991 GT3 by Getawayer
09-13-2014, 01:12 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
He's a geek! I loved it.
09-14-2014, 01:12 PM
#21
Race Director
The only thing I am still debating is the steering. In my review, I posted, I said I needed more time on this point. Now, I am splitting hairs here but my 997.2 Turbo's steering was better and one of the best steering sports cars I have owned. The steering is fine in the GT3 but I really think they could of maybe done a little better. I just do not really know how to convey what I mean. I find it a little loose/light. I may be would like it a little heavier but not at the sacrifice of being numb like the R8.
09-14-2014, 01:40 PM
#22
Three Wheelin'
I have a 991 C4S at present. The feel, what is actually perceptible, through the wheel, is quite good. What has decreased is the sense of weight when moving the wheel which is so noticeable that it tends to overwhelm all other inputs from the steering. Decreasing the weight of the steering feel has been ongoing for Porsche since power steering was added for the 964. In my experience the steering in my 986 was better than in my 997.2.
09-14-2014, 02:59 PM
#25
I have a 991 C4S at present. The feel, what is actually perceptible, through the wheel, is quite good. What has decreased is the sense of weight when moving the wheel which is so noticeable that it tends to overwhelm all other inputs from the steering. Decreasing the weight of the steering feel has been ongoing for Porsche since power steering was added for the 964. In my experience the steering in my 986 was better than in my 997.2.
The first 991 S we've had for 15K miles, is junk. The 991 GT3 is leagues ahead, but it's still junk. I don't think it's the front end geometry or the weight of the car, the length of the wheelbase or the rear-steer (which I barely notice except when it seems to work very hard at keeping the car neutral at around 40 mph with significant steering angles, so I think I'm noticing it transition from "crab" to "radius" mode) but it's just the damn electrics and programming -- until they somehow build a virtual reality for the electric steering, they just need to use hydraulics.
One solution for the steering in a cake-and-eat-it with fuel economy and third party equipment vendors wanting to build one product and sell it to all car makers, would be to just turn off the electric assist and decouple it completely above about 40 mph. Have it like panic-brake-assist modes -- if someone is apparently panicking for steering control, re-invoke the electric assist so they can perform their collision avoidance or whatever. Fine by me. Otherwise, for any condition you might experience, just have yet another switch on the center console saying "economy" steering or "manual" steering. Something like that.
09-14-2014, 03:12 PM
#26
Nordschleife Master
Time to re-calibrate ?
09-14-2014, 03:45 PM
#27
Anyway, if your 996 is as good as it looks in your forum avatar, it will sell at a premium price to a lucky owner who should offer you first right of refusal to take it back after their good stewardship, should you come to your senses. : )
People who should really be banging their head against a brick wall about getting the 991 GT3 would be currently tracking a 997 RS. Anyone with a 996 or 997 GT3 or RS on the road would very likely prefer the 991 GT3 (assuming all else is within bounds, after all, the 991 is a bigger 911, so again, comparing it to a 997 involves some arbitrary shifting of perspective.) For example, I'm about to drive a full week of 120 miles+ per day and then a full day at Laguna. In the 991 GT3, this is going to be a lot of fun and very enjoyable motoring when I'm just covering miles and relaxing (house hunting, being the cause for so much driving this week ... and all over San Francisco's disgusting pothole network that pretends to be a first world country but comes a pitiful second to Bangladesh, the slums of Delhi or the Camel Trophy through Borneo ... comes to mind.) In the 997.2 RS 3.8, this same week would be utter madness, deafening cabin noise, irritable engine, nose-scraping ground clearance (still probably an issue in the GT3, but so be it) and generally unpleasant clutch-slipping tedium in slow-n-go traffic up and down precipitous cliff-like staircases with stop signs used as "advisory" suggestions to slow below 30 mph while passing through intersections. In the 991 GT3, the radio is good enough for NPR while PDK takes care of the slow-n-go, then a moment of clear road can be enjoyed with a spirited -- yet socially acceptable -- use of the loud pedal where the 997 RS would still be irritable and reined in because it just can't do its thing without a race track.
