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But it's only when you walk around
Porsche's Zuffenhausen like I did
yesterday that you get an idea of
just how big & daring their expansion
plans are all about! Simply amazing!
In the next part of my report, I'll
have more to say as for the reason
this investment is being made in
an already crowded & congested
Zuffenhausen & not in Leipzig,
where PAG has a lot more room
to grow!
***************************
Originally Posted by mcsmcs1
I send you all the way to Germany
for PTS intel, and all you have for
me are landscape photos?
Sorry boss! But I am doing my best
& I am stlll getting no further than
my boyhood hero Sgt. Schultz!
Interesting. When I picked up my car last year, the story line was "many of our buildings are historical and protected, and we don't have any room to grow!". There were some great cars parked in that lot that is now a huge hole.
Glad I was lucky enough to make it happen last year....
A shame they are changing it. When I was there last summer it was nice to look through the windows at Werk I (?) when touring the line and see all of the cars fresh out of the factory just sitting in those collection areas. Had a cool, intimate feel. I'm sure the new facility will be impressive, especially those overhead transport lines.
I was just there 4/7, did the factory tour, and was extremely impressed. Our cars are designed and built very well. From what I was told, the current Zuffenhausen facility is about at its maximum. Every Porsche owner should visit Stuttgart and see the cars being made. I also visited the museum, which was cool, of course. I don't have much to add to Eduardo's extensive report, though watching how the cars come together, and how "just in time" everything works, was amazing.
Part II of my Report on the Visit to Zuffenhausen / April 2017
Originally Posted by otisdog
When I picked up my car last year, the story line was
"many of our buildings are historical and protected,
and we don't have any room to grow!"...
Originally Posted by signes
A shame they are changing it. When I was there last
summer it was nice to look through the windows at
Werk I ? (*Clarification: Assembly 'Line' is at Werk II)
when touring the line and see all of the cars fresh out
of the factory just sitting in those collection areas. Had
a cool, intimate feel. I'm sure the new facility will be
impressive, especially those overhead transport lines.
Originally Posted by jsaviano
From what I was told, the current Zuffenhausen
facility is about at its maximum. .
Here is the 'dirty little secret' about why this massive
investment by Porsche is being done at a crowded &
congested Zuffenhausen & not in Leipzig where they
have plenty of wide open fields in which to 'grow'!
The labor representatives on Porsche's board insisted
that expansion be first done in Zuffenhausen to provide
the jobs there...rather than in Leipzig. And because of
the German corporate structure & laws, the labor
representatives have enormous power in the German
version of 'capitalism'.
I reported at Rennlist after my visit in 2015 that I had
heard reports from my contacts in Zuffenhausen of
massive purchases of land & buildings on the other
side of the railroad tracks across from the Porsche
Museum by PAG. In the map below, it would be the
area bordering LorenzStrasse & WaldheimStrasse:
On the north side of the tracks, on Otto Dürr Strasse,
there is a big Porsche building construction project
next (or back of) the existing Porsche Zentrum:
Just two years ago, this is what I could see from
that vantage view (now blocked by new construction):
The scale of new construction at Porsche Zuffenhausen
is massive. And they have more space to grow in the
old industrial areas across the S-bahn rail tracks around
LorenzStrasse & WaldheimStrasse!
****
In contrast, here is what Porsche at Leipzig looks like:
Room to grow in every direction & with direct rail
access so it can transport production easily to ports
for its exports! Here is a shot I took of the areas
owned by PAG around Leipzig from the vantage
view of their 'tower' restaurant:
****
There is one more piece of the puzzle you all need to know.
Besides the power of the labor component for pushing
the Mission E production to Zuffenhausen rather the
more obvious choice of Leipzig, there is something else
going on. And it is 'big'...and maybe unsettling to some
of you reading this report. Do you remember this PAG
marketing theme from the last few years. They had all
sort of apparel branded this way:
In strategic planning terms, the gasoline fueled & motor
powered sportscars currently produced at Zuffenhausen
are on life-support. The future is Mission E & all the off-shoots
of that new 'Green' technology to be developed & used
by Porsche. The company's sport car 'jewels', the 991
& 718, are 'Made in Zuffenhausen'. And the 356s & early
911s that gave Porsche their past glory were also 'Made
in Zuffenhausen'. And so, friends, Porsche will also make
the future 'jewels' of the company, the star performers,
not at Leipzig but at the historic epicenter of the company's
glorious past. So expansion plan in crowded Zuffenhausen
is not 100% about the power of labor at Porsche. The Porsche
Board also sees a 'silver lining' in this massive investment
cloud being built in this suburb of Stuttgart...& not in Leipzig.
The future of Porsche, albeit an electric one, will also be
'Made in Zuffenhausen'. And they might be right. But it
also makes me a little bit sad to realize it after all I have
seen being built in that place since my first visit in 1981!
Do you also know why Leipzig is not expanded
to build more SUVs? The assembly of Cayennes
has been moved to Slovakia. With so much land
in Leipzig, it would have benn easily expanded
to assemble Cayennes, Macans and Panameras.
