Got dealer "heads up" on RS ...
09-26-2013, 11:54 AM
#46
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I think the new Cup car is paddle shift only.
The only way the $180k RS price makes "sense" IMO, is if all the options and adds mentioned above (PDCC, lift, seats, LEDs, aero, CF, etc) are included plus throwing in a new lightweight lithium battery and the new 410/390mm replacement cast iron rotors for those who don't want to trash their ceramic rotors with heavy track use.
That said, I think it's a mistake to force all those options. Offer the car at $150-155K, keeping the same RS/3 delta as before, and let buyers add the other stuff if they want it. I still find it hard to believe Porsche will actually market the car loaded this way.
The only way the $180k RS price makes "sense" IMO, is if all the options and adds mentioned above (PDCC, lift, seats, LEDs, aero, CF, etc) are included plus throwing in a new lightweight lithium battery and the new 410/390mm replacement cast iron rotors for those who don't want to trash their ceramic rotors with heavy track use.
That said, I think it's a mistake to force all those options. Offer the car at $150-155K, keeping the same RS/3 delta as before, and let buyers add the other stuff if they want it. I still find it hard to believe Porsche will actually market the car loaded this way.
I am not buying a 911 for $180k+. You can add the whole damn alphabet after it but it ain't happening.
09-26-2013, 12:31 PM
#48
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Sounds like the RS is targeted at those who have money to burn and specifically want a 911. Fits Porsche's orientation towards maximizing profit rather than building true enthusiast/driver cars (let's not forget that the Cayenne is their top seller nowadays).
09-26-2013, 01:17 PM
#51
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Against that you have wider body & heavier wheel/package.
It could be done if they include radio and AC delete in the comparison but otherwise 70-80 looks more realistic on apples to apples.
The comparison should be lightest spec GT3 againt lightest spec RS and I would include PCCB, LiOn battery, and sport seats in base GT3 under assumption they are or will be available.
Edit: forgot standard PCCB if they go that route but again not apples to apples and most track guys don't want em.
An old post from Micahbones looking at weight savings in 997.2 RS
Factory Weight savings
-PCCB ($8,840) = 5kg per corner, 20kg/44lbs total saved
-Air-con delete ($0) = 15kg/33lbs saved
-Sport bucket seats ($2,990 option on GT3) = 14 kg/31lbs saved
-Lithium-ion battery ($1,700)= 10.5kg/23lbs saved
-Lightweight halogen headlights w/o headlight washing system ($0) = 6kg/13lbs saved
-Audio system delete ($0) = 5kg/11lbs saved
- Titanium center muffler ($0) =
Factoty Weight additions
+Factory roll cage ($0, Euro-spec only) = up to 30kg/65lbs added inc. harnesses
+Upgraded audio "sound package plus" ($690) = 7kg/15lbs? added above standard audio
+Front lift system ($3,490) = 3.5kg/8lbs kg added
+Interior leather ($3,285) = 3.5kg/8lbs added
+PCM w/ extended navigation ($3,110) = 2kg/5lbs? added
+Sport chrono ($690) = 1 kg/2lbs? added
+Grey or blue paint ($0) = ?kg added
+90-liter fuel tank ($?, Euro-spec only) = ? kg added
+North American spec glass rear window = ? kg added
There won't ever be a fire sale such as when people sold .1's to get .2's.
The .2RS will still soften though. When nobody is buying the .2RS's at the excessive asking prices, they will come down, because the owners will be desperate to get a 991 GT3/RS. Some who think the new RS is too pricey will settle for the 991 GT3, because it will already be considerably faster than the .2RS, which will also help soften values.
The .2RS will still soften though. When nobody is buying the .2RS's at the excessive asking prices, they will come down, because the owners will be desperate to get a 991 GT3/RS. Some who think the new RS is too pricey will settle for the 991 GT3, because it will already be considerably faster than the .2RS, which will also help soften values.
Semantics. It's the manual transmission but with electronic paddle shifters. Can't be operated as an auto and requires a clutch when stopping and starting (and when operated at sub-optimal RPM's in order to save wear).
Last edited by Nizer; 09-26-2013 at 04:46 PM.
09-26-2013, 01:32 PM
#52
Carbon (black chrome) is mainstream now, hard to reconcile those sorts of cost adders for what is standard on the new $75K M3/4 (carbon roof, trunk, roof brace, engine brace and driveshaft).
