Blowing smoke on start up! HELP please
03-19-2013, 09:45 AM
#46
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Hi everyone. I have a low mileage car I drive regular meaning - usually once or twice a month 100 -250 miles monthly - no problems or smoke on start up before. Then I let the car sit for 2-3 months and finally on start up quite a bit of smoke came out. I was setting the radio code and thought the rear window was fogging up but in fact it was smoke (I was in a dark enclosed garage and realized I might irritate my neighbors or set off a fire alarm so I got the heck out of there.) I may have let it idle for 3-4 minutes. It seemed to continue to smoke until I got it out on the freeway and warmed up. (sorry neighbors)
Like I said I've never had this problem before let alone any small amounts of smoke. Porsche filters. No oil in under tray. Can I safely assume this was smoke from oil settling in the cylinders? I need to reread some info but worn valve guides don't cause smoke like this do they?
I returned 45mins later and there was still smoke in the garage :-/ Doah!
Like I said I've never had this problem before let alone any small amounts of smoke. Porsche filters. No oil in under tray. Can I safely assume this was smoke from oil settling in the cylinders? I need to reread some info but worn valve guides don't cause smoke like this do they?
I returned 45mins later and there was still smoke in the garage :-/ Doah!
UMW's oil line check valves will help you here, too. Something to think about.
In the future, prior to starting your car after a 2-3 month sit, you could drain the two turbo oil tank sumps (one on each turbo) and then pull your DME fuel pump relay and crank the engine for a few seconds. Put the relay back in, and fire the engine.
As another tip, set up your smart phone to video the tail pipes, so you can see exactly what is coming out of your exhaust on cold start-up. Then you'll see what side smokes, the delay, and stuff like that.
03-19-2013, 09:58 AM
#47
Race Director
I'd say this is more from letting the car sit 2-3 months. Confirm that you are using OEM Porsche oil filters and properly torqued, proper oil level, proper oil viscosity, and etc.
UMW's oil line check valves will help you here, too. Something to think about.
In the future, prior to starting your car after a 2-3 month sit, you could drain the two turbo oil tank sumps (one on each turbo) and then pull your DME fuel pump relay and crank the engine for a few seconds. Put the relay back in, and fire the engine.
As another tip, set up your smart phone to video the tail pipes, so you can see exactly what is coming out of your exhaust on cold start-up. Then you'll see what side smokes, the delay, and stuff like that.
UMW's oil line check valves will help you here, too. Something to think about.
In the future, prior to starting your car after a 2-3 month sit, you could drain the two turbo oil tank sumps (one on each turbo) and then pull your DME fuel pump relay and crank the engine for a few seconds. Put the relay back in, and fire the engine.
As another tip, set up your smart phone to video the tail pipes, so you can see exactly what is coming out of your exhaust on cold start-up. Then you'll see what side smokes, the delay, and stuff like that.
my advice, drive the thing more often.
03-19-2013, 10:25 AM
#48
Pro
+1 on the UMW Check valves! I recently started my car after 1-2 months on the trickle charger and not even a puff on startup. Porsche filters, do not overfill etc etc
03-19-2013, 10:29 AM
#49
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PiB993, try to use a battery maintainer in your garage if you can (maybe you don't have access to an electrical outlet in a public space) so you don't have to reset your radio code and keep the battery healthy.
03-19-2013, 01:48 PM
#50
Rennlist Member
Thanks guys. I will look into those things. UWM check valves - have not looked into that so I will now. Yeah battery had positive terminal disconnected during the no use period. Braille lithium started right up. We just don't have an outlet in our common area garage for a trickle charger (need to convince neighbors for a building upgrade). The radio code is really easy to put in but I should have just hit the road immediately - readyness codes for smog that would/will be an issue for sure though.
03-25-2013, 08:53 AM
#51
Burning Brakes
I had this problem too and a strange similarity was present as well. I installed Fister mufflers. Now that defies all logic that changing out the muffler to a lower back pressure style would cause/contribute to this smoking but there is some oddball correlation there.
I did quite a few things in diagnosis too. Parking the car with the rear raised helped. The turbos are sucking oil into them at rest when the valve in the oil filer is inadequate, or even just on too tight. That was the majority of the problem I installed a new Porsche filer (small one, that's always the culpret, the big monster isn't the cause) and hand tightened it, put motorcycle oil in it, and it stopped completely.
But yes something about the mufflers I'm convinced freaks our cars out. Makes absolutely no mechanical or physical sense but there is something.....
Also keep the oil level at about equal to or less than half, the more oil in there the more that valve in the oil filter has to work to keep it back.
I think you said it mysteriously stopped and that's good but smoke more than a puff at start up will destroy your turbo chargers. Puddles under your exhaust is bad, very bad, its actually probably coming from the turbos where the exhaust header connects to the turbo itself; that will be wet with oil. You must stop that from continuing.
1. Porsche filer (lil one, big one doesn't really matter)
2. Porsche filer installed correctly with light torque
3. to mitigate park on ramps with rear inclined (this is just mitigation until you resolve it, your just using gravity to fight suction, it's shocking how well this works, keeps turbo dry and happy til fixed properly)
4. oil level at half or less
5. motor cycle oil (I think it's 20/50 Mobil 1, but don't quote me, could get away with Valvoline too, it's the weight your after)
6. if 1-5 fail buy check valves
7. do 1-6 or kiss turbos goodbye
I did quite a few things in diagnosis too. Parking the car with the rear raised helped. The turbos are sucking oil into them at rest when the valve in the oil filer is inadequate, or even just on too tight. That was the majority of the problem I installed a new Porsche filer (small one, that's always the culpret, the big monster isn't the cause) and hand tightened it, put motorcycle oil in it, and it stopped completely.
