Alternative to 991 GT3?
07-31-2016, 09:30 PM
#46
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Turbo or Turbo S. Do not listen to "boring" comments - it can do what a GT3 can do with almost as much precision and it's faster. It's only boring at 2/10 because the engine makes almost no noise then. It will also last just as many laps as a GT3.
AMG GT S has better sound and looks cooler, but more lag, noticeably slower, worse transmission. I could see it getting over Turbo for city & back roads driving but not for track or mixed use. NISMO is hard to make a case for vs. Turbo - about as fast for about the same money, but less longevity, worse engine noise and cost or running it, looks worse to most people, and not nearly as nice in daily life.
Also, Z06 and the new R8 are interesting options - both seems to have a strong pros with some, hopefully minor/solvable cons.
If I were pressed to find an alternative to GT3, I'd go for GT4. If not that, then AMG GT R, Huracan Superleggera or Turbo S. 570 is cool too, but scares me with running costs if tracked often (maybe it's just me), and its lag seems worse than Turbo or AMG.
AMG GT S has better sound and looks cooler, but more lag, noticeably slower, worse transmission. I could see it getting over Turbo for city & back roads driving but not for track or mixed use. NISMO is hard to make a case for vs. Turbo - about as fast for about the same money, but less longevity, worse engine noise and cost or running it, looks worse to most people, and not nearly as nice in daily life.
Also, Z06 and the new R8 are interesting options - both seems to have a strong pros with some, hopefully minor/solvable cons.
If I were pressed to find an alternative to GT3, I'd go for GT4. If not that, then AMG GT R, Huracan Superleggera or Turbo S. 570 is cool too, but scares me with running costs if tracked often (maybe it's just me), and its lag seems worse than Turbo or AMG.
08-01-2016, 01:44 AM
#47
Burning Brakes
Turbo or Turbo S. Do not listen to "boring" comments - it can do what a GT3 can do with almost as much precision and it's faster. It's only boring at 2/10 because the engine makes almost no noise then. It will also last just as many laps as a GT3.
AMG GT S has better sound and looks cooler, but more lag, noticeably slower, worse transmission. I could see it getting over Turbo for city & back roads driving but not for track or mixed use. NISMO is hard to make a case for vs. Turbo - about as fast for about the same money, but less longevity, worse engine noise and cost or running it, looks worse to most people, and not nearly as nice in daily life.
Also, Z06 and the new R8 are interesting options - both seems to have a strong pros with some, hopefully minor/solvable cons.
If I were pressed to find an alternative to GT3, I'd go for GT4. If not that, then AMG GT R, Huracan Superleggera or Turbo S. 570 is cool too, but scares me with running costs if tracked often (maybe it's just me), and its lag seems worse than Turbo or AMG.
AMG GT S has better sound and looks cooler, but more lag, noticeably slower, worse transmission. I could see it getting over Turbo for city & back roads driving but not for track or mixed use. NISMO is hard to make a case for vs. Turbo - about as fast for about the same money, but less longevity, worse engine noise and cost or running it, looks worse to most people, and not nearly as nice in daily life.
Also, Z06 and the new R8 are interesting options - both seems to have a strong pros with some, hopefully minor/solvable cons.
If I were pressed to find an alternative to GT3, I'd go for GT4. If not that, then AMG GT R, Huracan Superleggera or Turbo S. 570 is cool too, but scares me with running costs if tracked often (maybe it's just me), and its lag seems worse than Turbo or AMG.
I was surprised, the AMG seems to have to no lag at all during all my days of driving it... As for your other two negatives ....noticeably slower and worse transmission ...I have never driven a 991 turbo or turbo S so I have only what's available online to compare
You piqued my curiousity, I spent some time trying to find out some facts about the above.
Perhaps you have driven both vehicles and it is your well informed experience, this is to be respected as I only have driven one and read about the other...?
If you have driven both cars as well as the others my hats off to you, you are certainly more qualified to opine than me.
I found this to be an interesting review of the the 2 along with the Nissan GTR
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/merce...-r-comparison/
Either way, I hope you enjoy your car and the OP is able to key in on the info that helps him buy a car he really loves
08-01-2016, 03:14 PM
#48
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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I read your comments about the AMG GT S having "more lag, noticeably slower, worse transmission."
I was surprised, the AMG seems to have to no lag at all during all my days of driving it... As for your other two negatives ....noticeably slower and worse transmission ...I have never driven a 991 turbo or turbo S so I have only what's available online to compare
You piqued my curiousity, I spent some time trying to find out some facts about the above.
Perhaps you have driven both vehicles and it is your well informed experience, this is to be respected as I only have driven one and read about the other...?
If you have driven both cars as well as the others my hats off to you, you are certainly more qualified to opine than me.
