On track experiences and video's 991 GT3 only.
07-26-2014, 08:57 AM
#138
07-26-2014, 06:39 PM
#139
Rennlist Member
Im happy to learn how to drive at the track using the manual mode. Im sure it will add an element of challenge. However the auto mode allows me to spend time on the lines and the braking points. this car is going much quicker turning technical manouvours than my 993 so its a bit to adust to. Once Ive done that I think a switch to manual will be worth loosing a hand full of 10th second around the track for the extra involvement...
07-26-2014, 06:50 PM
#140
07-27-2014, 08:14 PM
#141
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On track, you can't beat auto. I had a professional instructor drive my car in January and he used manual mode. While his downshifts were all on the money (possibly more aggressive than the auto mode), he rarely upshifted at precisely 9,000 RPM (I was watching the tach). Usually 100-300 less. Not sure if that would make a difference BUT to get the extra push from upshifts, you have to be as close as possible to 9,000. We didn't compare lap times with auto vs manual but I suspect that auto, in professionals' hands, may be a hair faster. In my hands, there is no doubt auto is faster. So on track, I always drive in auto (and I have a feeling most of us would do the same) because it allows you to focus on so much more but on the street, I am always in manual mode and that is FUN.
Nice shout out.https://www.facebook.com/pages/Jason...072821?fref=nf
07-27-2014, 08:39 PM
#142
This is funny and it was from today (video coming). Now that I have a few more track miles and more tire wear, I have the following observations:
1-Front tires are worn (3 hard track days) and the INSIDE is worn more.
2-The rears show less wear and the OUTSIDE is worn more.
3-Jason thought the car was twitchy and understeerd at corner entry as well having a tendency to snap over steer at some corner exits.
4-Rotors have minimal cracking and I am at my 8th track day total but it is not an excessively fast track (max speed that I reached 130mph)
5-The car does not come close to overheating. It hit 101 F (38-ish C) today and with 30 minute sessions, engine oil temp never exceeded 230 F (110 C).
I will make the following changes and see what happens:
1-Decrease front negative camber from -3.1 to -2.8
2-Increase rear negative camber from -2.5 to -2.7
3-He recommended increasing front pitch by 5 mm, so I will lower the front by 2.5 mm and raise the rear by 2.5 mm.
1-Front tires are worn (3 hard track days) and the INSIDE is worn more.
2-The rears show less wear and the OUTSIDE is worn more.
3-Jason thought the car was twitchy and understeerd at corner entry as well having a tendency to snap over steer at some corner exits.
4-Rotors have minimal cracking and I am at my 8th track day total but it is not an excessively fast track (max speed that I reached 130mph)
5-The car does not come close to overheating. It hit 101 F (38-ish C) today and with 30 minute sessions, engine oil temp never exceeded 230 F (110 C).
I will make the following changes and see what happens:
1-Decrease front negative camber from -3.1 to -2.8
2-Increase rear negative camber from -2.5 to -2.7
3-He recommended increasing front pitch by 5 mm, so I will lower the front by 2.5 mm and raise the rear by 2.5 mm.
07-27-2014, 09:03 PM
#144
MINOR. At this rate, they seem to be holding much better that the C4S's did. I replaced rotors 3 times on the latter car and that was despite using Pagids! I am not concerned. My understanding is that cracking is OK unless deep or all the way out. Someone mentioned 6 track days for rotors but my experience is different.
07-27-2014, 09:24 PM
#145
Rennlist Member
Do u think the rws steering is making the front tires work more which is probably a good thing on these Porsches. Too bad u can't lock it and see if wear is the same up front. Hope the less camber upfront will help with the wear. What's the toe for the front? If oem steelies my 6 started cracking after 2 trackdays. Doesn't bother me as long their not connecting or traveling to outside edge. My oem front rotors lasted 6 trackdays/ cup rotors 10 days/ deman 12-14 days. Mike
07-27-2014, 09:26 PM
#146
Rennlist Member
Sam. Great data points re suspension. Be good if you can post your geo sheet when you have it re done.
To dial out understeer you could soften the front sway bar and stiffen the rear. But you may have already done that from memory?
Front wear tyre wear equal or faster than rear seems common with the 991 GT3 in Europe. I think Phil had to replace his rotors after 6 track days and 4-5000 km of driving but he's driving Magna Cours and tracks in Europe which are very heavy on brakes and have elevation changes. Hes quite a quick driver on those tracks.
