Gus_Smedstad

I was wrestling a bit with this recently.

I blame options. You get a lot more car for your money if you buy used, but you don't get exactly what you want. When you're talking north of $100k for a car, you want it to be exactly what you want. You want it to tick all your boxes, it's not a purely functional decision like a $20k car.

Every 911 is unique in some way. The options, the color, the trim levels vary so much it's difficult to find two absolutely identical cars. They're all different, unlike cars in the $20k price range, which tend to vary only by color. One gray Honda Civic is like almost every other gray Honda Civic, but any two gray 911's are likely very different.

Suppose I want what I currently think is a "perfect car" for me, according to the configurator. A manual Sapphire Blue Targa 4 GTS, black leather interior, a few common options like RWS, entry and drive, etc, total MSRP around $155k.

This car does not exist on any dealer lot. If Porsche makes one like this, it'll be because someone with my particular taste ordered one.

If I look for this car used in 2020, it probably won't be for sale. I'll have to settle for something that's close to what I wanted, but not quite. Most likely it's PDK, or white instead of sapphire blue, or has beige leather interior instead of black. Objectively stuff that shouldn't be a deal breaker, but not exactly what I wanted. The only way to get precisely what you want is sometimes custom-ordering it new.

The less you care about specific uncommon options, the less of a problem this is. If you're fine with gray, PDK, a coupe, don't care about AWD below the Turbo trim level, it's a lot easier to be completely satisfied with the selection of used cars available.

Not that there is anything wrong with gray PDK RWD coupes. Those are absolutely fine cars. That I'd want something different is purely about my own peculiarities.

fast1

LOL I'd think so. Unless you completely disregard speed limits, you'll be using no more than half of the power on the street. If you go beyond that and there's a State Trooper nearby, you'll be issued a reckless driving citation. Actually the same applies to a GTS, S or even the base.

Gus_Smedstad

This is not true. I've got a 4S, and there are times I can use the full power of the car without violating speed limits. I'm just getting up to speed very quickly. If the speed limit is 55 or 65 (i.e. an expressway on ramp), this doesn't even require finesse, though getting up to 45 without speeding isn't that hard.

Now, it might be a problem if you live in Australia. While it's not a crime to accelerate quickly in the US, apparently Australia has broad ordinances against "hooning," which can mean almost anything the police want it to. Specifically, "wilfully starting a motor vehicle or driving in way that makes unnecessary noise or smoke."

Not that my 4S will squeal tires or burn rubber, since it's got enough traction to deliver all the available power. A Turbo S might. I suspect they'd still get me for "making too much engine noise."

tstafford

Yep. All solid reasons.

That said, I get the OP's question. Does seem strange to me how the used Turbo S isn't a hotter commodity given the value. It's a ton of car that is very DD friendly.

rai

thanks, I am not criticizing anyone who buys new. I'm on the fence.

Dude174

7mt, rear wheel drive and you can option it exactly how you want it.... echoing other poster's sentiments

fast1

So you take your car to redline in 1st gear and then immediately take your foot off the gas pedal so you don't exceed the speed limit? Very unusual driving pattern.

Gus_Smedstad

Well, no. Typically I'm not going for the absolute fastest launch. I'm still asking full power from the car on occasion, just usually while I'm already rolling.

You've never done the same on an on-ramp?

BlazinPond

No problem my friend....
It is a very legitimate question, so i understand why you posted!

fast1

I hope that this doesn't come off as preachy, but on the street I rarely push my car; I save that for the track. Since you asked if I ever pushed it, the answer would be yes. Not on a ramp, but down some country road. Since I live in the country, that's where I do the vast majority of my driving.

My first 911 which I purchased in 1970 had 180 HP, and I never drove my 2007 997S any faster on the street than I did that 911. The point I was trying to make is that unless a driver has a complete disregard for traffic laws, all Porsches are overpowered for the street. Porsche acknowledges that in their brochures when they always have references to the track when citing performance numbers.

bkrantz

Not preachy at all--and I agree with you. Many modern cars, especially high end sports cars, have performance limits that are never approached during legal street driving.

If you want to wring out your car on the street (and stay out of jail), buy the lowest power econobox you can find--or buy a classic Porsche. A fact of life: while cars have gotten so much more capable, roads are easier to drive, and speed limits are the same or lower.

titleistaddict87

Very easy and it's already been said. With new you get exactly what you want. Period. With used you get value and potentially more performance, cachet, and options for the same money as a lesser new car.

When you go shopping for ANYTHING in life you can buy on sale and maybe it's not exactly what you want but a good value/deal or you pay full retail and get your exact size, color, etc all custom tailored to your body with the service of full retail. Same here. Only you can decide what you want.

