“N0” (N -Zero) spec tires vs. not
05-23-2018, 06:30 PM
#2
Race Car
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"N0" tires are designed in conjunction with Porsche engineers to tweak a tire to exactly what the factory wants. It can be a variety of small things, from a small change in the compound to affect say....wet braking...to an adjustment to get another 1/10 more G load in a corner or even ride a tad more comfortable. I have a tire engineer friend who works for Michelin and he tells me there is a subtle difference, and Porsche is quite specific about what they want. They want the OEM business as a supplier so the major tire makers agree to do it.
I've run both N0 spec tires and the same one just not with the Porsche spec (they seem to be about $ 20 less per tire or so). I can't tell the difference to speak of, because most the time when I replace the tires the ones coming off the car are pretty worn and any new tire runs better at that point.
I've run both N0 spec tires and the same one just not with the Porsche spec (they seem to be about $ 20 less per tire or so). I can't tell the difference to speak of, because most the time when I replace the tires the ones coming off the car are pretty worn and any new tire runs better at that point.
05-23-2018, 06:44 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
Porsche approved that is all. I used non-Nspec MPSS in my 2013 Boxster S when the N spec Pzeros wore out. The Michelins were fantastic. I would not hesitate to use non-N spec tires in my 911. I did buy N spec tires recently from the dealer because the prices were the same as TR and the parts department don't order non N-spec tires.
05-23-2018, 10:22 PM
#4
Pro
Porsche approved that is all. I used non-Nspec MPSS in my 2013 Boxster S when the N spec Pzeros wore out. The Michelins were fantastic. I would not hesitate to use non-N spec tires in my 911. I did buy N spec tires recently from the dealer because the prices were the same as TR and the parts department don't order non N-spec tires.
05-23-2018, 10:41 PM
#5
Rennlist Member
They could be the same tires with a different set of specs slapped on the tire for Porsche for a specific brand. I doubt Michelin will change the tire design for one small volume Manufacturer. I don’t know. From the specs., is there a substantial difference in the PS4S tires, N spec vs regular?
05-24-2018, 12:07 AM
#6
Pro
They could be the same tires with a different set of specs slapped on the tire for Porsche for a specific brand. I doubt Michelin will change the tire design for one small volume Manufacturer. I don’t know. From the specs., is there a substantial difference in the PS4S tires, N spec vs regular?
05-24-2018, 04:53 AM
#7
My tire shop tell me they don't believe there is much, if any, in the compound between N spec and others (i'm using Pilot Cup Sport 2s) I've tried N spec and K spec tires and they both are great and feel the same to me. The K spec (which i believe are for Ferrari) have slightly different sidewall design, but other than that I have no issues and notice no difference. Am currently on N spec fronts and K spec rears due to inventory shortage but its been fine.
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05-24-2018, 08:44 AM
#9
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If you are considering tires for your targa, according to your avatar, I would recommend against the N0 Pirelli tire. If you go with a 991.2 fitment tire(same but has a 305 rear section tire) you can get the N1 tire pirelli, these are a better tire and much less prone to dry rot/cracking. If you wanted to make an investment in the performance of your car, Porsche just accepted the Michelin PS4S which is a REALLY GREAT tire and quite a bit more expensive than the Pirelli.
05-24-2018, 10:10 AM
#10
05-24-2018, 12:36 PM
#12
Three Wheelin'
05-24-2018, 01:01 PM
#13
Pro
05-24-2018, 01:21 PM
#14
When I installed the aftermarket wheels on my car at 7000 miles, I had Michelin Pilot Super Sport Tires (not “N” rated) installed, knowing nothing about Porsche’s “N” rating tires. Within 8000 miles, I got 2 nails in the right rear tire. I then replaced both rears with the just coming out Michelin Pilot Sport 4S Tires. Again, not with the “N” rating. My car has been at the dealership numerous times with these non-“spec” tires and never once has the dealer mentioned that they didn’t meet Porsche’s requirements.
The Michelins did feel better over the Pirellis. But that could have simply been a placebo having just dropped a bunch of money on rims and tires.
