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Just a quick comparison the Klein and the Akra. Both are for sale on this site. The Klein only has 500 miles on it. Not sure how many miles on the Akra or if it is still available.
Below is stainless steel versus titanium witch have different discoloration characteristics of that’s what you are referring to? That will always be the case no matter who makes it. I hope this thread really doesn’t spin out of control it already is LOL. Hopefully everyone on here is smart enough to do their homework and do what works for them. Cheers everybody!
Below is stainless steel versus titanium witch have different discoloration characteristics of that’s what you are referring to? That will always be the case no matter who makes it. I hope this thread really doesn’t spin out of control it already is LOL. Hopefully everyone on here is smart enough to do their homework and do what works for them. Cheers everybody!
No, once again negativity prevails. I was posting this for two fold. One to see a side by side of shape and symmetry. And two, to help out those selling and those that are considering but can’t stomach the high price.
i have never said a negative word about Klein. It was line ball. I am still considering the exhaust system , despite all the negativity.
i think Kline is the best sounding exhaust. I couldn’t care less about colour.
Last edited by Mark Jolley; 11-05-2018 at 11:30 PM.
No, once again negativity prevails. I was posting this for two fold. One to see a side by side of shape and symmetry. And two, to help out those selling and those that are considering but can’t stomach the high price.
i have never said a negative word about Klein. It was line ball. I am still considering the exhaust system , despite all the negativity.
i think Kline is the best sounding exhaust. I couldn’t care less about colour. All you have done by butting in and trying to paint negativity where there was none, is make me reconsider who I buy the Kline from, if at all.
I think you misunderstand his intentions. Sambo's reputation both as an enthusiast and vendor on these boards is well established.
From my perspective he is only trying to offer helpful knowledge and contribute to the conversation in a meaningful way to those considering either system.
The conversation in this thread has carried over from multiple previous threads and arguments. The negativity here just carried over from earlier disucssion.
Basic: is the dyno chart you provided showing 24hp gains? I want to make sure I am reading it correctly and that it is put in writing so to speak. Please confirm.
The MotoIQ results showed 19hp, which is 20% less than this chart. Again, so many factors can alter a dyno chart, but both impressive.
In either scenario, to gain 20hp or more from a header change alone is astounding. I cannot wait to see what gains or losses I see tomorrow morning on the dyno...
Mark, I have no intentions of being negative or frustrating anybody. The post that I was referring to above my own was not even made by you or if it was before and then put up again I apologize for the misunderstanding. I just didn’t understand if that was put up as a simple comparison or has some kind of a negative connotation as to the color of the system because that’s the way it reads to me. Talking about how very so few miles and so on. Stainless steel becomes dark after one hot run or just a few miles. Titanium does not. Again maybe I read too deep into it but I’m not here to argue at all or two mislead anyone. I’m here to do the opposite. You’ll notice that I said there’s room for everyone and there’s lots of great options and that’s actually something I always say. Again please understand, one thing I’m quite sensitive about is misinformation and negative or incorrect information. I meant nothing against you or anyone else for that matter. The reason I’m posting here is because I provided the system in the service for the OP and we are in constant contact as I am with all of my clients. To make sure everything is nice and smooth. He was kind enough to do this to share information with everyone so if I see something that I can contribute to feel the obligation to do so. I also feel the obligation to let you know I’m here to support the community and I definitely apologize if I frustrated anybody that’s not my intention. All you have to do is look me up and you’ll find it’s the opposite. There’s just a lot of sensitivity when it comes to exhaust threats LOL. People read this stuff and it needs to be accurate.I honestly wish everything could have its own voice separately from the others so people could independently read and share and make their decision without too much crosstalk. But again, I also believe as a community we can keep it nice and fun and informative.
Just to be clear, Sambo's a GREAT guy. I actually spoke with him when i was evaluating exhaust options. He's by far the most responsive guy on the forum. Laid out all the information for me which helped me to make a decision. Zero BS.
And so are the guys at Vektor. If you read my thread they were there every step along the way helping out a noob like me to get my **** installed, they even sent me extra tools to get my job done when i got stuck... AND they followed up after regarding my feedback on their product. So calling these guys snake oil sales men didn't sit right with me. On top of all that they had the most scientific and knowledgeable responses to backup their claims.
