porsche993356911

I own a 993 2 S , live in Australia and would like to replicate a Fister Stage 11 exhaust muffler only because FD Motorsports are unable to supply Cores without using mine plus I would like to keep my origional Bischoff"s. All this makes the cost of conversion plus shipping backwards and forwards to the US prohibitive. Locally I can purchase two used Bischoff's mufflers and have them converted by installing the by pass pipe but does anyone know what internal baffling if any is also removed when they set up a Fister Stage 11 ? I have seen some internal shots of the Bischoff origionals that look quite involved. I am wrapped in the Fister sound but caught between a rock and hard place.

stace

Exactly what Darin does to mufflers is his proprietary technique and out of respect for the great service FD provides I doubt anyone would share his secrets even if they knew. That said you should search LPMM or Leyland Pate muffler mod on Rennlist . It's a simple bypass pipe that sounds pretty good for very little investment. Not Fister but second best. Let us know how it turns out!

gt3'er

I'd suggest contacting Darin again and ask to get on a waitlist for a pair of Stage II's. When I was in his shop a few months ago, there were many sets of mufflers laying about - surely at some point he'll have a set he can ship to you...

Good choice - I'm very happy with mine.

nine9six

This has come up before, and there is nothing propritary in what Darin does to the mufflers. I think Leland Pate may have been the originator.

u7t2p7

Post a WTB here for a set of Fister 2's. They become available as many upgrade to 3's and others return their stock mufflers when selling the car. I bet you score a set rather quickly.

JB 911

With the 1's, sure, but the 2's and 3's are Darins doing they both have internal mods.

Buy a set state side, have them ship to Darin and Darin to you. 2's are worth the wait!

stace

This ^^^^ is my understanding. LPMM is strictly a by-pass - some variation on the diameter of the bypass pipe. But Leland's design never cut open the cans and modified the internals the way Darin does. Regardless, Fisters are a really great mod for these cars. LPMM is just an alternative...

bobbyp

^^This is the answer.

Keep an eye on the parts for sale section, they come up once a month or so.

nine9six

JB,
The word "proprietary" has legal connotations that I do not believe apply to what Darin does to the mufflers.

Any fabricator can cut open a set of stock mufflers, II's, and III's, note the internal modifications and build and sell his own. I wouldnt call em Fisters though.

There would be a patent # on the mufflers if they were protected.

PROPRIETARY
1: one that possesses, owns, or holds exclusive right to something; specifically : proprietor

2: something that is used, produced, or marketed under exclusive legal right of the inventor or maker; specifically : a drug (as a patent medicine) that is protected by secrecy, patent, or copyright against free competition as to name, product, composition, or process of manufacture

3: a business secretly owned by and run as a cover for an intelligence organization

JB 911

perhaps not but I still think most of this community would frown on anyone who cut theirs open and posted pictures of the mods.

nine9six

. JB, nobody suggested such a thing!

I was simply replying to the comment left by stance, which for some reason, you seem to co-sign to regarding the mod being a "proprietary" process; which its not.

porsche993356911

Thanks for all your comments and assistance guys, certainly am I not looking to start up here in opposition to Darin. I shall simply have my fabricator insert a by pass pipe and try it like that. I am sure it will sound a whole lot better !!

Kika

I believe Darin's process is his intellectual property, whether or not he has patent rights is a separate issue. Since it is his, it should be considered proprietary, in my mind at least. I'm not a lawyer, so I could be wrong

Certainly it is unethical for someone to cut open one of the Fister mufflers and post them publicly. It may not be illegal, but I'm sure Darin would not be pleased.

I hope that Fister has applied for patent to their designs and rightfully and legally owns what is theirs.

nine9six

Unfortunately, words like, "I believe" and "should be", have no bite in what we're discussing here.

I like and I own a set of Fister stage II's, and I would hope Darin has secured his industrial property rights, but only through the legal process is he protected.

I am curious as to why would you even suggest cutting open a set and posting publically?!?

Here is a doc which gives a quick rundown on this topic. It uses words like patent, and trademark...

Ethics, seems like a word of myth and heresay in the US these days...But I agree, in my head it would be unethical; unfortunately, a dollar seems to trump ethics all day long and twice on Sunday. I'd rather be safe and protected, than sorry...In the bedroom as well as the area of industrial property!

Allen

Like many have suggested...why not simply find a used Stage II or an original muffler that you can supply to Darin for the conversion....shouldn't be that difficult. I have the Stage II mufflers...you will love them.

Regardless of the legal/illegal/proprietary/whatever stance involved...I think it would be wrong to cut open and publically post the internals/methods of Fister mufflers. Certainly something does not have to be illegal to be wrong.