Low vs high mileage 993 and maintenance?
07-11-2017, 03:31 PM
#16
As the owner of a high mileage 993 I can unequivocally say that if you are looking for the most driving pleasure for your dollar, go for the higher mileage example. At 130k miles, my car drives better than new. Any high mileage car, that's in great shape, will have had a ton of money put into it over the years. Money that you don't have to spend because a previous owner did.
You win twice. First because the purchase price is lower. Second because expensive maintenance items are already taken care of. I'd argue that just over 100k miles is the sweet spot for a driver 993. Almost guaranteed to have the important stuff taken care of and purchase price will be 40k +/- 5k.
Be sure that all the important maintenance has been done:
- Plugs, wires, distributors
- Lifter cartridges
- Suspension refreshed (shocks plus all rubber)
- Clutch and DMF checked, replaced if necessary
- Steering rack checked, resealed if necessary
- Good schedule for all fluids (clutch, brakes, transmission, engine oil)
- Oil burn rate is better than 1qt per 1k miles, and/or top end rebuild completed
Nice to have:
- Door straps fixed
- Windshields sealed
- Paint and trim refresh
- Engine and transmission mounts
- Short shift kit
- Varioram vacuum components tested/replaced
- Fan refreshed, fan hub replaced
- Alternator and starter replaced
- Brake discs and lines replaced
This is a long list and if the previous owner hasn't already done it, its going to be on you. Much of this is time vs. miles related so I believe you are far better getting a high mileage car with all this work done rather than a low mileage car with it all pending. Best case would be a low mileage car with everything done, but that's rare and very expensive.
These cars are put together so very well that they feel tight and great to drive for many hundreds of thousands of miles. They are built to such a high standard of quality that you can think of them more like light airplanes than cars, they will keep going as long as you keep on top of your maintenance schedule.
I can't wait to see what mine feels like at 300k
.
You win twice. First because the purchase price is lower. Second because expensive maintenance items are already taken care of. I'd argue that just over 100k miles is the sweet spot for a driver 993. Almost guaranteed to have the important stuff taken care of and purchase price will be 40k +/- 5k.
Be sure that all the important maintenance has been done:
- Plugs, wires, distributors
- Lifter cartridges
- Suspension refreshed (shocks plus all rubber)
- Clutch and DMF checked, replaced if necessary
- Steering rack checked, resealed if necessary
- Good schedule for all fluids (clutch, brakes, transmission, engine oil)
- Oil burn rate is better than 1qt per 1k miles, and/or top end rebuild completed
Nice to have:
- Door straps fixed
- Windshields sealed
- Paint and trim refresh
- Engine and transmission mounts
- Short shift kit
- Varioram vacuum components tested/replaced
- Fan refreshed, fan hub replaced
- Alternator and starter replaced
- Brake discs and lines replaced
This is a long list and if the previous owner hasn't already done it, its going to be on you. Much of this is time vs. miles related so I believe you are far better getting a high mileage car with all this work done rather than a low mileage car with it all pending. Best case would be a low mileage car with everything done, but that's rare and very expensive.
These cars are put together so very well that they feel tight and great to drive for many hundreds of thousands of miles. They are built to such a high standard of quality that you can think of them more like light airplanes than cars, they will keep going as long as you keep on top of your maintenance schedule.
I can't wait to see what mine feels like at 300k
.As an owner of a high-mileage car, I will concur with what others have already said here, particularly about the "PPI, no exceptions" part. To throw in with other anecdotal evidence, my '95 has around 165k miles or so, clearly driven daily, was formerly tracked by me, and always well maintained but always driven with gusto. Barring the normal wear items (particularly rubber, esp in suspension areas), it feels as tight and strong today as when I got it in 2001. And uses ~1qt oil in ~5000 miles (and there's a minor drip stain on my garage floor so this isn't even fully "consumption") ...and this BTW is a general indication of top-end health so check the PO's records if available. Properly cared for, these are robust machines, better than most as evidenced by their strength and reliability as they accumulate years and miles!
