I'm considering my first 993...newbie questions within!
#1
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I'm considering my first 993...newbie questions within!
Hey guys,
Having only owned water cooled Porsche 911s (2001 996 TT previously and 2010 997.2 GT3 RS currently), I'm definitely an air cooled newbie with plenty of dumb questions. My first driving experiences with 911s were G body cars from the late 1970s and mid 1980s, but I've never owned any. I feel like my time is coming and so I want to be educated and ready!
I'm mostly curious about evaluating 993 versus 964, but my gut tells me the 993 is the right choice for me as it's the final evolution of the air cooled experience...and I do prize at least a bit of civility. I haven't driven a 964 in many years and I've never driven a 993 at all, so I know that ultimately driving both is the right thing for me to do...and would likely clarify what I need/want to do. Regarding 993s though, I need a bit of help with these things:
1. OBD1 versus OBD2? I would have thought Varioram would be a desirable thing, but it seems many prefer the 1995 model. Could anyone tell me why?
2. Am I really going to have a hard time finding a car with black interior? Sure seems like so many 993s have gray or blue or tan interiors, which do not appeal to me personally.
3. Any 'must have' factory options to look for?
4. Any significant things that I should watch out for, meaning specific to this model? I will have any car subjected to a proper PPI before buying of course.
5. Is the 6MT that these cars come with a fairly robust unit? I hear a lot about the G50 gearbox, but not much about this 95-98 transmission.
Any good threads like this that would help me, I'd really appreciate links as I'll happily read all day long about them. I want my first air-cooled ownership to be everything I'm hoping for, and thus don't mind putting in the time to do the research first.
Thanks guys/gals!
Having only owned water cooled Porsche 911s (2001 996 TT previously and 2010 997.2 GT3 RS currently), I'm definitely an air cooled newbie with plenty of dumb questions. My first driving experiences with 911s were G body cars from the late 1970s and mid 1980s, but I've never owned any. I feel like my time is coming and so I want to be educated and ready!
I'm mostly curious about evaluating 993 versus 964, but my gut tells me the 993 is the right choice for me as it's the final evolution of the air cooled experience...and I do prize at least a bit of civility. I haven't driven a 964 in many years and I've never driven a 993 at all, so I know that ultimately driving both is the right thing for me to do...and would likely clarify what I need/want to do. Regarding 993s though, I need a bit of help with these things:
1. OBD1 versus OBD2? I would have thought Varioram would be a desirable thing, but it seems many prefer the 1995 model. Could anyone tell me why?
2. Am I really going to have a hard time finding a car with black interior? Sure seems like so many 993s have gray or blue or tan interiors, which do not appeal to me personally.
3. Any 'must have' factory options to look for?
4. Any significant things that I should watch out for, meaning specific to this model? I will have any car subjected to a proper PPI before buying of course.
5. Is the 6MT that these cars come with a fairly robust unit? I hear a lot about the G50 gearbox, but not much about this 95-98 transmission.
Any good threads like this that would help me, I'd really appreciate links as I'll happily read all day long about them. I want my first air-cooled ownership to be everything I'm hoping for, and thus don't mind putting in the time to do the research first.
Thanks guys/gals!
#2
Steve,
If I may, I'd like to suggest you peruse the "stickies" above the respective forums for the 993 and 964 models...
There's plenty of helpful information for those who know what they're looking for and you sound like that kind of guy.
Enjoy the learning process... it's a wonderful part of the fun!
Cheers!
There's plenty of helpful information for those who know what they're looking for and you sound like that kind of guy.
Enjoy the learning process... it's a wonderful part of the fun!
Cheers!
#4
Racer
Impressive list of cars Steve. I always forget about those stickies. I recently got a 993 after having a G50 911 and a 991. I went with the 993 because I wanted the last of the air cooled....and don't really care for the 964. I'm just learning the car but from my research, the OBD1/2 I think is primarily the secondary air injector (SAI) issue. I've read all have the issue but OBD2 cars throw a code and get a check engine light (CEL) that has to cleared to pass smog. Here's a thread on it https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-look-for.html
I wanted a v-ram car so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I don't get a CEL. My car had the code around 30k and fixed so we'll see.
I'm with you on the black interior. I had a hard time finding black interior. I was primarily looking for polar silver and most had grey or blue. I found an Arctic Silver with black interior. Depending on what exterior color you're looking for, black may be difficult to find.
I wanted LSD as an option but I've read it's probably toast after 45-50k anyway but still a good option to have on the car in my opinion. There were some aluminum / leather or aluminum / carbon interior options that would be nice since the parts are NLA and crazy expensive used. The shift **** is weighted and has a nicer shape than mushroom cap. I found a shift **** but am still looking for a ebrake handle. Search 993 aluminum/leather and you'll get some info.