09-14-2014, 04:09 PM
#28
Nordschleife Master
There's no way of making these comparisons absolutes. If the objective were to win some imaginary race series where the two competed for real money and real motorsport glory, sure, the 991GT3 would have to carry (another) 300lbs of ballast just to make a competition out of it.
Anyway, if your 996 is as good as it looks in your forum avatar, it will sell at a premium price to a lucky owner who should offer you first right of refusal to take it back after their good stewardship, should you come to your senses. : )
People who should really be banging their head against a brick wall about getting the 991 GT3 would be currently tracking a 997 RS. Anyone with a 996 or 997 GT3 or RS on the road would very likely prefer the 991 GT3 (assuming all else is within bounds, after all, the 991 is a bigger 911, so again, comparing it to a 997 involves some arbitrary shifting of perspective.) For example, I'm about to drive a full week of 120 miles+ per day and then a full day at Laguna. In the 991 GT3, this is going to be a lot of fun and very enjoyable motoring when I'm just covering miles and relaxing (house hunting, being the cause for so much driving this week ... and all over San Francisco's disgusting pothole network that pretends to be a first world country but comes a pitiful second to Bangladesh, the slums of Delhi or the Camel Trophy through Borneo ... comes to mind.) In the 997.2 RS 3.8, this same week would be utter madness, deafening cabin noise, irritable engine, nose-scraping ground clearance (still probably an issue in the GT3, but so be it) and generally unpleasant clutch-slipping tedium in slow-n-go traffic up and down precipitous cliff-like staircases with stop signs used as "advisory" suggestions to slow below 30 mph while passing through intersections. In the 991 GT3, the radio is good enough for NPR while PDK takes care of the slow-n-go, then a moment of clear road can be enjoyed with a spirited -- yet socially acceptable -- use of the loud pedal where the 997 RS would still be irritable and reined in because it just can't do its thing without a race track.
Anyway, if your 996 is as good as it looks in your forum avatar, it will sell at a premium price to a lucky owner who should offer you first right of refusal to take it back after their good stewardship, should you come to your senses. : )
People who should really be banging their head against a brick wall about getting the 991 GT3 would be currently tracking a 997 RS. Anyone with a 996 or 997 GT3 or RS on the road would very likely prefer the 991 GT3 (assuming all else is within bounds, after all, the 991 is a bigger 911, so again, comparing it to a 997 involves some arbitrary shifting of perspective.) For example, I'm about to drive a full week of 120 miles+ per day and then a full day at Laguna. In the 991 GT3, this is going to be a lot of fun and very enjoyable motoring when I'm just covering miles and relaxing (house hunting, being the cause for so much driving this week ... and all over San Francisco's disgusting pothole network that pretends to be a first world country but comes a pitiful second to Bangladesh, the slums of Delhi or the Camel Trophy through Borneo ... comes to mind.) In the 997.2 RS 3.8, this same week would be utter madness, deafening cabin noise, irritable engine, nose-scraping ground clearance (still probably an issue in the GT3, but so be it) and generally unpleasant clutch-slipping tedium in slow-n-go traffic up and down precipitous cliff-like staircases with stop signs used as "advisory" suggestions to slow below 30 mph while passing through intersections. In the 991 GT3, the radio is good enough for NPR while PDK takes care of the slow-n-go, then a moment of clear road can be enjoyed with a spirited -- yet socially acceptable -- use of the loud pedal where the 997 RS would still be irritable and reined in because it just can't do its thing without a race track.
09-14-2014, 04:24 PM
#29
Race Director
Carrera GT, I agree with most of your analysis, but your statement that the 991 GT3 steering is "junk" is grossly overstated IMO. From my own experience to reviews like the one at the top of this thread and virtually every other I've seen, while there is a difference in degree between the EM steering and the previous hydraulic rack, to say it's "junk" gives a totally inaccurate impression.
09-14-2014, 04:54 PM
#30
Carrera GT, I agree with most of your analysis, but your statement that the 991 GT3 steering is "junk" is grossly overstated IMO. From my own experience to reviews like the one at the top of this thread and virtually every other I've seen, while there is a difference in degree between the EM steering and the previous hydraulic rack, to say it's "junk" gives a totally inaccurate impression.
: )