I think of the GT3 more as an upmarket tool car (Rolex sub) than a sporting showpiece (AP), at $180+K not sure that's the case anymore.
I think of the GT3 more as an upmarket tool car (Rolex sub) than a sporting showpiece (AP), at $180+K not sure that's the case anymore.
09-26-2013, 02:10 PM
#55
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Carbon (black chrome) is mainstream now, hard to reconcile those sorts of cost adders for what is standard on the new $75K M3/4 (carbon roof, trunk, roof brace, engine brace and driveshaft).
I think of the GT3 more as an upmarket tool car (Rolex sub) than a sporting showpiece (AP), at $180+K not sure that's the case anymore.
I think of the GT3 more as an upmarket tool car (Rolex sub) than a sporting showpiece (AP), at $180+K not sure that's the case anymore.
Cf hood and boot should be standard on ALL P cars.
09-26-2013, 02:51 PM
#56
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new vette is an awesome car. but I would wait a bit to see how it will perform in reality then make conclusions.
if it will really stand up to its specs then it probably would become #1 building donor platform for many car enthusiasts.
Porsche got blinded with greed and they have lost any common sense. they probably think they are Ferrari but they are wrong.
still, if they will sell all those $180k cars they will make then, well, good for them. I was sure new 991 rs will be priced higher than older 4.0 RS so it only logical.
if it will really stand up to its specs then it probably would become #1 building donor platform for many car enthusiasts.
Porsche got blinded with greed and they have lost any common sense. they probably think they are Ferrari but they are wrong.
still, if they will sell all those $180k cars they will make then, well, good for them. I was sure new 991 rs will be priced higher than older 4.0 RS so it only logical.
09-26-2013, 04:18 PM
#57
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Restaurants will often make the most expensive item on the menu really expensive in order to make all of the other menu items look cheaper/cheap. That could be part of Porsche's strategy too.
09-26-2013, 04:36 PM
#59
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Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I think the new Cup car is paddle shift only.
The only way the $180k RS price makes "sense" IMO, is if all the options and adds mentioned above (PDCC, lift, seats, LEDs, aero, CF, etc) are included plus throwing in a new lightweight lithium battery and the new 410/390mm replacement cast iron rotors for those who don't want to trash their ceramic rotors with heavy track use.
That said, I think it's a mistake to force all those options. Offer the car at $150-155K, keeping the same RS/3 delta as before, and let buyers add the other stuff if they want it. I still find it hard to believe Porsche will actually market the car loaded this way.
The only way the $180k RS price makes "sense" IMO, is if all the options and adds mentioned above (PDCC, lift, seats, LEDs, aero, CF, etc) are included plus throwing in a new lightweight lithium battery and the new 410/390mm replacement cast iron rotors for those who don't want to trash their ceramic rotors with heavy track use.
That said, I think it's a mistake to force all those options. Offer the car at $150-155K, keeping the same RS/3 delta as before, and let buyers add the other stuff if they want it. I still find it hard to believe Porsche will actually market the car loaded this way.
It also makes one wonder what the pricing will be like on the 991.2 GT3/RS & GT2/RS - let alone any other limited edition model like a replacement for the RS 4.0
Then you have all the 918 buyers who could potentially soak up all these limted edition models before they are even announced.
100lbs would be pretty aggressive. Sport seats saved about 25lbs in 997.2 GT3. CF fenders and hood were worth 22lbs and 5lbs respectively on RS 4.0. I recall AP stating CF roof panel would only save about 8lb. Maybe 20lb from Lithium battery if they get it done. Less insulation and thinner carpeting.
Against that you have wider body & heavier wheel/package.
It could be done if they include radio and AC delete in the comparison but otherwise 70-80 looks more realistic on apples to apples.
The comparison should be lightest spec GT3 againt lightest spec RS and I would include PCCB, LiOn battery, and sport seats in base GT3 under assumption they are or will be available.
Against that you have wider body & heavier wheel/package.
It could be done if they include radio and AC delete in the comparison but otherwise 70-80 looks more realistic on apples to apples.
The comparison should be lightest spec GT3 againt lightest spec RS and I would include PCCB, LiOn battery, and sport seats in base GT3 under assumption they are or will be available.