Gus_Smedstad

And my point was this isn't true. While you're never going to drive a 911 on the street the way you would on a track, there are perfectly ordinary moments, here and there, where you can use the available performance without doing anything illegal or unsafe, and you do feel the difference between a 991 base and a 991S.

For example: yesterday I had to merge on to route 9 in the Natick area. Route 9's a bit peculiar, since it's almost an expressway, with 50 MPH speed limits along much of its length, but many of the entrances have no acceleration lanes. I mean none, it's just a simple right turn, like turning on to an ordinary road, except that traffic is going pretty fast, and you have to hope for a decent gap in traffic.

Accelerating hard there was neither illegal nor unsafe, and my C4S did it appreciably faster than, say, a Cayman base. Having a faster car meant a little more enjoyment of the moment. The additional power is not always wasted.

To take another example: I had to change lanes on the expressway on the same trip. There was no gap to the right, so I started to slow down so I could pass behind the car paralleling me. That car also slowed down, until there was now as a safe gap head of him. And to be perfectly clear, I mean one with enough following distance in both directions, not just one where the car would fit.

So I floored it, the PDK dropped to 3rd, the car was giving me all it had, and I moved over into the gap. 400 HP wasn't necessary, a 100 HP sedan could do the same thing only slower, but it wasn't "too much power" because accelerating from ~45 MPH to 60 MPH still takes a couple of seconds, even flat out. At expressway speeds differences in power are more significant.

When I purchase a car, I'm not purchasing it for the track, and I'm not purchasing it for numbers. I purchase it for how it drives. I can feel the difference between a 200 HP normally aspirated Supra, a 320 HP turbocharged Supra, a 275 HP 981 base, a 325 HP 981S, a 350 HP 991.1 base, and a 400 HP 991.1S. OK, maybe not so much between a 981S and a 991.1 base, but you get the idea.

The difference between a 991.1 base and a 991.1S surprised me, by the way. When I started looking at 911's, I wasn't expecting the extra power to make as much of a difference as it did. And no, I didn't violate any traffic laws when test driving any of the cars.

sampelligrino

I debated this before leasing my 2017 .2 C4. I was looking at a gorgeous CPO 991.1 C2 that ticked all the boxes on what I was looking for, it had just about every option I wanted and I knew the 3.4L NA engine was amazing, and the last of its kind.

However, when I sat in the car, I just didn't get that same feeling of excitement that I have been fortunate enough to feel when sitting for the first time in the prior cars I had owned, because my prior cars were all new (from VW to Toyota to Lexus to Benz etc..).

For me, personally, a purchase like this is all about the experience from start to finish especially with this kind of money, and it just didn't feel the same for me sitting in a car with 13k miles on it, with a bit of wear on the seat's side bolsters, just looking and seeing various indications of *very* minor wear from the prior owner.

My C4 was my first Porsche, and there is something special (to me) about sitting in a new car for the first time, being the first owner, with that new car smell, breaking in the engine, making the car yours. And yep, I know that as it's built and shipped from Stuttgart, ship and factory employees sit in the car, etc etc.

But different strokes for different folks, you obviously pay a premium to purchase new vs. used, and you'll eat the depreciation for the 2nd owner if you buy new, just as the 2nd owner will eat the depreciation for the 3rd owner, etc in most instances. Leasing is important to me as well, as it just works for me and allows me to get into a new car every 2-3 years with not much of a worry.

Again, just my 2 cents and I totally understand why some go the opposite route of CPO/used! All just depends on what's most important to you with a purchase like this.

NoGaBiker

One thing to remember vis all the comments about "when you're spending this much money."

That statement implies that the new 991.2 costs, say, $135,000 and the used one costs, say, $105,000. If you're only saving $30,000 (22%) why not go ahead and buy the new one?

But the truth, for most people looks more like this:

Buy new 911 for 135,000. Drive for two years, trade and get $100,000 (my experience on 991.1GTS). Lose $35,000, for a cost per year of $17,500.

Buy used 911 for 105,000. Drive for two years, trade and get 85,000. Lose $20,000, for a cost per year of $10,000. Rinse and repeat.

The difference is $625/month. Given that during months 3-24, both of these 911s are and seem like used cars, some would argue the used one is the way to go.

I've done it both ways, multiple times, but I've bought used slightly more often. In fact, now that I think about it, it seems like the only time I buy new is when the model I just HAVE to have is new and there aren't any used ones, or a tiny smattering of them. Otherwise I write out the spec I want, with Must Haves and Liketa Haves, then go searching for the car.

As for the buying process itself, though, New is a whole order of magnitude more fun!