I found this to be an interesting review of the the 2 along with the Nissan GTR
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/merce...-r-comparison/
Either way, I hope you enjoy your car and the OP is able to key in on the info that helps him buy a car he really loves
I was surprised, the AMG seems to have to no lag at all during all my days of driving it... As for your other two negatives ....noticeably slower and worse transmission ...I have never driven a 991 turbo or turbo S so I have only what's available online to compare
You piqued my curiousity, I spent some time trying to find out some facts about the above.
Perhaps you have driven both vehicles and it is your well informed experience, this is to be respected as I only have driven one and read about the other...?
If you have driven both cars as well as the others my hats off to you, you are certainly more qualified to opine than me.
I found this to be an interesting review of the the 2 along with the Nissan GTR
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/merce...-r-comparison/
Either way, I hope you enjoy your car and the OP is able to key in on the info that helps him buy a car he really loves
But the OPs question emphasized track use, and there AMG does everything almost as good as Turbo but sometimes not quite as good. AMG GT S is easier to get to the limit and to start sliding, because it's a front-mid platform with 50/50 weight and higher inertia. But most other things Turbo does (very) slightly better. People like to be critical of Turbo because it's not the GT3, but for 991 generation it's almost as good at everything and is actually faster.
Similarly with reviews - no one wants to read or write another review saying that Turbo does everything perfectly, because it's old news. So they just write few words about it and move on to other cars. Just like the first paragraphs of this review - we tested turbo first, it was perfect, let's see if others can come close. And then excitement about GT S coming close. Also, everyone likes underdog. Once journos pit AMG GT S against "lower" 911s, the tune changes a bit: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test or http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cult...s-porsche-911/
There is also the element of AMG GT S making you feel like you are working the car when not close to the limit. But ultimately any car behaves like that when you get it to its real limit, but sometimes the limit is just too high. In my opinion, this does not need to be engineered into the car if you are serious about track driving it. Several of my friends got GT S, and those who got them for track eventually sold them because it's more exciting to take a seemingly unflappable car and put it on the ragged edge so that it feels like a jet ski, rather than drive a car where that jet ski feel is engineered-in for you. On the other hand, on a public road neither car will come close to its real limits, so in practical non-track use GT S will indeed be the more exciting car most of the time.
I did have a chance to drive both cars on track and road (991.1 turbo s, not 991.2 yet), but not extensively, and I'd be happy with either.
Both have turbo lag, and both are among the best at minimizing it. Both have minimal plumbing between engine and turbos (hot-v set up in AMG), with porsche also using variable turbo geometry and in 991.2 ignition cut off instead of throttle closure to keep engine pumping air and spooling the turbo even off throttle. But both still have some lag. Just like this guy says here (go to 3:17):
Anyway, do not get me wrong - AMG GT S is a brilliant car and is a ton of fun, in some cases more than other options, which is the most important part. No one here (well, almost) is paid for better lap times.
08-01-2016, 10:56 PM
#49
Burning Brakes
Do not get me wrong - AMG GT S is a great car, and I would buy one if I had space and time to drive it, and I may still get the R version of it. It does look and sound better than Turbo, in my opinion.
But the OPs question emphasized track use, and there AMG does everything almost as good as Turbo but sometimes not quite as good. AMG GT S is easier to get to the limit and to start sliding, because it's a front-mid platform with 50/50 weight and higher inertia. But most other things Turbo does (very) slightly better. People like to be critical of Turbo because it's not the GT3, but for 991 generation it's almost as good at everything and is actually faster.
Similarly with reviews - no one wants to read or write another review saying that Turbo does everything perfectly, because it's old news. So they just write few words about it and move on to other cars. Just like the first paragraphs of this review - we tested turbo first, it was perfect, let's see if others can come close. And then excitement about GT S coming close. Also, everyone likes underdog. Once journos pit AMG GT S against "lower" 911s, the tune changes a bit: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test or http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cult...s-porsche-911/
There is also the element of AMG GT S making you feel like you are working the car when not close to the limit. But ultimately any car behaves like that when you get it to its real limit, but sometimes the limit is just too high. In my opinion, this does not need to be engineered into the car if you are serious about track driving it. Several of my friends got GT S, and those who got them for track eventually sold them because it's more exciting to take a seemingly unflappable car and put it on the ragged edge so that it feels like a jet ski, rather than drive a car where that jet ski feel is engineered-in for you. On the other hand, on a public road neither car will come close to its real limits, so in practical non-track use GT S will indeed be the more exciting car most of the time.
I did have a chance to drive both cars on track and road (991.1 turbo s, not 991.2 yet), but not extensively, and I'd be happy with either.
Both have turbo lag, and both are among the best at minimizing it. Both have minimal plumbing between engine and turbos (hot-v set up in AMG), with porsche also using variable turbo geometry and in 991.2 ignition cut off instead of throttle closure to keep engine pumping air and spooling the turbo even off throttle. But both still have some lag. Just like this guy says here (go to 3:17): 2017 Porsche 911 Carrera: Is the Addition of Two Turbos One Step Too Far? - Ignition Ep. 156 - YouTube
Anyway, do not get me wrong - AMG GT S is a brilliant car and is a ton of fun, in some cases more than other options, which is the most important part. No one here (well, almost) is paid for better lap times.