Ultimately, i decided PERSONALLY it didn't make sense to shell out that much money for a set of inconel exhausts. I decided to focus on header + sport cats upgrade for best bang for my buck. And I apologize this thread got so ugly. I think everyone should've stopped at "this is MY personal review of the product i bought, and these are my thoughts" and called it a day. But obviously some had to take their claims a few steps further than necessary.
PTS, im gonna go back to what i said in my original response. Love your car, looking forward to your results. Just let it go dude. Enjoy what you have and the choice you made. Post the information you have and help others make an informed decision. No need to start this vs that.
Regarding the dyno i shared, rennlist doesn't let me post insta links properly but you can find it at instagram DOT com/p/Bnj96LyFOWS/ And just to be clear, the guy had a bunch of bolt on mods and a tune, but that graph was purely from the header swap. He recently added bigger turbos to his T too.
Basic: is the dyno chart you provided showing 24hp gains? I want to make sure I am reading it correctly and that it is put in writing so to speak. Please confirm.
The MotoIQ results showed 19hp, which is 20% less than this chart. Again, so many factors can alter a dyno chart, but both impressive.
In either scenario, to gain 20hp or more from a header change alone is astounding. I cannot wait to see what gains or losses I see tomorrow morning on the dyno...
The MotoIQ test actually showed a max gain of about 25whp (380 over 355) at 5778rpm. Again, different dynos, etc, so better to use a percentage gain which equates to about 7%.
I fully expect the Kline headers will make power like the Fabspeed and Vektor headers have shown when on the stock tune which is to say most of the gains will be in the upper half of the rev range.
"The Power results for the Vektor Performance header were amazing, at 387 whp and 357 lb-ft, we recorded a peak power gain of 19 whp and 11 lb-ft of torque."
So, regardless of how the motoiq chart is interpreted, I will put up my chart later today on the Kline Header Dyno and we can compare where the power is made and peak power made..
PTS, peak gains vs max gains are not the same thing.
Peak is the max power the plot shows, every dyno posts peak numbers for WHP and WTQ. Most will show averages as well.
Max Gains are where the plots differ the most. In other words, where the largest before/after gains are shown. This could be shown in spool-up, midrange, or if the before had boost taper and the after did not there would be a large disparity there, but peak numbers could be far less.
So here we go. The Dyno Results are in and I am very happy. Let me begin by saying that unlike the other cars that have been dyno tested for Headers, my car is tuned and not stock.
My car also has high flow Soul 200 cell cats on it, so my numbers are much higher to begin with than the stock cars that have been tested. It does currently have a stock PSE exhaust for now..
The numbers from my dyno operator, since I can't read them
With the Kline headers installed the results showed:
30whp gains in midrange
30ft/lb torque in the midrange
15ft/lb peak torque
5whp peak HP
Kline Zirconium Header Dyno Chart 991.2
The chart shows increases basically from the jump. From 2500 rpms all the way to redline, the headers made gains everywhere.
The red line shows the current header test and the green line was the test previously made with factory headers.
Now keep in mind, this is on a car that already was producing over 530whp and not a stock car.
Clearly the 991.2 engines are capable of obtaining HP from just about everywhere. There are many different ways to up the HP and torque. Headers alone will do it.
Now for me, this is the best chart I could have asked for. No other chart I have seen showed improvements from 2500 to redline, which is the entire power band.
The max gains of 30 for both torque and HP are also higher than any other header result I have seen, but to be fair the car is tuned and that could certainly impact the higher numbers due to higher boost.
I posted a couple more videos for comparison to also demonstrate the sound which is simply magnificent. Everyone told me the Kline sound is the best and honestly now I believe it.
All things being equal, even if the headers weren't producing the most power over the entire power band over any other header (but they are), the sound alone is worth the price of entry.
Thank you Felix Kline and Sam of By Design for offering me a full refund if they didn't perform to my expectations. These Headers aren't going back. Bravo Kline, well done..
Big thanks to Jimmy at the Shop in Norwalk for the awesome dyno testing and Tommy at P1 in Stamford for the installation expertise.
I am not in Florida or I would have gone to BGB as John is a true gentleman and as knowledgable as they come.
I am in CT so I used "The Shop" in Norwalk for the Dyno testing. Not so easy to find all wheel Dynos and he has one.
Mustang, not Dynojet so numbers need to be adjusted upwards by 15-17% to compensate for Dynojets higher numbers.
11-05-2018, 04:19 PM
