smithk993

I have plowed through what seems to be hundreds of posts on suspension upgrades and still am confused!

My requirements might go something like this:

1. Current bone stock US spec sits to TALL! I want to lower around 1" while minimizing potential for scraping.
2. Current shocks at 50k miles probably need replacement/upgrade and want better overall handling without being bounced from my seat. Daily driver with 2-3 DE's / year.
3. Want to keep cost manageable!

I'm getting really confused with the options. I thought I wanted to go with the Bilstein HD and HR spring and keep stock sways. Gert has package for around $1200. But then I read posts that talk about that setup not lowering enough or the shock threads not having enough threads.

Questions:

1. With the above setup, what is the approximate lowering to expect? CARNEWAL site shows: 1" - 1 1/2". Do I need any special shock mounts/perch to achieve this?

2. Would I be displeased with leaving stock sways with this setup? Could I later add stiffer bars without ripping out the suspension and doing realignment. I'm guessing the stiffer sway bars would only show up on track.

3. Other option is ROW M030 and bilstein HD. But it is shown to only lower car 2/5" - 3/4"? That doesn't seem like much? Cost's much more at $1800 (includes sway bars)

Sorry for the repeat, but I've searched until I'm totally confused!

DC from Cape Cod

If it helps....my understanding was that both the H&R springs and the (similar drop) Eibach springs are a good match with the HD Bilstein shocks.

I have the Eibachs with stock shocks now (and RS sways) and Gert recommended the HD Bilsteins as what I needed to complete my suspension setup.

hn

Regarding on your #3 option (used to be mine, too). FYI, it's not a perfect straight forward set up. From what I've read, you can't get the front to ROW height and the back, the shocks are a bit too long for the springs and may cause some problem when the car is lifted. The front issue can be taken care of by some custome work and for the rear's some people say it shouldn't cause any problem but some people still secure the shocks with wires.

Terry Adams

Considering the few DEs you do, and not wanting to spend too much, I would think that a reading of <a href="http://p-car.com/susfaq.html" target="_blank">Robin's suspension faq</a> would lead you to the RoW M030/Bilstein HD. Talk to Gert about the Hergesheimer collar to get the front ride height correct. I am not sure if the collar causes eligibility problems in DEs. Those of us who have done this suspension get lowering of 1" to 1.25"'. The larger sway bars F and R do make a handling difference. I am very satisfied.

Robert Henriksen

I understand your pain/confusion; I'll ditto what Terry said.

Mdrury

I'll second that! For your proposed level of DE's a properly installed ROW030 setup ( with sways ) should keep you happy. Undoubtedly you COULD benefit from PSS9 adjustability, but I'm just too dumb ( or lazy ) to deal with adjusting the settings. Still , personal choice innit?

Cheers <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />

993chaz

Keith, i am also going down the suspension road/dilemna!!

I have spoken to gert on numerous occassions, seems the best set up for me 95% street 5% track possibly, but more concerned in getting my car to the correct eye appealing height is the RoWMO30. The kit is available for 1795 euros. This is the way I'm going.

0.02 <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" />

smithk993

Chaz,

Care to elaborate on the pure ROW M030 vs the less expensive H&R with Bilstein HD's. What were some of the Gert comments that led you down that path?

Thanks.

993chaz

Keith, my bad. What I meant to say was the H&R springs with the Bilsteins.

Both the Euro M030 with factory shocks and the H&R with Bilstein HD will lower the car by 1".

The life of the factory shcoks with the M030 will be limited to 3-4 years or 30k-50k.

The only dis-advantage to the H&R with HD shocks is that apparently the springs are softer. Also it is aftermarket equipment.

I spoke with Gert, he has the H&R with Bilstein HD shocks and is very happy with the set up.

Mark in Hermosa

I went with the M030 with HD's on the cab. I, however, was not happy with the ride height. Mark and Hergesheimer fabricated collars to bring the fronts down to RoW level. I had learned about these collars thru Viken and asked about the necessity for the collars on the rears. As he pointed out, and I noticed 10 minutes later, you can adjust the rears all the way down as there is plenty of thread available.

I plan on taking that setup off of the cab and onto the coupe and installing something a bit more aggressive on the cab as it will be 95% track/ 5% street.

Robin's susp. faq helped me tremendously in making my decision. The hd's w/ the m030's is a great solution.

Harold

I went with the ROW M030 (springs and sways) with Bilstein HD's. Given that I was not concerned about lowering the car (indeed, I wanted to keep the car as close to stock ride height as possible to avoid any clearance problems), this was a wonderful set up for me.

Body roll has diminished considerably, handling is wonderful and progressive and the ride is not excessively hard. The small problems about the rear shock being too long for the springs on my car were easily cured with a bit of wire....

Terry Adams

Harold, being in Singapore, is your car not already at RoW ride height?

officemanager

Just went through the same fiasco for the last 3 weeks. In the end, since I do not track the car [C4Cab] and it constitutes a daily driver I followed the advise of 2 dealers and 2 pro tuners in the NYC area and went for RoW M030 with heavy sways and Bilsteins after really laboring over that or P9's.

I'm so happy with the handling I cannot tell you. I'm down 3/4 of an inch which now seems perfect... I bought the parts as recommended up and down this site from Gert and they were in my hands in 2 days from placing the order...

If you want to lower the car and keep a comfortable ride you should consider our lowered suspension kit : <a href="http://www.carnewal-europe.com/cpx_p93105.htm" target="_blank">http://www.carnewal-europe.com/cpx_p93105.htm</a>

The prices on the website that include shipping actually include the freight cost to the USA.

The price for the lowered suspension is 1695 Euro shipping to the US included.

If you don't want to lower that much and are looking for a sportier ride than you should check out the Euro M030 kit with HD shocks : <a href="http://www.carnewal-europe.com/cpx_p93090.htm" target="_blank">http://www.carnewal-europe.com/cpx_p93090.htm</a>


Unless you track these are really the only two options to clutter your mind with...

johnfm

I just had H&R with Bilstein on my 964. The lack of thread on hte shock body do limit both ride height adjustibility & corner balancing - BUT these are not big concerns for mainly road cars.

The progressive spring softness, IMO, is fantastic - the ride is more comfortable, yet overall the car feels much tighter at speed and seems to take steering instruction much better too.

Just my 0.02

johnfm

ANy details on the Hergsheimer Collar - I expect this is like the Dopke spring perch is it - a re-designed collar which allows the spring to sit lower on the strut body??

Details anyone??