Air Conditioning Repair ... HELP !
09-01-2012, 10:55 AM
#16
Racer
If you ever need or want I have a sniffer and can rule out evaporator or expansion valve by inserting it into pollen filter area or by expansion valve to figure that part out.
LMK...I'm in Laguna Beach area...
LMK...I'm in Laguna Beach area...
05-06-2014, 11:49 PM
#17
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Air Conditioning repair
I am writing here to provide you enough information so you can make the right decision when you choosing an air conditioning repair company to repair your system.People forget about Air conditioners until there is a problem with it. Air conditioners need regular inspections for the ducks and other useful parts which may get damages in years.Air Conditioning Repair Portland list average air conditioning repair prices, give you a guide to fix your air conditioning unit yourself and give you a detailed list of what to ask every air conditioning repair company.
09-10-2014, 11:41 AM
#21
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First, I want to thank Rlisters who have written on the topic of A/C failure. Mine stopped working earlier this summer and I decided to troubleshoot it myself as several other odd things were happening.... I've now solve the problem, will report what I found, and suggest that others may find the same thing if they look....something a dealer or repair shop is not likely to find.
Background, this is an early 993, 120k, daily driver unless there is salt/ice/snow. A bit rough around the edges from daily use and lots of track miles (I'm a former red grouper), but well-cared for. New engine harness installed per Porsche recall years ago, and that's significant to the story.
Two years ago the A/C compressor was replaced and system charged by a local well-respected Porsche-specialty shop (not dealer).
Last year on an evening drive my wife (with an excellent olfactory sense) smelled burning wires. Then I saw smoke coming from the rear deck. Stop the car, there is a small fire on the wiring, R side of engine. Easily extinguished, so I disconnected the battery and had the car towed to the same shop. Mechanic at the Porsche dealer who did the recall swap was not careful and there was an abrasion that exposed something electrically hot and not fused. Somehow that didn't surprise me, and I pursued it no further, I just wanted my car fixed and returned to me.... It took a couple of weeks but they located a replacement harness and installed it, there was no other evident damage. New harness is not specific to the older 993, and has lots of extra unused plugs on it. Nevertheless, car runs great, all systems go, but the engine fan seems more prominent on shut down that before.
Over the course of the summer I notice the A/C won't switch on, not even the compressor. L front fender fan cycles on and off, high speed. Fog lights stop working, replace the fuse they seem fine. But then they stop working again. One day I noticed I had no backup lights. This is all in the span of about a week. So I start researching, and find this thread, and others.
What wasn't evident from my web research is that these three systems are related. While my spidey-sense told me that one fault has to underly all these problems, this was a mystery.
First I replaced the resistors under the front fenders. Then I discovered the wrong plug had been connected to the engine fan. Now two problems are solved, the engine fan operates as expected, I have heat if needed, but no A/C (compressor won't switch on), no reverse lamps, and fog lights that keep blowing fuse #14.
All relays up front and in back removed and tested, both control and controlled sides offer minimal resistance and control properly controls controlled side with 12v, quick on and quick off. I can find no shorts in topside visible wiring nor by circuit testing from relay sockets. 12v is delivered where it should be except to the A/C compressor relay in the back, and R31 relay (fog lamps) up front (I didn't pull the reverse lamp relay in the rear). No power. Replace Fuse 14 and both have power.....hmmm. Start the car....critically I don't move it....and I have fog lights, I have A/C and I have reverse lamps (ignition on, car in reverse but engine off). What the......???!!!?? Back the car out of the garage and I now have no fog lamps, no reverse lamps and no A/C.
Wow. I have to find wiring diagram. Which I did, don't ask how. But I did. Turns out that even though relay R01 is labeled "fog lamp" what it really is, is the "key on" logic device for the A/C, the fog lamps, and the reverse lamps (and DRLs in Canada). And the power side (circuit 30) of R01 is fed by fuse 14 ("fog lamps). All three circuits, fog, reverse and A/C depend on 12V delivered through the control side of R01 via Fuse 14 (fog lamps depend on the controlled side of R01.). And my problem is dependent on moving the car. Re-Check everything topside, nothing is loose.
Climb under the car and take down the tray under the gearbox and find the reverse lamp switch, R-hand side of the gearbox. Wires look OK, one is a little loose. Clean them up, test the switch, all OK and the wires show 12v with a new Fuse 14, ignition on. Plug the wires in, and reverse lamps turn on. Start checking the course of the wiring harness to that switch........it's part of the engine harness and at the last replacement, Fritz at Der Reputable Repair Shop routed the wiring over the L side inner axle connection. Where it could lay against it and eventually get abraded. And eventually get just enough insulation abraded off that when the car moved/suspension flexed, the power side of that circuit found a quick ground on the CV housing. Fuse 14 blows, I lose fogs, reverse lamps and A/C compressor, bammo.
I did the following:
1. repaired/reinstalled the wiring and reinstalled WELL AWAY from the axle.
