Originally Posted by Wujohn

I read the bold typed section in the voice of the villain from the Matrix. Fitting, I think.

Originally Posted by stout

So much doom and gloom. I am not buying into it.

As for the environmental laws of the 1970s, yes, they made for some bad cars back then—but their move toward efficiency via total burn paved the way to O2 sensors, which paved the way to the current (and long) golden age of the automobile. Similar lines can be drawn with regards to the ugly bumpers of the 1970s driven by safety legislation that has undoubtedly saved a LOT of lives...and eventually led to integrated PU bumpers, which allow greater styling freedom.

As for the speed limiters, that last line is critical—as is the idea that they can be overridden. Perspective from Europe is critical, too. Last time I was in Stuttgart for a week, I was surprised at how un-fun it is to drive around its sprawling streets and thoroughfares. Speed limits vary widely, and there are 5-10 types of speed cameras all over the place waiting to nab you, even for small overages. 30, 50, 30, 50, 70, 30, 50, 30, etc. I found myself driving for cameras, and looking for them, rather than driving for safety—it was so awful I found myself understanding why Porsche execs in Stuttgart think PDK is totally superior period, and also thinking that I'd happily accept a bug red button I could hit that would limit my speed in various parts of town to whatever the posted limit is. It really was that tedious–and that's saying something. We don't know how good we have it. Go down to LA and the flow is well past the limit, enforcement is pretty chill so far as I can see (except certain spots, usually for good reason), and our speed limits (or at least, actual speeds) are often quite a bit higher than in Germany.

I remember when a German engineer asked where I was from, then said, "The U.S.? Pity, as you have no good roads to enjoy our cars on." I chuckled, as...autobahn aside, I think we have better roads for pleasure driving. Wider, typically, with shoulders that allow for a chosen line without going into the other lane. Typically reasonable dirt shoulders instead of white plastic pegs right next to the road. A lot of land, even (or especially?) in CA with a LOT of roads vs a much smaller country with fewer ways to cross a given stretch. More great roads to nowhere. A lot more. Only thing we give away is the autobahn, which to be honest, doesn't do a lot for me after getting over the initial novelty. Do wish we could run at 100-140 mph on long trips when safe, but we've still got it pretty good—and I see less threatening what we have here in the U.S. than I see threatening what they have in Europe. France, for instance, has really changed. Some other EU countries, as well, I'm told.

Originally Posted by Wujohn

I spent two weeks driving around Portugal last year and it was incredibly frustrating as traffic lights on certain thoroughfares would turn red if I drove too fast. On a relative basis, are we even experiencing that large a number of accidents or fatalities due to speed? My guess is it is likely distracted or drunk/impaired driving. Interestingly I had a friend tell me that certain insurance companies are giving people lower rates if they let the company monitor speed/behavior and stay under the limits. If true, I guess it wouldn't be too far a leap to see it go a step further to enabling actual limiters in personal vehicles.

Originally Posted by J**2

just more reason to have my 911 NOW
im 60 and plan to drive my baby till the wheels fall off. By the time all of this becomes reality I won’t be able to drive anyway.

Originally Posted by Denny Swift

Regarding this particular topic, I sincerely hope I am 100% wrong, but I think that what we are hearing is the sound of inevitability (as Agent Smith would say).

My favorite quote is from Morpheus:
I've seen agents punch through a concrete wall. Men have emptied entire clips at them and hit nothing but air, yet their strength and speed are still based on a world built entirely on rules. Because of that, they will never be as fast or as strong as you can be.

Unfortunately, the game is over and the machines won (we actually just gave it to them). Or as Morpheus would say: I have dreamed a dream, but now that dream is gone from me.

Originally Posted by stout

...and also thinking that I'd happily accept a bug red button I could hit that would limit my speed in various parts of town to whatever the posted limit is. It really was that tedious–and that's saying something. We don't know how good we have it. Go down to LA and the flow is well past the limit, enforcement is pretty chill so far as I can see (except certain spots, usually for good reason), and our speed limits (or at least, actual speeds) are often quite a bit higher than in Germany.

Originally Posted by dkhm3

Originally Posted by Papa Fittig

Be careful Pete for what you wish for. This era of big red button is around the corner.
As for our roads and their superiority, even if true, we often time ruin it, as majority of our "drivers" do not pay attention to driving. Ever stuck behind a car in the left lane on Hwy 5 e.g., going same speed (and often times below speed limit) as another car side to side in the right lane? That is unheard of in Europe and esp. Germany. Driving is more fun if majority of drivers around you are also driving. However, it may not make a difference once everyone is in selfdriven car going at allowed limit as a fish in the school.

Originally Posted by minthral

The problem with having a car that can force speed limit is the tech likely can keep track of it and create data, meaning eventually you get ticket without a cop... and no privacy including your insurance company getting the data.

All State and most other insurance companies already encourages you to install their mobile app to prove you're a safe driver that doesn't speed, never drives at night, and is grandma on brakes. Would be worse if car had this built into it.

The reality is we're not there yet... cameras that record speed limit signs and cruise control that follows them exists in volvos etc, but its not something that's good enough to be consistent and part of a mandated regulation.

Honestly all this talk is people getting way ahead of themselves of the stupid 'autonomous car movement' that nothing but a fad thanks to Elon Musk and zealous bored news corporations.

Originally Posted by fast1

I live in a rural part of MD with lots of beautiful winding roads, which are ideal for sports car driving. The only reason that I don't own a Miata is because of the driver inattentiveness that you referenced. A Porsche sports car is about as small a car as I'm willing to drive. Unfortunately the idyllic roads in my area are rife with 5K+lb SUVs driven by inattentive drivers, the vast majority drive with one hand on the steering wheel and the other holding a cell phone. BTW it's illegal to use hand held cell phones while driving in MD, but drivers in my area either don't know the law or don't care. So for self preservation, I immediately select the PSE button as soon as I start my car, and make certain that my engine speed never falls below 3K RPM. My hope is that if they don't see me, they should at least hear me.

Originally Posted by Greg D.

The way I see it, this is self defeating for governments..

They don't want to save lives, really, they want revenue. If you prevent the cars from getting speeding tickets, they will lose a colossal amount of $.

I agree in Europe that is probably not a bad idea, so many traffic cameras and radars. Good luck to them implementing that.