fxz

The 911’s C2S/C4S linear sense of speed, all the way through the car’s 7600rpm redline remains in tact, except now there is a bit of a step in the power curve because the 991 has variable valve timing (V-TEC kicks in, yo). So you get good acceleration up to around 4500rpm, then the hot cam engages, and the car leaps forward with even more ferocity, accompanied by a deeper hum from the flat six. Basically, the car seems fast already, and then you suddenly make the jump into hyperspace.(if you want it)
They offer a fantastic driving experience, and loads of excitement. It has brutal acceleration, phenomenal handling,
and has still got a nice connected feeling from behind the wheel.
It doesn’t feel like an appliance in the same way the Nissan GTR (more HP more Torque) does because you are still very much a part of the driving experience.
The GTR (more HP more Torque) left me feeling a bit cold afterward, but this C4S made me feel warm,
like I was involved in the fun, and not merely just along for the ride.

PeterC4

Agree with all that. But here is a contender for half the price.

jlanka

I'm getting popcorn

RajDatta

Ahem. "Vtec" or "hot cam" is honda lingo. Porsche does it differently.

Tapeworm

Troll much?

When you say a 991 has a linear sense of speed it makes me wonder if you have driven anything else... The 991 actually has a pretty non-linear engine. It has poor responsiveness below 3,000rpm, a bad stumble between 2,500rpm and 3,000rpm, multiple power bumps at ~3,000, ~4,000 and about ~6,000 as various bits of the engine enable or switch on. It's actually a pretty poor engine at anything less than full throttle, or if you can stay in the last 2,000rpm or so. I think that part of the charm of pre-1999 911's is that they didn't have variocam, direct injection or extra injectors, the engines were a lot more linear, felt more torque low down and had less bumpy power curves.

Brutal acceleration? Maybe in the last 2,000rpm or so. At all other times you are peacefully waiting for the revs to climb. At no point in regular driving do I feel the wheels / suspension about to be overcome by the power of the engine as you do in any other fast cars. Yes, the 991 is extremely over-tired to compensate for it's engine layout, and I think this removes a lot of the fun. I actually think a 991 might be a much more fun road car with significantly thinner wheels on the car. (A GTR with ~150hp more for example only has 255/285 wheels, a 991 has 245/305). A GTR has much more usable power low down, you are never waiting for the engine to catch it's breath. The rate of acceleration in 2nd gear in a 991 feels pretty much like the rate of acceleration in 3rd in a GTR.

I found the GTR just as involving as the 991, they are just different creatures. The 991 is really good at turning some of it's flaws into character, and that's part of it's charm. If you have not driven a GTR, at least read some decent reviews, like the ones in EVO - they certainly don't feel you are 'just along for the drive' in a GTR.

Andy

Bacura

Tapeworm, we must be driving totally different cars. Maybe your engine is seriously damaged. Also, I don't mean to be disrespectful to your comments but I would never buy a GTR no matter what the price.......in my mind it shows absolutely no class or appeal....but hey, that's just me. Actually, I'd take a Vette over a GTR.

PeterC4

To keep a balanced perspective on things, and maybe in partial defence of Tapeworm, there are other competitors to the Porsche 911 that have emerged onto the market - everybody is catching up including those guys in Detroit and I think the GTR by any measure is decent competitor at least based on everything I have read and seen, although haven't driven it. I tend to agree that the non-turbo version of even the current 911 line-up is not necessarily a torque heavy, tire smoking piece of machinery, I don't think they ever were. But it does have some very nice high speed capability and decent acceleration. I think the advances in the drivetrain and ride for the 991 are very good. It's old school to think you have to have a buck board ride to handle on the track. Anyway, to me, no matter how much you are swayed by "image, class or appeal" paying the kind of money for, say a well-equipped 911S that it takes to get one of the lot, at least in Canada, is a serious question for Porsche these days - anyway it is for me. Porsche hasn't been one of the most profitable car companies in the world for nothing - they charge a lot. Don't get me wrong I think they are beautiful cars and I'm still a fan. But there are cars out there that are half the price (and the GTR is at least $35,000 cheaper here in the great white north), than a C2S. And those car's are every bit as exotic from a performance point of view, as many 911 models.

There are reasons to buy a C4S yes, but there are many reasons to look at the competitors, there are some serious good buys out there. At some point it becomes foolish to overpay for a car by as much as two times the competitors' offerings. And ask anyone who has experienced the residual value deterioration of the 996 particularly the first generation or anyone who has had some RMS problems. For some it has been quite a costly experience.

Let's not make the thread a downer, though. I still think the car looks classic and beautiful. And on the track, at least for me, it has been quite good. I just don't see Porsche having an easy time of it going forward. Real competitors will and have emerged.

PeterC4

cole328

+100

Bacura

Maybe I need to clarify. I know there are faster cars with more torque than the 991. I know there are faster cars for less money like the GTR. I view my car as a less expensive alternative to a Ferrari not a more expensive alternative to a GTR. I don't track my car. As a DD the 430 HP with lesser torque is still crazy fast. I also find the engine VERY smooth and I have know idea what Tapeworm is referring to. I'm not even sure what tapeworm drives. To me the 991 is a package, not just numbers for torque and HP. If I didn't want a 991 I'd look at an R8 and most certainly not a GTR. It's only my opinion but I would have zero interest in a GTR. It has no appeal except it's raw numbers. My winter car is a Jetta GLi. I would just drive it all year round than buy a GTR. I know I am in a minority but I just find it ugly and plebian.......but fast. /shrug.

Team Plutonium

This thread has serious potential.

Fünfzig

Fünfzig

something has to take over for the "record short-term ownership" thread...

bccars

I'm with Bacura on this one !

PeterC4

A car only a mother could love. LOL