orthojoe

Yes, but according to some of the crazies here, pdk makes the car almost drive itself and is 2-3 seconds faster per lap. There are a bunch of people here who have no idea how much faster 2-3 seconds is. It is A LOT. 2-3 seconds makes up for a lot of driving deficiency. A car that drives itself and shifts fast enough make up 2-3 seconds is going lap faster than a better driver in a manual.

I'm hoping to get a chance next year to grab data and a chance to pull off lap times in both versions. I'm also betting motortrend will do a piece on it. I'm predicting 0.3 seconds on a 2:00 lap will be the difference, which is about one second on the ring. I also predict that anyone who thinks their pdk is 2-3 seconds faster is 2-3 seconds slower than me in a manual.

NateOZ

Joe - you should do some research on BoP adjustments for manual Porches vs PDK. I've not done it but I was told buy people involved in the testing for one series their recommendation was to allow manual Porches to increase their redline but no change for PDK. The difference varies by track, but it is there. PDK is also held back from the factory by PTV+ which can only be turned off aftermarket and using a proper mechanical LSD.

Guest89

What are you talking about?

There is no noteworthy series in the world in which manual or PDK factory cars race contemporaneously, apart from PCA Club Racing and Conti Tire (although in different classes). BOP activity pretty limited in Conti Tire too...

Spyder Man

Damn right! Prove to PDK drivers a manual car will still be faster because the driver is the main factor, not the choice of gearbox!

IPSA

Sounds like a gentleman's bet. I'll take 1.2 sec on a 2 minute lap.

Archimedes

True in terms of very skilled drivers, but in the real world of low-average skilled drivers, the PDK might make a much bigger difference in their lap time than in yours.

NateOZ

It was being done for Conti Tire (ST class I think), by a couple of drivers and a Porsche race shop. I don't watch/follow the series so never looked into it, hence my suggestion to research the BoP standards.

Guest89

There is no competition between Caymans with different transmissions.

GS = Cayman GT4, McLaren 570S GT4, etc.

ST = 987.2 Cayman that races against NC Miatas and Mini Coopers and Altimas

PhilT3 (PT3)

EXACTLY. Wtf?!?

That's disheartening.

orthojoe

I'm not saying there is no difference. In a highly competitive pro race environment where 0.3 seconds per lap makes a difference, PDK is an advantage for sure

Exactly! Comments like 'the car drives itself' really irk me. Once again, ignorant comments like that usually come from people who suck at driving.

Done! Now, to get myself a car. I'm being told next round of allocations.

For once I agree with you! Yes, PDK is a big help for the novices for sure. It's the blanket statements that drive me nuts. Once again, the cruddy drivers love to blame anything but themselves for their slow driving.

SCCAForums

I don't think he's contradicting himself. He stated from a 'dead stop'... the PDK will get out front due to the benefit of the launch.

From a roll, he's saying it's very close.

Best Regards,
Dave

orthojoe

Interesting. That is probably the source of confusion. Good pickup

TRAKCAR

Very cool, I agree.

Look forward to it Joe.
Somebody get Joe a manual stat!

But I see clutches and LSD's in your future (that's a lot of RPM and power sent through the driveline) and some additional point by's given..

I'm 2 seconds faster at Sebring in 991RS VS 997 4.0. Only mod on 4.0 was LSD..
And I shift slow, very slow because saving gearbox and clutch.
there's more down force and ediff as well. Manual might only account for a second or less!

I agree that driver is more likely to be the biggest variable but there are a lot of advantages in the PDK car comparo, so if you're going against DE guys that you're filing it out with now PDK VS PDK, I think you have no chance.

There's always an upshift on the limit, that one part where the car JUST runs out of gear before braking, etc.

1 second I bet is all you're losing but it is a LOT, both to find and to see the car in front leave you :-)

I won't, but I do hope you get a manual. You're much better at shifting then me rev matching helps save the clutch too.

I'm not getting PDK for the second a lap, I just like it more playing CUP / F1 driver :-) and durability without risk of a money shift.

Trk8

half a second per normal completed shift . manual vs pdk. =+1 pdk, base on data log.
lighter car in manual vs pdk= +1 manual.
more turns on track that requires more down/upshift = loss time=+1pdk.
that's probably why 0-60 is 3.2 vs 3.8 sec
Even with more hp it will be hard to lower time due to normal clutch/6spd tranny action.
the human factor = the limiting factor.
note: all my cars since 91 are manual. and as long as they make them I will be a buyer.
The challenge is what makes it a "sport" in a sport car.
What is fun about it, when everyone can make a "hole in 1" on every swing.

randr

Each to their own in the manual Vs PDK/PDK-S debate

My own rationale is fairly similar to TRAKCAR above

(1) PDK works in conjunction with PTV-E and RAS (manual is hooked to an old school lockable diff).
(2) As I have aged I'm fully aware my reaction times have dropped significantly - PDK allows me to better concentrate on lines and braking points
(3) PDK always maximises power under the curve
(4) PDK ensures you have two hands on the wheel
(5) The difference between PDK and manual at my local circuit is ~.5s to 1s per lap - consistently
(6) Over a three day tarmac rally PDK is worth 10s just on launches alone

Anyhow, I have seen too many blown engines, gear boxes, diffs etc - to be swayed back to a manual 500HP car where your clutch/gearbox/diffs are (literally) considered consumables. If its road duty thats a different matter and I fully understand why people would buy a manual. But the track environment is a different kettle of fish.