It's a bit complicated. The only model built from
scratch* in Leipzig is the Macan, which was the last
new product line developed. The Cayenne has been
welded, painted & partially assembled in Bratislava
Slovakia since day one. Cayennes initial production
space at the massive VW facility in Slovakia is shared
with the VW Touareg, Audi Q7 & the Bentley Bentayga!
Former Porsche CEO Wendelin Wiedeking had plans
to let the Cayenne be completely built in Slovakia &
exported to all markets from there. He wanted to
make room in Leipzig for the Panamera & future
models like the Mission E. But that plan is now
apparently discarded (or delayed) by the new
management at PAG. Part of it is Porsche wants
to make everyone believe that the Cayenne is made
(mostly) in Germany at Leipzig. So final assembly
will continue to be at that location & not Bratislava.
Just as 'Made in Zuffenhausen' is part of the Porsche
myth, 'Made in Germany' is the next best alternative
for any other model built by Porsche. 'Made in Slovakia'
doesn't have the same ring to it!
The Panamera has been welded & painted at a VW
plant in Hanover since day one. It arrives in Leipzig
much less completed than the Cayenne...but it still
doesn't start life at Leipzig. However, I believe PAG
will go ahead, if it has not already done so, and built
the Panamera entirely in Leipzig like it does now with
the Macan. They can have better quality control &
cost effectiveness if they do the Panamera entirely
in-house...and depend less in another VW Group
organization. Last year we saw all Cayman production
transferred to Zuffenhausen from the VW Group's
'Karmann' plant at Osnabrück. And as you might
also recall, pre-981 Boxsters & Caymans were built
also in some numbers in Finland under contract with
Valmet from 1997 to 2011. But finally last year, PAG
was able to increase production efficiencies at its
Zuffenhausen facilities to around 250 cars a day.
And that allowed them to be able to build all 991
& 718 in Zuffenhausen.
It is easy to see all the stages of assembly in
Leipzig. And the only truly long assembly line
is the Macan. Next in length is the Panamera.
And the Cayenne, at least when I was last
there in July of 2015, is pretty advanced by
the time it gets off the rail cars & enters the
assembly line at Leipzig!
Regardless, PAG has plenty of room to grow
in Leipzig. And now that the Stuttgart-based
labor councils have gotten their way with the
Mission E plant in Zuffenhausen, it's Leipzig's
unions turn to bring home the 'Speck'..if you
get my drift.
Saludos,
Eduardo
Regensburg, Bavaria
*Exception: All gasoline engines are built in
Zuffenhausen for all Porsche models. Hybrids
& Diesels are the exception & built by another
VW group (Audi I think).
Great info again, Eduardo. When I was in Leipzig last summer, I got the feeling from the people there (mostly our guide) that they felt like they were looked down upon by Porsche in Stuttgart. Maybe remnants of being on the wrong side of the Wall... They went out of their way to show that the CGT was built there and that they felt like, due to the expansion room available, that they were the future of PAG manufacturing. Clearly not... I seem to recall the production lines being intermingled with Panamera, Macan and Cayenne, but it was surprising to see the ratio of Macan to Cayenne being produced (seemed like 3:1).
I try to forget about the trend towards electrification and automation, sad to see reminders that the future is being written now. Although if any car will hold out the longest, seems like the 911 has the best shot!
It is easy to see all the stages of assembly in
Leipzig. And the only truly long assembly line
is the Macan. Next in length is the Panamera.
And the Cayenne, at least when I was last
there in July of 2015, is pretty advanced by
the time it gets off the rail cars & enters the
assembly line at Leipzig!
Originally Posted by signes
...I seem to recall the production lines being
intermingled with Panamera, Macan and Cayenne,
but it was surprising to see the ratio of Macan to
Cayenne being produced (seemed like 3:1).
Excuse my poor writing in that part of my last post
(quoted above). The Leipzig production lines are
indeed intermingled with all three models...but
only as each model joins the assembly lines. So
in the final production lines, you see all three
models coming down in procession!
But each model starts (arrives or join) the Leipzig
assembly lines at different points, depending how
far each model got done at the previous production
plant (if any). In the case of the Cayenne, it is just
after the 'marriage' between the chassis & its power
train. That is how far the Cayenne got put together
in Bratislava. In the case of the Panamera, until the
painted shell left the VW owned facility in Hanover.
That is how far the Panameras were done there. In
the case of the Macan at Leipzig, from the first stampings
of the rolled steel! So in that sense, the model that
has the longest time at the Leipzig in its assembly lines
is the Macan, followed by the Panamera (at least in
2015) & finally the Cayenne last. Sorry I did not
make that all more clear in my actual post.
Originally Posted by Z356
Great info again, Eduardo. When I was in Leipzig
last summer, I got the feeling from the people
there (mostly our guide) that they felt like they
were looked down upon by Porsche in Stuttgart.
Maybe remnants of being on the wrong side of
the Wall... They went out of their way to show
that the CGT was built there and that they felt
like, due to the expansion room available, that
they were the future of PAG manufacturing.
There is a lot of truth in that. And it would not
surprise me if those were the vibes you got from
your tour guides at Leipzig. That attitude was
not detected by me in my guide back in 2015,
but I can see how those originally born & raised
in the former East Germany feel that way.
04-19-2017, 02:33 AM
