MKW

My post was not very clear ...where I was basically saying I would rather be in a Suburban than a 911 in any type of passive collision esp head on with another Suburban . My comment about urban intersection collisions should have more clearly stated that if hit broadside by a speeding Suburban running a light comparing a big SUV vs a 911, the difference in amount of side metal mass is far less ( although being up higher makes it better to be hit in the legs than the chest and head ) than comparing what mass they each have in FRONT of the driver to spread the forces in the passenger cell AROUND the cabin

ignacio

The German government requires that the manufacturer issue a formal accident reconstruction report for all fatal crashes on the Autobahn where speed limits usually don't exist. The report must also include how the auto manufacturer plans to build the same car next year to prevent a similar fatality.

In 32 years of Neurology practice near Washington, D.C. I never saw severe in juries in a Porsche, Mercedes, BMW or Audi. I saw lots of severe injuries in 4WD dualies! They often roll over!

arena-RTR

I would be very interested to see this data.

MKW

Comparing controlled - deformation crush zones , etc is a nice academic exercise ...the golf cart -sized Smart Car is supposed to pass various govt barrier crash tests easily and with excellent scores ..but have you seen some of the pics on line of a straight on crash between one and ginormous SUVs ....the latter mostly looked like they were in fender benders whereas the Smarts were nearly obliterated

thomnellie

I recommend a Good used Sherman tank, or at least an armored personnel carrier. Not only will they crush (literally) a typical SUV in an accident, but they can be parked on top of lesser vehicles. When the Apocalypse comes, you will be glad to have one.

stratocaster69

LMAO. I love that one.. And that is the sort of thing I like. Big armor. lol

Archimedes

Start here with these tables. I'm still trying to find the NHTSA fatality rate table by vehicle that I used to have saved.

http://www.informedforlife.org/viewartcl.php?index=83

A lot of people fail to realize that the crash tests are testing and rating the car's ability to handle specific crashes against fixed objects. They don't address the real world aspect of weight difference and how important it is in the outcome of a crash.

As you can see in that table and the accompanying chart, the average death rate is almost linearly inverse to the weight of the vehicle. The lowest death rates are in SUVs. And the highest are in lightweight passenger cars.

johnireland

In the end of any severe accident, your body is going to suddenly stop moving, and your brain is going to collide with the inside of your skull. At that point you better hope all the safety crap slowed your body mass down to a survivable speed...but you still won't have any real guarantees. People just standing still can fall down and hit their head and die...far less body mass speed than a severe accident.

silvertige

I've looked into this myself recently and I agree with Archimedes. The numbers are very clear. Recent model year SUV's have an extremely low death rate per mile driven compared to cars, and, in particular, light, small cars, i.e. Porsche 911's.

Older suv's, pre-2006 or so, had higher death rates due to roll over tendencies that have now been addressed with electronic aids. So, now you have lots of mass/more protection. I'm sure our 911's are well designed and survivable relative to other cars of a similar weight, but compared to a MB GL450 or Suburban? Not even close.

stratocaster69

Exactly. A Mercedes G class I think weighs near 6000 lbs and they are noted for safety. Wouldnt want to run into one of those Giraffe wagons. lol

Archimedes

True, but when you're talking about motor vehicles, assuming similar active and passive safety equipment, weight of your vehicle is the single biggest factor in terms of accident survivability. If you're in the big, heavy car colliding with a lighter car, far more energy is going to be transferred to the lighter vehicle. Couple that with the fact that most small cars have smaller passenger compartments and you have a higher injury and death rate.

BTW, I'm not saying people shouldn't drive small cars. I'm just saying they're simply not as safe as larger vehicles on average. We all places our bets and takes our chances. I have a body full of titanium to prove it.

STG

What's what's safer, a 911 coupe or cabriolet?

Joec500

http://www.carbuzz.com/news/2015/8/1...Scene-7728709/

Alan Smithee

While I agree that a well-engineered large vehicle will typically be more safe in an impact than a well-engineered small vehicle, it is important not to lose sight of the fact that physics plays a role against large vehicles when it comes to accident avoidance.

Dude174

This is a very interesting topic as most of the severe accidents nowadays seem to result in people "walking away" much more often than even 5 years ago. I've been a professional firefighter for 16 years and have been on numerous accidents - severe, non severe, fatality, non fatality, etc.

One thing to consider, when comparing SUV/Pickup trucks to passenger cars, pickups conform to a different set of safety standards. A fullsize SUV such as a Suburban, Tahoe/Yukon, Expedition, etc - pickup based - are basically their respective pickup chassis with a more passenger friendly body sans the pickup bed.

Yes physics plays a role, as obviously a 6000 lb brick slamming into you in a 3000 lb lightweight, low vehicle will result in more mass transferred to the smaller vehicle. The caveat to this is, that doesn't always result in more deadly results to the smaller vehice, as modern vehicles deflect and blow up, similar to a crashed F1 car upon disintegration.

If a NASCAR stocker with all that steel crashed into a LMP car, which would do better? See what I mean, its hard to say definitively.

ALSO, these things don't happen in a lab or in a controlled environment. If the SUV driver were to swerve or deflect into an overpass (seen it happen), their A posts and roof are going to deflect into the passenger compartment much more than in the car. A risk to the car passenger is the lowness of the vehicle causing it to run under the higher SUV, well I've seen lower half of passenger doors in pickups deflect so badly into the passenger space, it forced the seat over and the passenger died when their head slammed into window glass.

Lastly, almost without exception, every German and Scandinavian vehicle I"ve run on in a major accident has resulted in ZERO fatalities. Thats just my experience - I'm obviously not saying it never happens. The A posts and B posts on these vehicles are so strong we have to use BAT (Big *** Tools) yes thats a thing! to open them up. Chevy's, Fords, Dodges, Hondas, etc - just like opening a can. The vaunted large SUV/pickup - they dont use any stronger steel in the body panels - just the frame.

Doctors roll in Porsches, Engineers roll in Porsches/German cars, Professors roll in Volvos - these smart people are on to something!