Interesting what you settle on with camber. Ive taken mine out to -2.2/-1.54 F/R and at the moment Id imagine plenty more there if wanted. Id suggest the factory had the difference between front and rear correct (i.e. same both) and that your new settings at around -2.5/-2.5 would be pretty much perfect. I would try these first with the sway bar changes before dropping the nose. Its low enough in practical terms as it stands....
Keep up the great reporting!
To dial out understeer you could soften the front sway bar and stiffen the rear. But you may have already done that from memory?
Front wear tyre wear equal or faster than rear seems common with the 991 GT3 in Europe. I think Phil had to replace his rotors after 6 track days and 4-5000 km of driving but he's driving Magna Cours and tracks in Europe which are very heavy on brakes and have elevation changes. Hes quite a quick driver on those tracks.
Interesting what you settle on with camber. Ive taken mine out to -2.2/-1.54 F/R and at the moment Id imagine plenty more there if wanted. Id suggest the factory had the difference between front and rear correct (i.e. same both) and that your new settings at around -2.5/-2.5 would be pretty much perfect. I would try these first with the sway bar changes before dropping the nose. Its low enough in practical terms as it stands....
Keep up the great reporting!
07-27-2014, 09:41 PM
#147
Hi Macca,
You are right, I have the front sway bar soft and the rear firm. I agree with you that the factory felt the car is very balanced with camber adjustments. Good point about waiting before dropping the nose. This also allows me to understand which single change helped. I will do the camber change and nothing else for now. Thanks for the input.
Here is today's video from inside the car, with Jason Hart shotgun. Since I don't have a cage, I used an extension so the GoPro vibrated much more. The video has some mistakes, of course but it shows how hard this car can be driven. Today, the course was the full 3.1 mile track. Jason is a professional racer. I was off his pace by one second only today.
Sam
You are right, I have the front sway bar soft and the rear firm. I agree with you that the factory felt the car is very balanced with camber adjustments. Good point about waiting before dropping the nose. This also allows me to understand which single change helped. I will do the camber change and nothing else for now. Thanks for the input.
Here is today's video from inside the car, with Jason Hart shotgun. Since I don't have a cage, I used an extension so the GoPro vibrated much more. The video has some mistakes, of course but it shows how hard this car can be driven. Today, the course was the full 3.1 mile track. Jason is a professional racer. I was off his pace by one second only today.
Sam
07-28-2014, 12:16 AM
#149
Burning Brakes
Sam it's good to see someone pushing this car....Did the nannies intervene at any time during this session or are you driving without them ??
Also, is there video with Jason driving that you can post ??
Also, is there video with Jason driving that you can post ??
07-28-2014, 06:55 AM
#150
Track Day
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@Macca
Hi Macca, the cracks were actually one on the road and two on the track, things happened but nothing serious when driving.
SmartyCam is so good and easy. really a pleasure and all automatic, you don't have to press the button when you start.
So on the last track I had the original Michelin OEM which had already a full track back last year. The front pads were changed and the rear have two days tracks. I used the Pagid RS 29. I can see now after 4 days of tracks some minor crack on the front rotors. My friend who has done 6 tracks has more cracks. I think after 6 days with the Pagid, you need to change them, then of course depends how hard you brake and let the rotor cool down. I think they are good for 2 days will see but have ordered spare one. Now I have also received from Porsched the Michelin, free of charge but got also the Trofeo R in stock. To be honest, I prefer the Trofeo but since I got a free set of Michelin, the next two days will put the Micheling and then for Imola in September, will keep the Trofeo R. In case, we are going Sep 25-26, cannot wait as this is a beautiful track.
Hi Macca, the cracks were actually one on the road and two on the track, things happened but nothing serious when driving.
SmartyCam is so good and easy. really a pleasure and all automatic, you don't have to press the button when you start.
So on the last track I had the original Michelin OEM which had already a full track back last year. The front pads were changed and the rear have two days tracks. I used the Pagid RS 29. I can see now after 4 days of tracks some minor crack on the front rotors. My friend who has done 6 tracks has more cracks. I think after 6 days with the Pagid, you need to change them, then of course depends how hard you brake and let the rotor cool down. I think they are good for 2 days will see but have ordered spare one. Now I have also received from Porsched the Michelin, free of charge but got also the Trofeo R in stock. To be honest, I prefer the Trofeo but since I got a free set of Michelin, the next two days will put the Micheling and then for Imola in September, will keep the Trofeo R. In case, we are going Sep 25-26, cannot wait as this is a beautiful track.