FWIW, I must have lost perspective on this notion of what constitutes "high-mileage." Our cars are from the mid-latter 90s ...that's old for a car, by anyone's standards! So 85k to me is not what I'd call "high mileage" given expected use; I'd call that medium or average. Under 50k for a car of our years starts to sound like "low mileage" ...again, all things taken into perspective. Just IMHO and has no bearing on anything, mind you...simply meandering with my cup o joe this morning
Best o luck to the OP!!
Edward
FWIW, I must have lost perspective on this notion of what constitutes "high-mileage." Our cars are from the mid-latter 90s ...that's old for a car, by anyone's standards! So 85k to me is not what I'd call "high mileage" given expected use; I'd call that medium or average. Under 50k for a car of our years starts to sound like "low mileage" ...again, all things taken into perspective. Just IMHO and has no bearing on anything, mind you...simply meandering with my cup o joe this morning
Best o luck to the OP!!
Edward
Just wanted to chime in and say this thread has been really helpful, appreciate all the comments and opinions written. Looking at an example with 122k miles now that seems to be really promising. Will use Tlaloc's list in conjunction with a thorough PPI to set myself up for a great purchase either now or down the road for my 993.
07-11-2017, 03:35 PM
#17
Have had several high mileage 993's. Current one is the 8th 993 purchased in the past 12 years and it just passed 190K miles.
Every car you look at will have something it needs either immediately or in the near future.
As others have already said, maintenance history is the single most important factor. No records? Expect the worse but don't eliminate the car without some research.
While it goes without saying, the most under estimated reliability factor in buying one of these cars is the seller. If the seller has had the car for some time, there is no one better than him/her to give you the details you need. A good seller will disclose everything both good and not so good and make things right if something shows up unexpectedly after the sale. Have a close look at the Rennlist community, with some of these true enthusiasts here, I've purchased cars sight unseen with no reservation.
Barring detailed records, a PPI is important, but only if you can find someone who is very familiar with 993's. Search here for a resource in your area.
But buyer beware even with a PPI report. Have had glowing reports come back on cars that needed lots of work and and reports indicating the car needed several thousand in repairs that were mechanically sound. Educate yourself on how to do a basic inspection even before you hire someone to do a detailed one.
Good luck!
Every car you look at will have something it needs either immediately or in the near future.
As others have already said, maintenance history is the single most important factor. No records? Expect the worse but don't eliminate the car without some research.
While it goes without saying, the most under estimated reliability factor in buying one of these cars is the seller. If the seller has had the car for some time, there is no one better than him/her to give you the details you need. A good seller will disclose everything both good and not so good and make things right if something shows up unexpectedly after the sale. Have a close look at the Rennlist community, with some of these true enthusiasts here, I've purchased cars sight unseen with no reservation.
Barring detailed records, a PPI is important, but only if you can find someone who is very familiar with 993's. Search here for a resource in your area.
But buyer beware even with a PPI report. Have had glowing reports come back on cars that needed lots of work and and reports indicating the car needed several thousand in repairs that were mechanically sound. Educate yourself on how to do a basic inspection even before you hire someone to do a detailed one.
Good luck!
07-11-2017, 04:36 PM
#18
Three Wheelin'
I agree that a ppi can be of limited usefulness. If you can get a 993 wizard, like SteveW, to inspect then you will learn a lot. Unfortunately most inspections aren't worth the paper they are printed on.
I think that the best way to buy is based on the quality of the seller and maintenance performed coupled with your own inspection to verify condition along with a drive to determine how the car feels.
Buying from a rennlister with good records is best. Buying from a dealer with no records is worst.
I think that the best way to buy is based on the quality of the seller and maintenance performed coupled with your own inspection to verify condition along with a drive to determine how the car feels.
Buying from a rennlister with good records is best. Buying from a dealer with no records is worst.
