Turbo boost issues
03-13-2015, 08:10 AM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Turbo boost issues
I am posting this on behalf of a friend who would like feedback. He owns a 2014 Turbo S Cab with 29000 kms on it which he bought brand new.
The two times he has taken it to track he has lost his turbo boost completely within the first hour or within half hour the second time around.
After the first track incident it was diagnosed that a hose had come loose which was replaced under warranty. A few days later he lost boost again while pushing his car on a twisty mountain road. At that point his service advisor hinted that they may need to order a hose with modified fittings from Germany. But it turned out that this time it was a different hose so that was replaced under warranty and problem solved.
Today (his second time on track with it) there was a large pop or bang sound from the engine within 15 minutes of driving and he has lost boost again. This is yet to be diagnosed when he goes to dealer
Other than above incidents he has had a relatively trouble free 29000 kms of street driving.
He would like to know if others have had similar problems ? Is this a known issue with the 991 turbos?
The two times he has taken it to track he has lost his turbo boost completely within the first hour or within half hour the second time around.
After the first track incident it was diagnosed that a hose had come loose which was replaced under warranty. A few days later he lost boost again while pushing his car on a twisty mountain road. At that point his service advisor hinted that they may need to order a hose with modified fittings from Germany. But it turned out that this time it was a different hose so that was replaced under warranty and problem solved.
Today (his second time on track with it) there was a large pop or bang sound from the engine within 15 minutes of driving and he has lost boost again. This is yet to be diagnosed when he goes to dealer
Other than above incidents he has had a relatively trouble free 29000 kms of street driving.
He would like to know if others have had similar problems ? Is this a known issue with the 991 turbos?
03-13-2015, 11:47 PM
#2
Racer
I have had that happen in my Duramax a few times, but it was always due to increasing boost from 20 to 38 PSI...and the fittings were not designed for the added boost.
03-14-2015, 12:08 AM
#3
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your description sounds exactly like what has happened to a number of turbos that were tracked. Long story short and IIRC: Porsche produced an updated hose/clamp/something to prevent the problem and retrofitted as necessary.
If it's the same problem, it sounds like your friend's dealer isn't using or isn't aware of the updated part and they're just reconnecting the old part every time.
03-14-2015, 01:01 AM
#4
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
I should have mentioned the car is bone stock.
Above is what service advisor seems to have mentioned about modified fitting.
Is it also worth checking the diverter valves and throttle body?
Thanks for the feedback.
Above is what service advisor seems to have mentioned about modified fitting.
Is it also worth checking the diverter valves and throttle body?
Thanks for the feedback.
03-14-2015, 11:24 AM
#5
Some others previously posted on here their boost tube popped off. If I remember correctly Porsche now has a better clamp or something their dealer installed but not 100% sure on those details.
03-14-2015, 02:26 PM
#7
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
He found out today that after the second incident they did install a modified clamp. However, that modified one has also come loose this time. They will need to think of something else.
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03-17-2015, 09:42 AM
#9
The recall code is WE66 with 2 options on how to proceed exactly below,
1. If rubber sleeve still in place, only tightening the clamps are needed.
Tightening must be done using torque wrench to specific requirement, then wait 5 minutes for the clamps to settle in, then re-torque again using the same value to make sure.
2. If rubber sleeve already out of place, even slightly, fitting new sleeve and clamps must be done.
There is no such thing as new improved parts, they are all the same parts, otherwise step 1 wont even existed.
Below part numbers are the one listed on WE66 parts ordering guide for step 2 above,
Rubber Sleeve #997 110 647 73, Clamp #000 043 204 68
Edit:
- #000 043 204 68 is Klubber Syntheso Glep (kind of paste). Needed for both step above.
A light coating of it (1 gram) need to be applied on each rubber bushing of the air guide (NOT on the rubber sleeve/hose).
Air guide is the plastic housing that connected to the air ducts. You need to take off engine compartment blower to see it.
It has 2 rubber bushing (left and right) to attached/hold the air guide into to car's panel.
- Tightening Torque for the rubber sleeve's clamp is 5Nm (3.5 ftlb).
