991 GT3 Concerned Owners Group
#181
Rennlist Member
R and RS G/G1 revision engines with DLC also applied to the camshaft still have mechanically high pressure interface with the followers, could be that all reach 186K miles engine life without fail, or not.
I doubt this effort has any negative effect on resale, anyone with even a passing interest in the GT3 already knows about both the rod bolt and valve train failures.
If this effort succeeds it could only be a positive.
I doubt this effort has any negative effect on resale, anyone with even a passing interest in the GT3 already knows about both the rod bolt and valve train failures.
If this effort succeeds it could only be a positive.
#182
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v3 of the shorter letter lacks punch. I understand the rationale behind shortening it, but too much impactful content seems to have been removed. If I was Porsche reading that letter, I'd say "what's the problem? If there are some issues, we will take care of them under warranty. And what's the evidence that the problem is widespread anyway?"
I think the letter needs to clearly and strongly express the worry about owning the car after the warranty expires and then having a major and costly engine failure with less than 100K miles on the car, due to a design defect.
I agree with the focus right now being on having a meeting and hearing Porsche's thoughts, rather than demanding a specific warranty extension or repair at this time.
I think the letter needs to clearly and strongly express the worry about owning the car after the warranty expires and then having a major and costly engine failure with less than 100K miles on the car, due to a design defect.
I agree with the focus right now being on having a meeting and hearing Porsche's thoughts, rather than demanding a specific warranty extension or repair at this time.
#183
Race Director
Thread Starter
v3 of the shorter letter lacks punch. I understand the rationale behind shortening it, but too much impactful content seems to have been removed. If I was Porsche reading that letter, I'd say "what's the problem? If there are some issues, we will take care of them under warranty. And what's the evidence that the problem is widespread anyway?"
I think the letter needs to clearly and strongly express the worry about owning the car after the warranty expires and then having a major and costly engine failure with less than 100K miles on the car, due to a design defect.
I agree with the focus right now being on having a meeting and hearing Porsche's thoughts, rather than demanding a specific warranty extension or repair at this time.
I think the letter needs to clearly and strongly express the worry about owning the car after the warranty expires and then having a major and costly engine failure with less than 100K miles on the car, due to a design defect.
I agree with the focus right now being on having a meeting and hearing Porsche's thoughts, rather than demanding a specific warranty extension or repair at this time.
We are talking about a lot of customers. It is not a stretch to say we could have 500 members by the end of May, maybe much sooner. It's a number they can't, and wouldn't ignore.
#184
Race Director
Thread Starter
Significant revisions to the OP. More aligned with the current direction. Also, now a sticky.
#185
Rennlist Member
Rob, how do you think Porsche will respond? When they finally agreed to meet with our group it did so only after a herculean effort by Sierra Mike. It was not something they readily agreed to.
As I have posted before, our group had considerable leverage because of the agreed to engine replacements by Porsche. Your group has nothing but maybe's or could happen.
if I had to guess as to what Porsche's response it would be one of two approaches. First, ignore the letter but I doubt they would do that. Second and most likely, indicate the cars are covered by warranty for the stated period and if there is a mechanical issue during that period, the warranty claim will be investigated and if appropriate repairs made. More than likely they will ignore your speculative after warranty failure assertions. They will not get trapped into addressing a problem which as far as they are concerned does not exist.
Set your expectations accordingly. That said, I wish you all the best of luck.
As I have posted before, our group had considerable leverage because of the agreed to engine replacements by Porsche. Your group has nothing but maybe's or could happen.
if I had to guess as to what Porsche's response it would be one of two approaches. First, ignore the letter but I doubt they would do that. Second and most likely, indicate the cars are covered by warranty for the stated period and if there is a mechanical issue during that period, the warranty claim will be investigated and if appropriate repairs made. More than likely they will ignore your speculative after warranty failure assertions. They will not get trapped into addressing a problem which as far as they are concerned does not exist.
Set your expectations accordingly. That said, I wish you all the best of luck.
#186
Technical Guru
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Does anyone know (offhand) roughly what the percentage is of non-tracked to tracked GT3 that have experienced this issue?
#187
Race Director
Thread Starter
Rob, how do you think Porsche will respond? When they finally agreed to meet with our group it did so only after a herculean effort by Sierra Mike. It was not something they readily agreed to.
As I have posted before, our group had considerable leverage because of the agreed to engine replacements by Porsche. Your group has nothing but maybe's or could happen.
if I had to guess as to what Porsche's response it would be one of two approaches. First, ignore the letter but I doubt they would do that. Second and most likely, indicate the cars are covered by warranty for the stated period and if there is a mechanical issue during that period, the warranty claim will be investigated and if appropriate repairs made. More than likely they will ignore your speculative after warranty failure assertions. They will not get trapped into addressing a problem which as far as they are concerned does not exist.
Set your expectations accordingly. That said, I wish you all the best of luck.
As I have posted before, our group had considerable leverage because of the agreed to engine replacements by Porsche. Your group has nothing but maybe's or could happen.
if I had to guess as to what Porsche's response it would be one of two approaches. First, ignore the letter but I doubt they would do that. Second and most likely, indicate the cars are covered by warranty for the stated period and if there is a mechanical issue during that period, the warranty claim will be investigated and if appropriate repairs made. More than likely they will ignore your speculative after warranty failure assertions. They will not get trapped into addressing a problem which as far as they are concerned does not exist.
Set your expectations accordingly. That said, I wish you all the best of luck.
Yeah, I doubt Porsche ignores our letter. I think hundreds of GT owners will get their attention, but who knows? I think the plan is just to get the letter out and see where it goes. We are asking them for a meeting to address our concerns.
I think it is an excellent opportunity for Porsche to provide more clarity. Ultimately our concerns are either valid (there is a problem), or they are not (there is a perception problem). This is not a hostile meeting, and I look forward to having a positive dialog with them. You know I am a big Porsche fan.
This is more about customer outreach at this point. I am not going to think of all the possible ways this becomes a dead end, because then you never start, right?
Let's see.
#188
Race Director
Thread Starter
Update: v4 of the letter has been updated.
#190
Race Director
Thread Starter
#192
Race Director
Thread Starter
#193
Racer
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I'm curious... if you think there is something wrong with your GT3, why not just take it to a Porsche dealership and have their service department look at it? It's covered under warranty, right?
Also, how many warranty claims have been approved for this exact defect? Is that information available? If I read your letter correctly, you're claiming excessive wear on a numerous non-tracked GT3's with under 5k miles... is that right?
Also, how many warranty claims have been approved for this exact defect? Is that information available? If I read your letter correctly, you're claiming excessive wear on a numerous non-tracked GT3's with under 5k miles... is that right?
#194
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Can't just have the dealer open up the engine out of concern about a problem which isn't evident on a particular car. There's cost involved, and also warranty implications if the engine internals are tampered with.
#195
Race Director
Thread Starter
We have examples of cars with very minimal usage experiencing this problem. Hence...the Concerned Owners Group.