The Michelin’s also had both front and rear rim protection rubber. The Pirelli’s only had that on the front. Although not that big of a deal, I did avoid some road rash on my rims with the rubber lip.
Now that the car is at the dealer for its 40k service, they’re, of course, trying to cross sell me on new tires. Now, not surprisingly, is when they point out that my current tires are not Porsche spec.
I’ve enjoyed the last 33k miles on my non-“spec” tires. I drive my 911 everyday, rain or shine and even in an ice storm, where the streets were covered in a layer of ice. Never once has this car gotten away from me. Is the safest feeling and driving car that I’ve ever owned. And now I’m told I’ve been doing it on the wrong tires.
The Michelins did feel better over the Pirellis. But that could have simply been a placebo having just dropped a bunch of money on rims and tires.
The Michelin’s also had both front and rear rim protection rubber. The Pirelli’s only had that on the front. Although not that big of a deal, I did avoid some road rash on my rims with the rubber lip.
Now that the car is at the dealer for its 40k service, they’re, of course, trying to cross sell me on new tires. Now, not surprisingly, is when they point out that my current tires are not Porsche spec.
I’ve enjoyed the last 33k miles on my non-“spec” tires. I drive my 911 everyday, rain or shine and even in an ice storm, where the streets were covered in a layer of ice. Never once has this car gotten away from me. Is the safest feeling and driving car that I’ve ever owned. And now I’m told I’ve been doing it on the wrong tires.
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xgrimeyx (08-14-2023)
05-24-2018, 01:58 PM
#15
Rennlist Member
Non N-spec tires can be great tires.
However, I had a moment years ago...approaching an intersection in Oakland under a freeway, where my light was green and, to my right, a bad accident had just happened. The Camry in the lane to our right was looking, too, as first responders had yet to get there. We and the Camry were probably braking lightly, at 40~ mph, as we had the green and were pretty close to the intersection. Then a glint to my left caught my eye—from the chrome mirror or trim of an 18-wheel tanker truck...which had slowed to 15 or so but was definitely going to run its red light. He was gawking at the accident, too. The Camry driver and I hit the brakes at the same time, and then everything slowed down. It was just a matter or grip vs distance. We stopped short of the gas tanks on the side of the cab by a few feet, and looked over just in time to see the Camry's nose crushed by trailer wheels, pivoting the left rear of the Camry left...towards the right front fender of our Boxster. We stopped a couple of feet short of the trucks path, and the Camry stopped inches from hitting us.
I had just put N-spec tires on that Boxster, ruing the price and thinking I'd never do it again. Yes, R-compounds would have stopped us sooner, and non N-spec tires might have been just as good—but this was our daily car and that was the day I decided I want every last bit of the performance engineered into my Porsches by the factory unless I know I can exceed it (or find a better set of compromises). YMMV, but Porsche does a lot of tire testing. The difference between N and non-N seems a small price to pay for that testing.
However, I had a moment years ago...approaching an intersection in Oakland under a freeway, where my light was green and, to my right, a bad accident had just happened. The Camry in the lane to our right was looking, too, as first responders had yet to get there. We and the Camry were probably braking lightly, at 40~ mph, as we had the green and were pretty close to the intersection. Then a glint to my left caught my eye—from the chrome mirror or trim of an 18-wheel tanker truck...which had slowed to 15 or so but was definitely going to run its red light. He was gawking at the accident, too. The Camry driver and I hit the brakes at the same time, and then everything slowed down. It was just a matter or grip vs distance. We stopped short of the gas tanks on the side of the cab by a few feet, and looked over just in time to see the Camry's nose crushed by trailer wheels, pivoting the left rear of the Camry left...towards the right front fender of our Boxster. We stopped a couple of feet short of the trucks path, and the Camry stopped inches from hitting us.
I had just put N-spec tires on that Boxster, ruing the price and thinking I'd never do it again. Yes, R-compounds would have stopped us sooner, and non N-spec tires might have been just as good—but this was our daily car and that was the day I decided I want every last bit of the performance engineered into my Porsches by the factory unless I know I can exceed it (or find a better set of compromises). YMMV, but Porsche does a lot of tire testing. The difference between N and non-N seems a small price to pay for that testing.