The 993 seems to have a potential for rust at the bottom corners of the windshield. I've read it could be from having the windshield replaced improperly but not sure if that's the only cause. Google search 993 windshield rust for some info
AC evaporator seems like a weak point in the system. I've read it's a significant job and requires removal of the gas tank.
No tranny issues that I've read about. I think everything after the 915 has been pretty solid.
Good luck in the search. Depending on what you're looking for, the right 993 may take a while to track down.
Also, I'm jealous of your location. My job relocated from WA to CA three years ago. We can't wait to be back in the NW.
I wanted a v-ram car so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I don't get a CEL. My car had the code around 30k and fixed so we'll see.
I'm with you on the black interior. I had a hard time finding black interior. I was primarily looking for polar silver and most had grey or blue. I found an Arctic Silver with black interior. Depending on what exterior color you're looking for, black may be difficult to find.
I wanted LSD as an option but I've read it's probably toast after 45-50k anyway but still a good option to have on the car in my opinion. There were some aluminum / leather or aluminum / carbon interior options that would be nice since the parts are NLA and crazy expensive used. The shift **** is weighted and has a nicer shape than mushroom cap. I found a shift **** but am still looking for a ebrake handle. Search 993 aluminum/leather and you'll get some info.
The 993 seems to have a potential for rust at the bottom corners of the windshield. I've read it could be from having the windshield replaced improperly but not sure if that's the only cause. Google search 993 windshield rust for some info
AC evaporator seems like a weak point in the system. I've read it's a significant job and requires removal of the gas tank.
No tranny issues that I've read about. I think everything after the 915 has been pretty solid.
Good luck in the search. Depending on what you're looking for, the right 993 may take a while to track down.
Also, I'm jealous of your location. My job relocated from WA to CA three years ago. We can't wait to be back in the NW.
#5
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Thank you for your very kind and thorough response Manual991! I do not have emission concerns so that was useful information about the OBD2 issue with the newer cars, I guess I might have suspected that. I would like the benefits of Varioram personally, but I say that in a very generic way as my GT3 RS has valve timing on both intake and exhaust side and drives like a much larger displacement engine than the previous 3.6L Mezger versions. I do hope you make it back to the PacNW one of these days, as it seems like the destination of choice for Californians lately...hahaha!
I hope you really enjoy your own newly acquired 993 and that it's everything you hoped for too.
I hope you really enjoy your own newly acquired 993 and that it's everything you hoped for too.
#7
Rennlist Member
Don't know anything about this car, but has a black interior:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...modelCode1=911
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...modelCode1=911
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#8
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
1. OBD1 versus OBD2? I would have thought Varioram would be a desirable thing, but it seems many prefer the 1995 model. Could anyone tell me why?
Varioram, 1996 and later, has better mid-range torque, feels like the car is breathing easier and wants to rev up.
Varioram engines are also OBDCII so they have 3 additional oxygen sensors and need to have the air injector system serviced from time to time. Many have a big dollar service, removing heads, done to clear the air passages. There is some question as to when and if this is necessary in some cases.
2. Am I really going to have a hard time finding a car with black interior? Sure seems like so many 993s have gray or blue or tan interiors, which do not appeal to me personally.
Black is quite common so you should be able to find one.
3. Any 'must have' factory options to look for?
These cars came with lots of stuff a base features. Some options are well liked like M030 sport suspension however on a 20-year-old car when replacing the struts reconfiguring the suspension is easy and regularly done to achieve a sport ride. Some like the hardback seats, again just a personal choice as the base seats are really nice.
4. Any significant things that I should watch out for, meaning specific to this model? I will have any car subjected to a proper PPI before buying of course.
Run the OBDC codes and have a Rennlist member who knows how the car should handle, shift and feel drive the example in question. My experience is that PPI only catches gross issues and misses a lot. A mechanic or a dealer may have agency reasons to miss things or simply fails to mention routine items you would not consider routine.
5. Is the 6MT that these cars come with a fairly robust unit? I hear a lot about the G50 gearbox, but not much about this 95-98 transmission.
The 993 uses a later evolution of the G50 design that has proven to be very robust, no abnormal service life issues.
On a 20 year old car I would focus on condition and that everything works properly. Buying from a fastidious PCA owner probably is a plus. Trying to sort through service records on a 20-year-old car may prove of limited value. If the car has over 80K miles on it look to see if the clutch has been replaced or inspected also look to see if the steering rack is leaking. If the car shifts as smoothly as a Toyota the synchros are probably fine if it grinds the transmission may need servicing. This is where the value of having a Rennlist 993 owner take a test drive brings value to the discussion. Just remember you are looking at 20-year-old cars so don't be surprised if something comes up shortly after your purchase.
