quasr

Greetings guys (and gals).. I purchased my 993 ('95) a couple of months ago and am not entirely happy with the way it shifts. I always give it that pregnant pause between shifts but as of lately am noticing more and more that I am not synchronizing properly when going into the gears, especially third gear. While installing the clutch are upgrade, I had the clutch master and slave cylinder replaced and bled by the local dealer, thinking the clutch was just not disengaging entirely. I am also noticing when I come to a stop I have having to pretty much pull it out of gear under protest (just a little anyways). My total disengage point is on the floor. When I am starting out the engage point is about mid pedal if that makes sense. Between gears I am having to go all the way to the floor. I had another car that was manual shift and when the clutch went bad there was slippage when I really gave it the gas. My 993 has no slippage that I can tell.

Hopefully this describes my situation as well as possible. Would replacing the clutch remedy any or all of the symptoms? Thanks.

quasr

One caveat is that I also drained the transmission and replaced the oil with Mobil 1 80 weight transmission oil. Thanks.

ed devinney

Sounds like clutch time. Is the pedal effort rather high?

quasr

I would not say it is light. It was certainly lighter after the clutch are upgrade. Forgot what they called it. The olive drab colored addition. Gee, only 58k but second owner...

ed devinney

My car had 35k when I got it and had already seen a new clutch! I put one in at 40k but don't expect to do it again for a long time. I think you need it replaced.

axl911

1. Your slave still needs bleeding.
2. The cable to your slave cylinder is leaking/bad and needs replacing.
3. Maybe you need to re-adjust the clutch stop on the floorboard. It's set too high.

quasr

Axl,

I don't think it is the bleeding issue as the dealership uses a compressed air system to bleed the clutch. Also don't think it is the clutch adjustment as my foot is almost through the floor when all the way down. Thanks though. Will have a good mechanic drive the car and give me his/her (would like to see this one) opinion.

Marlon

I would think that the clutch would not "all of a sudden go from bad to worse" following dealer actions if executed correctly, unless the mechanics did something not-quite-right. I took my 3.2 to a reputable mechaninc for 'clutch adjustment' a couple years ago and they had it so dorked up it was laughable. When I discussed it with them they insisted that the adjustment was 'correct' based on a "free play" figure indicated in the Porsche manual. I finally got them to put it back to 'about' where it had been before and the car clutched and shifted perfectly. My guess is that the original job was not executed properly. In Naval Aviation maintenance, we pilots would sometimes mutter, "theres never time to do it right the first time, but theres always time to get it right the second time", or something like that.

J.PELLEGRINO

It sounds like the clutch is not fully disengaging causing the input shaft to "drag". This is why it does not come out of gear correctly. This needs to be remedied or you will surely damage the gearbox. When you pull the shifter out of gear and the lever is resistant, you are causing very high stress loads on the tips (leading points) of the dog teeth. They are not designed to take that kind of load. The operating sleeve needs to be fully engaged over the entire dog tooth to transmit the drive load safely. I hope that makes sense, good luck, Jerry

Garth S

+1 .... one cause of this is the clutch disc dragging on the splines of the trans input shaft when the release bearing/pressure plate is 'pushed' to disengage; were this the case, the disc remains in partial contact with either the pressure plate of flywheel - net effect the same .... tough on syncros, etc.
A seized pilot bearing can also do the same, for the crank and input shaft turn at the same speed with clutch engaged: when disengaged, the pilot bearing spins to allow their speed differential = smooth shifting ... not so if the bearing is on the way out.

quasr

Today I visited the dealership and a competent mechanic drove my car with me riding shotgun. I will say today my 993 was not demonstrating the symptoms and of course when the mechanic drove, it shifted perfectly. The mechanic's diagnosis was, don't mess with it, it shifts fine. Later this afternoon when I was driving home from work the same problem I first described began occurring again. Not entirely sure at this point but will check with two recommended local mechanics prices on a clutch change. I will also have seals and anything else within reach replaced while the transmission is out.

Does an intermittent problem give anyone a clue to my woes? Thanks for all the input. Great bunch of guys!

Toddimus

I think I'm having the early stages of the symptoms you're talking about, quasr. I'm leaning toward the clutch disk hanging on poorly greased input shaft splines theory for my car. I had read previous posts like this


The only real symptom my car has is: when I'm putting the clutch in while I'm still rolling and taking it out of gear, the clutch seems to not fully disengage. Usually this is coming out of 2nd as I roll to a stop. It feels like the clutch is hanging a bit, and it's the speed differential between the engine and drivetrain that actually causes the clutch disk to release from the flywheel (or pressure plate?). It's like there's some adhesive on one of the sides of the disk. I know it's not that, but that's what it feels like. Just before it breaks free, you can feel and hear the lash of the drivetrain make a snap to the other end of its free travel. That can't be good for the CV joints either!

About 18 months ago, the previous owner had the "RS LWF & HD clutch kit" installed at a reputable indie shop. They were supposed to be all factory parts, and one would suppose that the shop has done the work well. Since I don't think I need to buy any expensive parts, and labor's free (at least in dollars)...

My plan of attack is to try bleeding the clutch hydraulics (along with the brakes) when I do my brake job. I'll also replace the gear oil, Mobilube 75W-90 Delvac (the SHC replacement from Lufteknic). If that doesn't work, I guess I'm left with replacing the slave cylinder. If none of that works, it's time to open her up to investigate. Drop the engine/tranny and do a bunch of other stuff while I'm there.

Cheers, eh?

Robin 993DX

I have seem this symptom before to be caused by an improperly (or lack of) greased spline (input shaft), basically the clutch does not float freely on the spline to disengage and gets worst as with rust build up.

Typically this happens gradually after a clutch replacement if they forgot or used the wrong lubricant.

Another tell tail sign is that while in 1st gear on a cold start up even when the clutch pedal is all the way in the car jumps forward ever slightly on start up.

Prolong effect of this can cause major transmission wear and gear replacement.

quasr

Thanks Robin. Though I believe my clutch to be original, I have had the symptom you described once, it creaping forward in 1st gear with the clutch in. Time to R/R the clutch. Any suggestions on other items that should be replaced such as seals while in for repairs? Thanks.

Robin 993DX

If I would have to guess, it is a rust issue that you are dealing with on the spline. While you are at it, clutch, pressure plate, ck flywheel condition, rear main seal. Depending on if they are dropping the motor to do the clutch change or not (if yes, then PS belt).