1. If rubber sleeve still in place, only tightening the clamps are needed.
Tightening must be done using torque wrench to specific requirement, then wait 5 minutes for the clamps to settle in, then re-torque again using the same value to make sure.
2. If rubber sleeve already out of place, even slightly, fitting new sleeve and clamps must be done.
There is no such thing as new improved parts, they are all the same parts, otherwise step 1 wont even existed.
Below part numbers are the one listed on WE66 parts ordering guide for step 2 above,
Rubber Sleeve #997 110 647 73, Clamp #000 043 204 68
Edit:
- #000 043 204 68 is Klubber Syntheso Glep (kind of paste). Needed for both step above.
A light coating of it (1 gram) need to be applied on each rubber bushing of the air guide (NOT on the rubber sleeve/hose).
Air guide is the plastic housing that connected to the air ducts. You need to take off engine compartment blower to see it.
It has 2 rubber bushing (left and right) to attached/hold the air guide into to car's panel.
- Tightening Torque for the rubber sleeve's clamp is 5Nm (3.5 ftlb).
Last edited by pyramid; 03-19-2015 at 01:03 AM.
03-17-2015, 04:42 PM
#10
The recall code is WE66 with 2 options on how to proceed exactly below,
1. If rubber sleeve still in place, only tightening the clamps are needed.
Tightening must be done using torque wrench to specific requirement, then wait 5 minutes for the clamps to settle in, then re-torque again using the same value to make sure.
2. If rubber sleeve already out of place, even slightly, fitting new sleeve and clamps must be done.
There is no such thing as new improved parts, they are all the same parts, otherwise step 1 wont even existed.
Below part numbers are the one listed on WE66 parts ordering guide for step 2 above,
Rubber Sleeve #997 110 647 73, Clamp #000 043 204 68
1. If rubber sleeve still in place, only tightening the clamps are needed.
Tightening must be done using torque wrench to specific requirement, then wait 5 minutes for the clamps to settle in, then re-torque again using the same value to make sure.
2. If rubber sleeve already out of place, even slightly, fitting new sleeve and clamps must be done.
There is no such thing as new improved parts, they are all the same parts, otherwise step 1 wont even existed.
Below part numbers are the one listed on WE66 parts ordering guide for step 2 above,
Rubber Sleeve #997 110 647 73, Clamp #000 043 204 68
What a great, complete answer. That is why these forums are such a good resource!
03-17-2015, 07:12 PM
#11
The recall code is WE66 with 2 options on how to proceed exactly below,
1. If rubber sleeve still in place, only tightening the clamps are needed.
Tightening must be done using torque wrench to specific requirement, then wait 5 minutes for the clamps to settle in, then re-torque again using the same value to make sure.
2. If rubber sleeve already out of place, even slightly, fitting new sleeve and clamps must be done.
There is no such thing as new improved parts, they are all the same parts, otherwise step 1 wont even existed.
Below part numbers are the one listed on WE66 parts ordering guide for step 2 above,
Rubber Sleeve #997 110 647 73, Clamp #000 043 204 68
1. If rubber sleeve still in place, only tightening the clamps are needed.
Tightening must be done using torque wrench to specific requirement, then wait 5 minutes for the clamps to settle in, then re-torque again using the same value to make sure.
2. If rubber sleeve already out of place, even slightly, fitting new sleeve and clamps must be done.
There is no such thing as new improved parts, they are all the same parts, otherwise step 1 wont even existed.
Below part numbers are the one listed on WE66 parts ordering guide for step 2 above,
Rubber Sleeve #997 110 647 73, Clamp #000 043 204 68
2. FYI. The hose has always been supplied as a spare part with the two clamps (one at either end).
3. I'm told the new separate clamp spare part is an up-rated clamp, used on the Y pipe end (which is where the hose usually blows off). The hose remains the same as does the clamp at the throttle body end.
Note: If the new clamp was the same as supplied on the hose then essentially there would be no need to provide it as a separate spare part, as once the hose blows off then it needs to be replaced anyway.
