jmirandes

Porsche states on the 911-50 that's been around the auto shows a 3.8 sec. 0-60 time......

Money2536

I hear you. The other reason you left out is that I can't actually get a GT3 any time soon, or I would have been all over it. I do think the comfort of the C2S fits me better than a GT3 as I won't be going to the track.

Money2536

I think I'll get my money's worth, but my build was actually exactly $1,000 more MSRP than my GT3 configuration. I ended up adding X51 on the last day allowed for changes.

Tapeworm

I already feel a bit too conspicuous revving beyond ~5,000rpm in a 991 on the road as it is. Sometimes I drive with PSE off just so I can enjoy more performance without letting everyone within 5 miles know exactly what I'm doing - I'm not sure this makes the car much quieter, but it makes me feel less guilty.I think the biggest performance advantage the GT3 has is it's gearing and final drive ratio, but this is just going to make the revs higher in most driving situations. Sure, on the track, who cares, you live in the last 1,000 revs all the time. But on the road, how often do you really get to rev over 5,000 in normal driving....?

I wonder what a regular 991, or even an X51 would be like to drive with the same final drive ratio as the GT3? I would happily lower the top speed by 20-40mph to get dramatically faster revving and better performance on the street.

9114s

I think to compare 0-60 times is difficult, so it needs to be done on the same "everything". I trust Porsche for that as they are very professional. Yes I know that Porsche numbers are very conservative and that it is possible to achieve better numbers. The advantage of Porsche numbers is that a decent driver can reproduce it easily and consistently, not always true with competitor....very funny/embarrassing video here, the C4S with all the grip will have left this car way behind...


I can rely to this video as I was the owner of a corvette GS and corvette ZR1. It was not easy to use all this power safely and consistently. With the C4S you do not loose any HP (all grip).

Back to business see below Cabriolet C2S , C4S and GT3 with Porsche data.

According to Porsche only 0.1s benefit for X51. So it left the C4S-X51 at 3.7s only 0.4s from the GT3! (again Porsche numbers).
YES the GT3 is the sportiest and fastest car on the track and dry condition. It is more than debatable that it is a better car all year around and use on a daily basis. If you are a track fan Yes the GT3 is for you, as well as a Corvette Z06 with race tires.
A C4S-X51 does everything very well. A GT3 does track on the dry the best but for all other driving conditions a C4S is perfect and safer car.
I also like the fact that my car is "low key" on the road and on street parking compare to the GT3.
Again just my opinion and the official Porsche numbers... I love all Porsche.

chuckbdc

I agree, it won't actually make anyone with a GT3 jealous. But it could be just the thing for anyone who really really enjoys MT.

The comparative numbers above match my and the owner of the C4S Cab/X-51 experience when we drove each others cars back to back. The weight advantage of the C2S is apparent - at least at the slightly hum, elevated, speeds that we tested. But I'll reiterate: the X-51 is a very sweet improvement over the standard motor from about 5k rpm in the seat of the pants and the smile department. i would guess the performance difference would be quite noticable over several laps at the track too. I would get it if I were ordering a car (and didn't need (er want) a GT3).

Drifting

I hear you. From the descriptions on this thread, the X51 for the 991 sounds like it is certainly worth it.

I don't mean to bash anyone, but a GT3 is a GT3. The X51 gives you a bit more power, but there is a lot more than comes with a GT3.

There are lots of good reasons to get a 911 with X51 over a GT3. However none of those reasons are important to me.

Money2536

I agree. I love the idea of the GT3 and stupidly would have bought one had I been able to get an allocation. The C2S is clearly the better choice for me, but I don't always make the wisest choices when it come to cars. For instance, I loved the idea of bronze wheels on my Red S2000 or a full 3" header back exhaust on the M3. Both seemed like a great idea at the time but lessons have been learned. I probably would have loved the extra power and certainly the look of the GT3, but everything else on the C2S is a better fit. X51 gets me 50% of the way there without any sacrifice.

Bacura

I'm the same way. I'd love to have a GT3 for a weekend at the track because its an awesome car but no way as a DD. I have to deal with traffic and SPEED BUMPS. I understand that an awesome stereo/sunroof/quiet ride when I don't want to hear the exhaust is not important to many people but for me it's mandatory. I respect the GT3 for what it is.....it's just not for me. I have a friend with a GT2. Awesome car but he drives it about 2K/year. Took him out in my car and he loved it......just in a different way. I don't understand these threads because they are quite different in their purpose. My 911/50 was more costly than a GT3 but at the end of the day the decision was easy.......I no longer visit the track. I don't race against GT3's or any car for that matter so I wouldn't benefit from the extra performance. For me it would just be bragging rights.......but that's what Viagra is for!