2. Buttoned up the wiring and took the car for a long test drive.....I've now got reliable A/C, Fog and reverse lamps. Fans come on as they're supposed to.
3. Write a letter to this Regional Shop of Reputation.....installing a wiring harness is not Porsche-specific. It's just plain mechanic's sense. Hooking up the wrong plug to the engine fan seems to be a not-rare problem with the wiring harness swap (so I've read on Rlist) but a little check of the color coding could have prevented that. Draping a part of the wiring harness over a rotating member is just sloppy work that any mechanic should know to be careful of, especially somebody trusted with Porsches.
Moral of the story; if you followed this story, my guess is that you've got mechanical skills equal or better to the mug working in the repair shop. While I'm pretty happy I figured this out and could fix it myself, what the real story is, is that I wasted several hours of my time due to sloppy work in a high-profile local shop, and had I taken it back to them (or any other shop) for repair my guess is that I would have bought a new CCU and an A/C recharge (at the minimum) before the true cause was found. How disappointing.
The only good news is, I've had a lot of cars and prefer to service/repair them myself when I can. Everytime I take a critical look at the 993, I am impressed how well it is built. Much of its layout and construction clearly derives from endurance racing practice. Can't say that about other makes, not at all. These things, all the socioeconomic/demographic stuff aside, really are little gems built to be used. Seeing all of that again during this project was just cool, and that's good.
Background, this is an early 993, 120k, daily driver unless there is salt/ice/snow. A bit rough around the edges from daily use and lots of track miles (I'm a former red grouper), but well-cared for. New engine harness installed per Porsche recall years ago, and that's significant to the story.
Two years ago the A/C compressor was replaced and system charged by a local well-respected Porsche-specialty shop (not dealer).
Last year on an evening drive my wife (with an excellent olfactory sense) smelled burning wires. Then I saw smoke coming from the rear deck. Stop the car, there is a small fire on the wiring, R side of engine. Easily extinguished, so I disconnected the battery and had the car towed to the same shop. Mechanic at the Porsche dealer who did the recall swap was not careful and there was an abrasion that exposed something electrically hot and not fused. Somehow that didn't surprise me, and I pursued it no further, I just wanted my car fixed and returned to me.... It took a couple of weeks but they located a replacement harness and installed it, there was no other evident damage. New harness is not specific to the older 993, and has lots of extra unused plugs on it. Nevertheless, car runs great, all systems go, but the engine fan seems more prominent on shut down that before.
Over the course of the summer I notice the A/C won't switch on, not even the compressor. L front fender fan cycles on and off, high speed. Fog lights stop working, replace the fuse they seem fine. But then they stop working again. One day I noticed I had no backup lights. This is all in the span of about a week. So I start researching, and find this thread, and others.
What wasn't evident from my web research is that these three systems are related. While my spidey-sense told me that one fault has to underly all these problems, this was a mystery.
First I replaced the resistors under the front fenders. Then I discovered the wrong plug had been connected to the engine fan. Now two problems are solved, the engine fan operates as expected, I have heat if needed, but no A/C (compressor won't switch on), no reverse lamps, and fog lights that keep blowing fuse #14.
All relays up front and in back removed and tested, both control and controlled sides offer minimal resistance and control properly controls controlled side with 12v, quick on and quick off. I can find no shorts in topside visible wiring nor by circuit testing from relay sockets. 12v is delivered where it should be except to the A/C compressor relay in the back, and R31 relay (fog lamps) up front (I didn't pull the reverse lamp relay in the rear). No power. Replace Fuse 14 and both have power.....hmmm. Start the car....critically I don't move it....and I have fog lights, I have A/C and I have reverse lamps (ignition on, car in reverse but engine off). What the......???!!!?? Back the car out of the garage and I now have no fog lamps, no reverse lamps and no A/C.
Wow. I have to find wiring diagram. Which I did, don't ask how. But I did. Turns out that even though relay R01 is labeled "fog lamp" what it really is, is the "key on" logic device for the A/C, the fog lamps, and the reverse lamps (and DRLs in Canada). And the power side (circuit 30) of R01 is fed by fuse 14 ("fog lamps). All three circuits, fog, reverse and A/C depend on 12V delivered through the control side of R01 via Fuse 14 (fog lamps depend on the controlled side of R01.). And my problem is dependent on moving the car. Re-Check everything topside, nothing is loose.
Climb under the car and take down the tray under the gearbox and find the reverse lamp switch, R-hand side of the gearbox. Wires look OK, one is a little loose. Clean them up, test the switch, all OK and the wires show 12v with a new Fuse 14, ignition on. Plug the wires in, and reverse lamps turn on. Start checking the course of the wiring harness to that switch........it's part of the engine harness and at the last replacement, Fritz at Der Reputable Repair Shop routed the wiring over the L side inner axle connection. Where it could lay against it and eventually get abraded. And eventually get just enough insulation abraded off that when the car moved/suspension flexed, the power side of that circuit found a quick ground on the CV housing. Fuse 14 blows, I lose fogs, reverse lamps and A/C compressor, bammo.