Varioram, 1996 and later, has better mid-range torque, feels like the car is breathing easier and wants to rev up.
Varioram engines are also OBDCII so they have 3 additional oxygen sensors and need to have the air injector system serviced from time to time. Many have a big dollar service, removing heads, done to clear the air passages. There is some question as to when and if this is necessary in some cases.
2. Am I really going to have a hard time finding a car with black interior? Sure seems like so many 993s have gray or blue or tan interiors, which do not appeal to me personally.
Black is quite common so you should be able to find one.
3. Any 'must have' factory options to look for?
These cars came with lots of stuff a base features. Some options are well liked like M030 sport suspension however on a 20-year-old car when replacing the struts reconfiguring the suspension is easy and regularly done to achieve a sport ride. Some like the hardback seats, again just a personal choice as the base seats are really nice.
4. Any significant things that I should watch out for, meaning specific to this model? I will have any car subjected to a proper PPI before buying of course.
Run the OBDC codes and have a Rennlist member who knows how the car should handle, shift and feel drive the example in question. My experience is that PPI only catches gross issues and misses a lot. A mechanic or a dealer may have agency reasons to miss things or simply fails to mention routine items you would not consider routine.
5. Is the 6MT that these cars come with a fairly robust unit? I hear a lot about the G50 gearbox, but not much about this 95-98 transmission.
The 993 uses a later evolution of the G50 design that has proven to be very robust, no abnormal service life issues.
On a 20 year old car I would focus on condition and that everything works properly. Buying from a fastidious PCA owner probably is a plus. Trying to sort through service records on a 20-year-old car may prove of limited value. If the car has over 80K miles on it look to see if the clutch has been replaced or inspected also look to see if the steering rack is leaking. If the car shifts as smoothly as a Toyota the synchros are probably fine if it grinds the transmission may need servicing. This is where the value of having a Rennlist 993 owner take a test drive brings value to the discussion. Just remember you are looking at 20-year-old cars so don't be surprised if something comes up shortly after your purchase.
#9
Rennlist Member
Condition is everything. Buy the seller. PPI always! Leakdown & Compression Test.
#13
Three Wheelin'
Just a couple of thoughts. In your OBD 1 vs. OBD 2 decision, you should probably consider that the SAI problem that OBD 2 cars have is different from OBD 1 cars only in the sense that the CEL goes on. The underlying problems with the SAI clogging exists on both cars, but the OBD 1 cars don't throw a code. The code is a problem when you try to get the car smogged, but since you say smog isn't an issue for you, the difference might not matter too much either.
You also might want to consider that the valve guides used by Porsche in the 993 motor are sub-optimal and if they haven't been replaced, will likely at some point need to be replaced, an expensive proposition. Bad guides do not necessarily show up on a PPI/leakdown test so you may not know until after living with the car for a while.
You also might want to consider that the valve guides used by Porsche in the 993 motor are sub-optimal and if they haven't been replaced, will likely at some point need to be replaced, an expensive proposition. Bad guides do not necessarily show up on a PPI/leakdown test so you may not know until after living with the car for a while.
#14
Rennlist Member
(1) LSD Option - mine was still good at 110K miles
(2) 1995 - OBD1 and get a Rennsport Chip + LW flywheel & clutch. Perfect setup for a 993 IMHO
(3) Buy the seller. Good cars have good books. I spent 30K+ in M&S over my 17 years of ownership to maintain the car in pristine condition to 110K miles. That's typical of good care.
Enjoy the hunt!
cheers!
(2) 1995 - OBD1 and get a Rennsport Chip + LW flywheel & clutch. Perfect setup for a 993 IMHO
(3) Buy the seller. Good cars have good books. I spent 30K+ in M&S over my 17 years of ownership to maintain the car in pristine condition to 110K miles. That's typical of good care.
Enjoy the hunt!
cheers!
#15
Rennlist Member
Well. I wanted a wide body, so there's no choice with OBD1 or 2. I just did the SAI clean out last fall- it's a PIA, but not terribly hard if you have access to a lift. Things to watch out for include the driverack- these leak and are expensive to replace. I did mine last year for $ 2500 or so. I had 113K on the clock when I replaced it. As far as MUST have options- If you can get Litronic headlights that's a great upgrade. I think that was about a $ 2,000 option. You can do the HID upgrade very cheaply though and I'd say it's the best upgrade you can do.
Definitely buy the seller and get a PPI anyway. my PPI didn't show much and thankfully there wasn't any major issues, but these cars are 20+ years old so maintenance will be needed, but you'll love the 993. very cool little car and pretty darn reliable.
Definitely buy the seller and get a PPI anyway. my PPI didn't show much and thankfully there wasn't any major issues, but these cars are 20+ years old so maintenance will be needed, but you'll love the 993. very cool little car and pretty darn reliable.