But yes something about the mufflers I'm convinced freaks our cars out. Makes absolutely no mechanical or physical sense but there is something.....
Also keep the oil level at about equal to or less than half, the more oil in there the more that valve in the oil filter has to work to keep it back.
I think you said it mysteriously stopped and that's good but smoke more than a puff at start up will destroy your turbo chargers. Puddles under your exhaust is bad, very bad, its actually probably coming from the turbos where the exhaust header connects to the turbo itself; that will be wet with oil. You must stop that from continuing.
1. Porsche filer (lil one, big one doesn't really matter)
2. Porsche filer installed correctly with light torque
3. to mitigate park on ramps with rear inclined (this is just mitigation until you resolve it, your just using gravity to fight suction, it's shocking how well this works, keeps turbo dry and happy til fixed properly)
4. oil level at half or less
5. motor cycle oil (I think it's 20/50 Mobil 1, but don't quote me, could get away with Valvoline too, it's the weight your after)
6. if 1-5 fail buy check valves
7. do 1-6 or kiss turbos goodbye
Last edited by Ridin Dirty; 03-25-2013 at 09:28 AM.
03-26-2013, 09:06 PM
#53
I fortunately didn't have any smoke this year. On the advice of kevin I let the turbo sumps drain during storage, to the tune of two pie tins full of oil on the drivers side. I ordered the lines from him weeks ago and just had them installed today at Dan Jacobs, great guy and he said they've been dealing with the issue for years and the lines are the only thing that he felt really solves the problem. Take that for what its worth, just passing it along.
On the plus side, while doing the oil lines I upgraded the mufflers as you need to remove them to get to the lines, Fister's units in black, great sound, so worth it.
On the plus side, while doing the oil lines I upgraded the mufflers as you need to remove them to get to the lines, Fister's units in black, great sound, so worth it.
04-14-2013, 11:55 AM
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04-14-2013, 02:04 PM
#56
Burning Brakes
Agreed fix! Always fix. BUT stabilize the patient first. In the time whilst all are pondering what to do and what course of action to take those those turbos are swimming in oil and quite pissed off. Bad!
As far as ramp height not quite sure I used 6" ramps. But the higher the better I believe. Just gravity 101; even 4" is better than flat. This may all out stop the smoking and thus stop damage to the turbos but it's just a mitigation still gotta fix it; hope its just oil filter, level, or weight, if not then its check valve time.
Joe
As far as ramp height not quite sure I used 6" ramps. But the higher the better I believe. Just gravity 101; even 4" is better than flat. This may all out stop the smoking and thus stop damage to the turbos but it's just a mitigation still gotta fix it; hope its just oil filter, level, or weight, if not then its check valve time.
Joe
04-14-2013, 03:25 PM
#57
Rennlist Member
Hasn't been smoking. Just following advice given to me by UMW over the phone - great guy! I'm looking at ramps on jegs. Ramp height is a bit of a quandary for me - I live in a condo with other cars and I park at an angle. I can't always reverse in so the front wheels will probably have to drive over the ramps. The layout of the parking garage would be too long winded to describe but makes ramp placement critical so I get MAXIMUM space from my neighbors cars on each side (I kid I kid . . . a bit).
With the engine tray removed and some reasonable ramps maybe I can get to where I can drain the turbo sumps too?
With the engine tray removed and some reasonable ramps maybe I can get to where I can drain the turbo sumps too?
04-16-2013, 12:29 PM
#58
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i had the same smoking issueon left side:
i took it to the dealer and they identified the caskets on that side needed replacing plus the chain cover casket. The oil drip was not much on the floor but you could see under pressure some oil had sprayed over the exhaust pipe on the left side of the car hence the smoke (usually visible coming out of the left rear tire-well).
04-16-2013, 03:22 PM
#59
Rennlist Member
I actually have a weeping cam chain cover gasket left side back of engine too! So that's not an engine out fix? I thought I had/have a pretty pristine car until I saw some oil around the bottom of the cam chain cover. While I had never looked down there until my big smoke day after not driving for a few months - I'm a bit concerned my mech may have over filled. Interesting. I tried taking a pic with the phone but it's a pita.
04-16-2013, 04:13 PM
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i took it to the dealer and they identified the caskets on that side needed replacing plus the chain cover casket. The oil drip was not much on the floor but you could see under pressure some oil had sprayed over the exhaust pipe on the left side of the car hence the smoke (usually visible coming out of the left rear tire-well).
I actually have a weeping cam chain cover gasket left side back of engine too! So that's not an engine out fix? I thought I had/have a pretty pristine car until I saw some oil around the bottom of the cam chain cover. While I had never looked down there until my big smoke day after not driving for a few months - I'm a bit concerned my mech may have over filled. Interesting. I tried taking a pic with the phone but it's a pita.
Lower valve covers and gaskets is no BIG deal. Routine maintenance. Mine were done recently. Both side. Engine in place. About $500ish. OEM parts. Yes, I went with the plastic OEM parts. Not billets. Heck, the first set lasted +15 years. I expect to get another +15 out of this set.
Cam Chain Cover Gasket- is a BIGGER deal. More $$$. And I think it's engine out.