions) drive home.
Down here in a Chicago, there are so many 996s to choose from. I would work with someone here on Rennlist to go and check out a car for you remotely if you are interested in one. Then if it looks good, flights are cheap and you can buy the car after you have test driven it yourself. Yes, it can be a hassle, but the money you save and can defer for repairs will be worth it.
BTW, the black 911 there is from the same family of dealers I bought my car from, and I can tell you, they were great to work with, honest, and I’ve had no issues with my car. Folks that say you will spend $25,000 on a car no matter if you buy it for $17k and put $8k into it, or just Buy the $25k car and not have to put anything into don’t understand that sometimes the price of the car doesn’t have much to do with the condition of the car.
Pricing is Primarily based on what a car brings at auction, which is typically between $11-$13k at auction. Then, market data is collected from dozens of sources and run through a computer, comparing statistics with year, color, Coupe vs Cab, manual vs automatic, climate, geographic region, demand, average time to sell, etc. So the reason a high priced car is priced high has very little to do with the condition of the vehicle.
Last edited by Mike Murphy; 02-07-2018 at 11:06 AM.
02-07-2018, 12:15 PM
#13
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Although purchasing in the U.S. is less expensive overall, there are a number of hoops to jump through.
1. 13% when importing the car. Essentially, that is the sales tax.
2. Strict rules about all the paperwork required. Must fax the paper to the border, 72 hours before importing vehicle. Spend hours at the border going through the paperwork.
3. Insurance and registration. Most guys end up trailering cars back as this is a gray area.
4. Since the car is not 25 years old, there are a bunch of other modifications to be made to the car. Must install a daylight running module so lights are on during the day. Have to get air back stickers that are both English and French.
5. Car has to be inspected by a chain that is called "Canadian Tire." This includes a full safety check plus emissions testing.
So as you can see, the $20K US
+ $2600 tax
+ $600 US Flight, hotel
+ $500 for DRL and stickers
So now real world costs are up to $23600. I have not included certification (what if car needs safety work: oil leaks, brakes, suspension etc.), emissions - test is free, remediation is not. Then there is the inspection. So, between my time for a current, less than 25 year old car, not sure going to the U.S. is of great monetary benefit. It is of course beneficial that there is so much more selection.
1. 13% when importing the car. Essentially, that is the sales tax.
2. Strict rules about all the paperwork required. Must fax the paper to the border, 72 hours before importing vehicle. Spend hours at the border going through the paperwork.
3. Insurance and registration. Most guys end up trailering cars back as this is a gray area.
4. Since the car is not 25 years old, there are a bunch of other modifications to be made to the car. Must install a daylight running module so lights are on during the day. Have to get air back stickers that are both English and French.
5. Car has to be inspected by a chain that is called "Canadian Tire." This includes a full safety check plus emissions testing.
So as you can see, the $20K US
+ $2600 tax
+ $600 US Flight, hotel
+ $500 for DRL and stickers
So now real world costs are up to $23600. I have not included certification (what if car needs safety work: oil leaks, brakes, suspension etc.), emissions - test is free, remediation is not. Then there is the inspection. So, between my time for a current, less than 25 year old car, not sure going to the U.S. is of great monetary benefit. It is of course beneficial that there is so much more selection.
02-07-2018, 12:50 PM
#14
Drifting
Don't you have to pay tax either way? Or is there additional tax because you bought it in the US?
02-07-2018, 01:22 PM
#15
Rennlist Member
The sales tax is the same either way. Lets look at the one car on Cars.com 79,000 miles for $20,950 (say negotiated down to $19k):
Price (CDN) $23,843
Import tax (6.1%) 1,454
RIV fee 195
AC tax 100
Inspection 500 (at least, maybe car needs work)
Travel 600
Totals to $26,192. Say he can get the car ar WFC for 29k CDN. For $2800 more, he gets a car with almost half the miles, no hoops to jump through, no time off work, probably a bit of warranty, and on the road ready to go. I wheel and deal cars alot and other then the USA having a massive inventory and selection, the numbers just don't work. That's why there are literally hundreds of Canadian pickup trucks every week being exported to the USA right now.
Price (CDN) $23,843
Import tax (6.1%) 1,454
RIV fee 195
AC tax 100
Inspection 500 (at least, maybe car needs work)
Travel 600
Totals to $26,192. Say he can get the car ar WFC for 29k CDN. For $2800 more, he gets a car with almost half the miles, no hoops to jump through, no time off work, probably a bit of warranty, and on the road ready to go. I wheel and deal cars alot and other then the USA having a massive inventory and selection, the numbers just don't work. That's why there are literally hundreds of Canadian pickup trucks every week being exported to the USA right now.