I did the following:
1. repaired/reinstalled the wiring and reinstalled WELL AWAY from the axle.
2. Buttoned up the wiring and took the car for a long test drive.....I've now got reliable A/C, Fog and reverse lamps. Fans come on as they're supposed to.
3. Write a letter to this Regional Shop of Reputation.....installing a wiring harness is not Porsche-specific. It's just plain mechanic's sense. Hooking up the wrong plug to the engine fan seems to be a not-rare problem with the wiring harness swap (so I've read on Rlist) but a little check of the color coding could have prevented that. Draping a part of the wiring harness over a rotating member is just sloppy work that any mechanic should know to be careful of, especially somebody trusted with Porsches.
Moral of the story; if you followed this story, my guess is that you've got mechanical skills equal or better to the mug working in the repair shop. While I'm pretty happy I figured this out and could fix it myself, what the real story is, is that I wasted several hours of my time due to sloppy work in a high-profile local shop, and had I taken it back to them (or any other shop) for repair my guess is that I would have bought a new CCU and an A/C recharge (at the minimum) before the true cause was found. How disappointing.
The only good news is, I've had a lot of cars and prefer to service/repair them myself when I can. Everytime I take a critical look at the 993, I am impressed how well it is built. Much of its layout and construction clearly derives from endurance racing practice. Can't say that about other makes, not at all. These things, all the socioeconomic/demographic stuff aside, really are little gems built to be used. Seeing all of that again during this project was just cool, and that's good.
09-10-2014, 11:53 AM
#22
Rennlist Member
Nice troubleshooting. Agreed, stinks about the sloppy routing costing you hours of tracking it down. Btw, welcome to rl and how about a pic of your car???
03-18-2016, 03:01 AM
#25
03-18-2016, 03:02 AM
#26
Cleaning your air conditioner is something you can do on your own, provided you have a basic understanding of the parts of the unit. But any time you need to address the coolant, you need the help of Air conditioning repair Cypress If you've already done some basic troubleshooting and the problem still exists, you need to call them
04-02-2016, 03:54 AM
#27
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Join Date: Apr 2016
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Most common Air Conditioner failures at our garage are condenser leaks, either through corrosion or stone(etc) impact damage.
05-04-2016, 09:51 AM
#30
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Looks like you solved your problem,
For others who believe they are facing an evaporator replacement:
First of all I would try recharging the system with a WalMart $20 recharge kit and see if it solves your problem and for how long. If it lasts a couple of years I would just recharge as needed and be done with it. Disturbing the entire firewall and all its parts and wires on a 20 year old car may introduce unintended other issues you may not anticipate.
I would think the fool proof way to verify the leak is in the evaporator without taking your car apart is to put the UV florescent dye containing coolant in the system, pull the CCU out of the dash and shine a black light behind it through the recirculating air vent behind it directly onto the evaporator coil and see if it phosphoresces. If a shop does this they should have a video scope on hand to fully inspect the coil through the vent. If not I think Harbor Freight has an inexpensive one or you can McGuiver one from back up camera parts on eBay. I would also think you could slip a wire with a cotton patch on the end through the same vent and check for oil on the bottom of the evaporator as if it is leaking I would think some of the oil in the coolant would leak out as well.
Whatever you decide to do have the technician tell you specifically what he did to diagnose that the most expensive part to replace in the system must be replaced. If he didn't do the UV dye test, a common procedure, he is just guessing with your wallet.
The evaporator may be covered with what looks like dirt and mold, this does not mean it is leaking.
Andy
For others who believe they are facing an evaporator replacement:
First of all I would try recharging the system with a WalMart $20 recharge kit and see if it solves your problem and for how long. If it lasts a couple of years I would just recharge as needed and be done with it. Disturbing the entire firewall and all its parts and wires on a 20 year old car may introduce unintended other issues you may not anticipate.
I would think the fool proof way to verify the leak is in the evaporator without taking your car apart is to put the UV florescent dye containing coolant in the system, pull the CCU out of the dash and shine a black light behind it through the recirculating air vent behind it directly onto the evaporator coil and see if it phosphoresces. If a shop does this they should have a video scope on hand to fully inspect the coil through the vent. If not I think Harbor Freight has an inexpensive one or you can McGuiver one from back up camera parts on eBay. I would also think you could slip a wire with a cotton patch on the end through the same vent and check for oil on the bottom of the evaporator as if it is leaking I would think some of the oil in the coolant would leak out as well.
Whatever you decide to do have the technician tell you specifically what he did to diagnose that the most expensive part to replace in the system must be replaced. If he didn't do the UV dye test, a common procedure, he is just guessing with your wallet.
The evaporator may be covered with what looks like dirt and mold, this does not mean it is leaking.
Andy