boostid

I've searched and read everything in the forum on Smoking from Exhaust on 993TT cars.

I have a 31k mile 97TT. I've owned since 23K and haven't abused car and haven't shut down turbos while they're hot. Don't know what happened first 23k miles.

I had 30k service last June, including oil change and both filters. In November (5 months later), right side exhaust started smoking on cold startups and small drips of oil from left side turbo area.

Took to dealer in December. They cleaned intercooler and intake manifold. Changed oil and large filter. They said smoking and drips were caused by overfilling at previous oil change in June. This didn't make sense to me, since it took 5 months for smoking/oil drips to start.

Anyway, no smoke or drips after December cleanup/oil change until 5th or 6th cold startup when smoking out right side and left side drips started again. I'm guessing left side turbo seal. Smoke lasts over 5 minutes, then seems to fade away.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks

Hal
97TT (Arena/Cashmere, SRDs, RUF19s, PSS9 & RS Sways

viperbob

OK, this is too odd. I removed another Rennlist members, Hal M, turbos with 30K miles last week as it had similar symptoms. Indeed it turned out to be the seals on the turbos caused by excess heat from not idling for a period of time at shut down. Here are some photos of the shaft with carbon deposits and the seals. This caused a HUGE amount of leakage into the intake pipe on the turbo and the exhaust (and dripping from the wastegate rods). So there was a long period of burnoff of the oil in the exhaust at startup. You might just jack the car up and remove the hard plastic pipe going into the turbo. If oil starts coming out, then you should take it somewhere very soon for repair. The odd thing is, this problem does not get better. When it goes bad, it doesn't really go away....

Good luck..









A word of caution... Once this happens, you may start seeing the turbo body exhaust side start looking white on the outside. This is due to the oil actually burning in the turbo. Also, this oil can come out the turbo and into that catalytic converter. A lot of oil and a hot cat can potentially cause a fire inside, so I would get these repaired ASAP. It is a big job, so be prepared to spend a fair amount of money, but continuing to drive it like this will only cost more money.....

J-McDonald

Hal - Since you're in California, you may want to try getting the dealership to cover the repair under the exhaust system warranty (the turbos are technically part of the exhaust system and there is a special extended warranty on exhaust parts for CA-market Porsches) - other Rennlisters have been succesful in doing this. Good luck!

Jeff 993TT

I've had my dealer change my turbos. But it didn't really help. I think that I'm just going to spring for the k16/k24 upgrade in the near future. I'm actually waiting until viperbob and Kevin get a shop together and that'll be very convienent.

If you do plan on getting the dealer to change it, do it soon. The 7 year limit has probably just passed or is very close to expiring.

Also, this page may also be helpful: http://www.993faq.com/archives/cat_engine.html#000310

boostid

Thanks for your responses. Viperbob-- I'll bet you my turbos look just like that. Makes you think the turbos should be pulled and checked on PPIs. I wish I had done that.

Car is going to dealer on Jan 19. They're booked till then (P-car repairs must be epidemic). Till then, TT will sit in my garage awaiting it's exam. Question is: Do I upgrade the Turbos, etc. and go down that $$road, or leave it stock? If I were to go to K16 hybrids, new ECU Software, etc., would car pass smog? How about CELs? I really don't want to create any more problems. I've always thought of this car as bullet-proof, now I'm getting nervous. What's next: Secondary air injection CEL?
Thanks Again,

By the way, went to LA Auto Show last Wednesday. It would have been so much better if Carrera GT display had that V-10 engine noise blasting on surround sound. Got invited behind the wall to check out the Aston Martin DB9. Probably one of the most beautiful cars I've ever seen. Only $160k.

Hal
97TT (Arena/Cashmere, SRDs, RUF19s, PSS9 & RS Sways)

Ruf-Racer

boostid you have a PM!

Jeff 993TT

If you are going to rebuild the turbos, I'd just do the k16/k24 hybrid anyways. I don't think you'd have any probelms with smog, cels. And you can upgrade the ECU to take advantage of the new turbos later. However, the stock ecu should work just fine, but maybe not optimally.

boostid

Hey guys;

I'm the one that initiated this thread. Here's the latest:

First of all, thanks for all of your help on this issue. In attempting to follow Jeff's advise first, I had the small oil filter replaced first. That was about 4 weeks ago. I've driven the car about a dozen times, each from a cold start, and have had no more smoking. Jeff's advise in the archives was very helpful in that before replacing any turbos, etc. , try the small oil filter first.

In talking to my wrenches, they had installed a Mahle small filter at prior oil change (30k service). They said they had gone to the Mahle from the Porsche factory filters because they were having so much trouble with the factory filters leaking as soon as they were installed and had to sometimes install 2 or 3 before getting one that didn't leak immediately. I've also heard that some factory filters have started leaking 4 or 5 months after installation. So it seems there are problems with the Mahle and factory small filters. Sometimes I want to return to the days of my old RS America with one big filter.

Another interesting effect from going to the Porsche factory filter is that the car is now running cooler. I noticed that after the Mahle filter was installed at the 30k service, the car seemed to run hotter, at or just above the 8 o'clock line on the oil temp gage, whereas before the Mahle filter (it previously had Porsche factory filter), it ran just below the 8 o'clock mark. Now with the factory small filter, it again runs below the 8 o'clock mark. This is driving down the road/freeway. Go figure. Maybe some oil flow restriction in the filter or rubber check valve in the Mahle filter? In looking at the two filters, they are configured very different where the oil passes through the bottom. Different number of holes and different sized holes.

Anyway, hopefully this is the end of my smoking story, though it seems many people seem to solve the problem, only to have it return sometime later. Why is it that this car had no filter problems for it's first 7 years, and now it's an issue? Was it luck or can't anybody make an oil filter anymore? Oh yeah I'm going to return to 15/50 MobilOne instead of the current 0/40 next oil change.

Thanks again for everyone's suggestions and interest. Looks like I'll be keeping an eye on the rear view mirror whenever I start it

Hal Olson

Jeff 993TT

Glad to see that simple fix worked. Even gladder ( is that a real word?? ) that you didn't have to needlessly replace your turbos..

Dick in TN

The leaking Porsche filter problem described by Hal's mechanics and given as the reason for switching to Mahle sounds unique to this particular shop. I would question if they know what they are doing. I've had my TT for seven years and do the annual oil/filter changesmyself, never a problem. I suppose it could happen but more likely to be over/under tightening, less likely a filter defect IMO.

I learned the lesson to just use Porsche parts on such stuff as filters and belts the first time I changed belts. Not having a local dealer and thinking being a low tech item that a belt is a belt as long as the size is correct I installed a non Porsche belt. Well it stretched on me (the first time I thought that maybe all new belts could stretch a little), I went through a couple of tightening cycles before replacing it with one fom a dealer.