07-11-2017, 06:44 PM
#19
For the record, I did buy a low mileage, one owner car and I'm already $8k or $9k into updates & maintenance with maybe another $4k to go before it's properly sorted.
Something I definitely did not anticipate. Probably could have saved half of that in labor if I wasn't so lazy.
07-12-2017, 12:38 AM
#20
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Yeah, I believe the OP referenced a NB.
For the record, I did buy a low mileage, one owner car and I'm already $8k or $9k into updates & maintenance with maybe another $4k to go before it's properly sorted.
Something I definitely did not anticipate. Probably could have saved half of that in labor if I wasn't so lazy.
For the record, I did buy a low mileage, one owner car and I'm already $8k or $9k into updates & maintenance with maybe another $4k to go before it's properly sorted.
Something I definitely did not anticipate. Probably could have saved half of that in labor if I wasn't so lazy.
07-12-2017, 04:10 AM
#21
No worries Dave, ultimately none of it matters because I plan to be buried in this car, mostly just to irritate my children. To the best of my knowledge this 993 sat garaged for about 7 years before I bought it.
Now that you've made me pull these records out of my safe, I'm kind of curious about what I've actually spent in the last nine months. Pick from it what you like.
Transport from CA - $850
Detail + replace rear OEM emblem & stone guards w/ Xpel - $950
Replace/flush fuel/fuel cap gasket/fix horns/flush accumulator, brakes & clutch/new battery & hold downs/clear hydro-locked cylinder #5/order missing wheel key - $1200
Install F&R hood shocks, shroud rubber/radio fuse/check maintainer operation - $542
Bilstein HD shocks/struts, repair toe link & tie rod assembly - $3488
Pirelli's - $900
Install new sway bar link/RF wheel bearing & wheel carrier + KT alignment - $1747 (dealer)
Still to do:
Replace cab top rear window - $900
Valve cover gasket & chain housing cover - $1673 (dealer)
Front end clear bra to the a-frame - ~$750
Replace missing OEM cover boot - $1500
Leak down & compression -
Now that you've made me pull these records out of my safe, I'm kind of curious about what I've actually spent in the last nine months. Pick from it what you like.
Transport from CA - $850
Detail + replace rear OEM emblem & stone guards w/ Xpel - $950
Replace/flush fuel/fuel cap gasket/fix horns/flush accumulator, brakes & clutch/new battery & hold downs/clear hydro-locked cylinder #5/order missing wheel key - $1200
Install F&R hood shocks, shroud rubber/radio fuse/check maintainer operation - $542
Bilstein HD shocks/struts, repair toe link & tie rod assembly - $3488
Pirelli's - $900
Install new sway bar link/RF wheel bearing & wheel carrier + KT alignment - $1747 (dealer)
Still to do:
Replace cab top rear window - $900
Valve cover gasket & chain housing cover - $1673 (dealer)
Front end clear bra to the a-frame - ~$750
Replace missing OEM cover boot - $1500
Leak down & compression -
07-12-2017, 08:56 AM
#22
Rennlist Member
Also do your homework on the 993 and what to look for. Go see and drive the car. Way too many people purchase "sight unseen" that will be a costly mistake rest assured.
07-12-2017, 11:40 PM
#23
Instructor
Low mileage is over rated.
An extra $22,000 will pay for quite a bit of maintenance, upgrades, etc... It's probably enough to cover a full engine rebuild.
Since you plan on actually driving it, the higher mileage car seems a much better deal.
Or, if price is not an issue, pick the one that is the color you like best. After all you have to like and enjoy the car. They are great fun!
Choice of two is a nice problem to have...
An extra $22,000 will pay for quite a bit of maintenance, upgrades, etc... It's probably enough to cover a full engine rebuild.
Since you plan on actually driving it, the higher mileage car seems a much better deal.
Or, if price is not an issue, pick the one that is the color you like best. After all you have to like and enjoy the car. They are great fun!
Choice of two is a nice problem to have...