But the OPs question emphasized track use, and there AMG does everything almost as good as Turbo but sometimes not quite as good. AMG GT S is easier to get to the limit and to start sliding, because it's a front-mid platform with 50/50 weight and higher inertia. But most other things Turbo does (very) slightly better. People like to be critical of Turbo because it's not the GT3, but for 991 generation it's almost as good at everything and is actually faster.
Similarly with reviews - no one wants to read or write another review saying that Turbo does everything perfectly, because it's old news. So they just write few words about it and move on to other cars. Just like the first paragraphs of this review - we tested turbo first, it was perfect, let's see if others can come close. And then excitement about GT S coming close. Also, everyone likes underdog. Once journos pit AMG GT S against "lower" 911s, the tune changes a bit: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test or http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cult...s-porsche-911/
There is also the element of AMG GT S making you feel like you are working the car when not close to the limit. But ultimately any car behaves like that when you get it to its real limit, but sometimes the limit is just too high. In my opinion, this does not need to be engineered into the car if you are serious about track driving it. Several of my friends got GT S, and those who got them for track eventually sold them because it's more exciting to take a seemingly unflappable car and put it on the ragged edge so that it feels like a jet ski, rather than drive a car where that jet ski feel is engineered-in for you. On the other hand, on a public road neither car will come close to its real limits, so in practical non-track use GT S will indeed be the more exciting car most of the time.
I did have a chance to drive both cars on track and road (991.1 turbo s, not 991.2 yet), but not extensively, and I'd be happy with either.
Both have turbo lag, and both are among the best at minimizing it. Both have minimal plumbing between engine and turbos (hot-v set up in AMG), with porsche also using variable turbo geometry and in 991.2 ignition cut off instead of throttle closure to keep engine pumping air and spooling the turbo even off throttle. But both still have some lag. Just like this guy says here (go to 3:17): 2017 Porsche 911 Carrera: Is the Addition of Two Turbos One Step Too Far? - Ignition Ep. 156 - YouTube
Anyway, do not get me wrong - AMG GT S is a brilliant car and is a ton of fun, in some cases more than other options, which is the most important part. No one here (well, almost) is paid for better lap times.
I bought my AMG for street only, so I take what you wrote as very informative.
For street, the AMG is great fun.
08-02-2016, 06:51 AM
#50
Three Wheelin'
I saw and touched the green monster AMG GTR in the flesh last weekend at Spa Francorchamps. That one may lure me away from the 2017 GT3 !
08-02-2016, 07:56 AM
#51
Rennlist Member
nothing will be a GT3
GTR I think will be your closest bet. It feels planted, seating position is very good and reliable
AMG GTS , I like it but the seating position is a little off, and the nose feels long, reminded me of Z 06. It needs better tires.I think in straight line is faster than GT3.
Audi R8 is more expensive than GT3
M3 is a great car but nothing to compare to GT3.
I'll take the new cayman 718 GTS, with PDK , probably will be a blast to drive .cheaper than other options too .
F type R the new version with awd is much better handling than rwd older version but more of a cruiser than track car. not sure how reliable
GTR I think will be your closest bet. It feels planted, seating position is very good and reliable
AMG GTS , I like it but the seating position is a little off, and the nose feels long, reminded me of Z 06. It needs better tires.I think in straight line is faster than GT3.
Audi R8 is more expensive than GT3
M3 is a great car but nothing to compare to GT3.
I'll take the new cayman 718 GTS, with PDK , probably will be a blast to drive .cheaper than other options too .
F type R the new version with awd is much better handling than rwd older version but more of a cruiser than track car. not sure how reliable
08-02-2016, 04:12 PM
#52
Burning Brakes
nothing will be a GT3
GTR I think will be your closest bet. It feels planted, seating position is very good and reliable
AMG GTS , I like it but the seating position is a little off, and the nose feels long, reminded me of Z 06. It needs better tires.I think in straight line is faster than GT3.
Audi R8 is more expensive than GT3
M3 is a great car but nothing to compare to GT3.
I'll take the new cayman 718 GTS, with PDK , probably will be a blast to drive .cheaper than other options too .
F type R the new version with awd is much better handling than rwd older version but more of a cruiser than track car. not sure how reliable
GTR I think will be your closest bet. It feels planted, seating position is very good and reliable
AMG GTS , I like it but the seating position is a little off, and the nose feels long, reminded me of Z 06. It needs better tires.I think in straight line is faster than GT3.
Audi R8 is more expensive than GT3
M3 is a great car but nothing to compare to GT3.
I'll take the new cayman 718 GTS, with PDK , probably will be a blast to drive .cheaper than other options too .
F type R the new version with awd is much better handling than rwd older version but more of a cruiser than track car. not sure how reliable
08-04-2016, 07:45 AM
#54
Three Wheelin'
amg gtr