03-18-2015, 07:27 PM
#13
It is the short concertina hose that joins the Y pipe to the throttle body. The diameter of the Y pipe outlet is significantly larger than the inlet of the throttle body creating more pressure upon the hose at that end rather than at the throttle body end which has a much smaller dia. So everything has to be seating correctly (i.e. ridges in grooves perfectly around the entire circumference) and the correct torque applied to the clamps. Too much torque and the ridge distorts in the groove, not enough torque and the ridge won't have adequate purchase to keep the hose and ridges in perfect position. Explanation: You have a machined square groove running around the outer circumference of the Y pipe outlet which the hose slides on to and the hose has a mating internal ridge on the inside circumference which then sits into that groove on the y pipe. The clamp is then torqued with enough pressure on that area ensuring the ridge wont be displaced from the groove. Once the ridge has been forced out of the groove the ridge is never the same as it gets ripped over the edge of the groove and weakens the hard rubber, often causing a tear which is easily overlooked, that is why the hose must be replaced. I am told the new clamp is different but I haven't physically seen it to explain how they have improved it. The weakness of the old clamp is in the worm screw design from what i've seen, which would not give a very even tension around the entire diameter of the hose.
Last edited by speed21; 03-18-2015 at 07:45 PM.
03-19-2015, 01:02 AM
#14
1. This is correct. If the hose has been blown off under boost even just the one time then the inner retaining bead of the hose becomes damaged and/or weakened (collateral damage). The integrity of the inner retaining bead is absolutely crucial for proper retention regardless of the clamp being tightened correctly so once that has been compromised the hose is considered toast.
2. FYI. The hose has always been supplied as a spare part with the two clamps (one at either end).
3. I'm told the new separate clamp spare part is an up-rated clamp, used on the Y pipe end (which is where the hose usually blows off). The hose remains the same as does the clamp at the throttle body end.
Note: If the new clamp was the same as supplied on the hose then essentially there would be no need to provide it as a separate spare part, as once the hose blows off then it needs to be replaced anyway.
2. FYI. The hose has always been supplied as a spare part with the two clamps (one at either end).
3. I'm told the new separate clamp spare part is an up-rated clamp, used on the Y pipe end (which is where the hose usually blows off). The hose remains the same as does the clamp at the throttle body end.
Note: If the new clamp was the same as supplied on the hose then essentially there would be no need to provide it as a separate spare part, as once the hose blows off then it needs to be replaced anyway.
2. You are correct. The part number I gave on my original post is actually not a clamp, it is kind of paste. Post edited for correction.
3. Whoever told you did not read WE66 Porsche Workshop Campaign Technical Information Documents correctly.
03-19-2015, 01:45 AM
#15
1 It doesn't have to be blown off to eligible for replacement. Slightly out of place (= whole face not touching all the away around on the pressure pipe or throttle housing) must also be replaced.
2. You are correct. The part number I gave on my original post is actually not a clamp, it is kind of paste. Post edited for correction.
3. Whoever told you did not read WE66 Porsche Workshop Campaign Technical Information Documents correctly.
2. You are correct. The part number I gave on my original post is actually not a clamp, it is kind of paste. Post edited for correction.
3. Whoever told you did not read WE66 Porsche Workshop Campaign Technical Information Documents correctly.
2, Whether the part # you quoted is for a tube of paste or a body panel is neither here or there as the replacement clamp is different to the one supplied on the hose. I confirmed that again only just today. You see if the hose clamp was exactly the same then there would be no reason to remove it and change it.
3. The head tech here at the Porsche dealer, who did the campaign on my own vehicle, confirms a difference in the clamp now supplied separately to the hose assembly. But as you suggest, maybe he doesn't know what he is doing or talking about. Incidentally I have now had two separate techs and a head adviser say the new clamp is different to the one supplied on the hose assy so maybe they are all imagining it. Also, fwiw, the hose on my car had not blown off nor had been displaced in any way however, I was told the large clamp on the hose was removed and changed out for the new clamp now supplied separately and recommended to be used by Porsche. I also don't see any reason for any of these people (that I also know well) to be making up stories. I mean why what purpose would that serve?