handful

As an owner of a 991 2S X51 w/ spasm and pdk I fall out of your specific parameters for "the only reasons to order a 991 with X51." Here are some of my reasons for picking the X51 over the GT3
1. The 991 GT3 is a track car that can be driven on the street, whereas the 2S w/x51 is a street car that can be driven on the track. The bulk of my driving is away from the track, although about 50% of my driving is on mountain roads, which happen to be about 15 minutes from where I live.
2. Prior to pricing out my X51 I priced out a GT3 and the order came to $150,000. My dealer offered me a nice discount on my custom X51 order. There were none on the GT3.
3. Comparing the two models, the GT3 develops 475 hp at a whopping 8250 rpms, while the X51 develops 430 at 7500. By contrast the GT3 pushes out one less pound foot of torque at 6250 rpms. ( I am aware of torque multiplication through gearing). Both engines are peaky, but the X51 reaches its peak torque at 5800 rpms.
4. For both engines to be fully enjoyed they need to be reved to the limit. Obviously for normal street driving, neither one of these machines is very practical given the power curves. After spending 6 months behind the wheel of my 2S X51, the car truly has a dual personality, both of which I love!! The GT3 is more of a single purpose car, that needs to be taken to the track to fully enjoy.
5. The French Motorsport Magazine tested the 991S with power kit and 7 speed manual. It did not have spasm or sports chrono; however, it did have pdcc. In summation the 991S X51 was quicker than the standard S by .02 from 0-62 mph, 0-100 mph .04 and 0-125 mph .07. The difference between the two is worth noting and the X51 is certainly faster than what Porsche is advertising, which was minimal advertising at best: 0-60 mph .01 advantage.
6. My carefully optioned X51 weighs 3168 lbs. It is very, very quick.
7. Unfortunately, about 35% of my driving is on freeways......the Burmester sound system sure sounds sweet and when PSE is disengaged the environment is pretty decent for enjoying well recorded music. - not sure this can be said for the GT3.
I would characterize the X51 as GT3 lite with other tangible benefits.

General Jack

So it's probably about 3.6 seconds given Porsche's usual conservatism.

General Jack

Tenths, not hundredths of seconds though... 0.2 to 60, 0.4 to 100 and 0.7 to 125. That would extrapolate to about a half second in a quarter mile, 5+ car lengths.

Drifting

1-I would agree with you a lot more if we were talking 996 vs 996 GT3 or 997 vs 997 GT3. The 991 GT3 is a lot closer to the 991 for comfort than any GT3 before it. Interior noise is down considerably and the ride is much more comfortable. The 991 GT3 has deliberately been designed to be a better DD than any GT3 before it and in contrast the upcoming 991 GT3 RS has been designed in the other direction to be a more brutal focused track car than previous RS versions.

The 991 GT3 has become what the 911 used to be---a great sports car you can use as a DD that is also awesome to drive on a track. The current 991 911 is more luxury GT than sports car these days compared to previous 911 versions.

2-I'm happy your dealer got you a good deal on your 911 with X51. Even so, the GT3 is much better deal for the money and a GT3 will retain far more value over a few or many years compared to a 991+ X51.

I stand by my previous statements. #1The 991 + X51 is a great car. I am not dissing it at all.
However people ordering X51 are clearly quite performance oriented and X51 ain't cheap. It only makes sense to get 991 + X51 over a 991 GT3 if you---
1-must have AWD for your weather. 2-must have convertible. 3- must have manual or 4-must frequently drive with little kids in the back seats

Bacura

I have a question for drifting. Have you ever driven a 991 based GT3? I doubt it. Apparently the first 2 were delivered this week in the southern states. I am not trying to be difficult but how can you make any statement about the drivability of the new GT3 if you have never driven one? Have you driven a new 991 with X-51? Maybe. I am not trying to be disrespectful but this biggest problem with rennlist is the advice you get from people with no experience. If we are going to find out how the new GT3 is as a DD will have to wait a while. My 911/50 has the x-51. I didn't want a 4wd nor a cabrio nor a manual. I also don't really want my back seats. I still chose to NOT get a GT3 even though it would have been cheaper. It's not for everyone but it is for you. That's cool but please don't make statements based on zero personal experience. If you are one of the 2 people in the USA that currently has had their GT3 for less than a week then I sincerely apologize.

Drifting

Fair point. I have not yet personally driven a 991 GT3. I have driven 996, 997, 991 versions of the 911, 997 X51, 991 X51, 997.1 and 997.2 GT3s, and various other porsches.
My 991 GT3 information comes from reading every single article on the 991 GT3 in the last year from journalists I've read for years. Also emailed with drivers of the first 991 GT3s to be delivered to Germany and the UK over the past month.

So I likely understand the 991 GT3 and their suitability as a DD far better than anyone else on this thread.
However, I do yield the point that my own 991 GT3 won't arrive in the US for a couple months. I'll be happy to update you when it does.

Didn't want to harsh the buzz of any new X51 owners, but we are all entitled to express our opinions......particularly on the internet