Andreas Preuninger and the 991 gt3 - and 10RS
03-15-2013, 10:13 PM
#46
Instructor
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Something to consider, the Top Gear interview was in April 2010. The Edmunds quote was from October 2009. There have been significant advances in the PDK since then.
More to the point, the 991 GT3 and the new engine didn't even exist when he made those statements. It seems possible, and all the other issues aside, that after testing the manual and PDK with the new powerplant the revised 7sp PDK proved to be a better match than the 6 speed manual. Reasonable people can change their minds when presented with new information and circumstances. Just a thought.
More to the point, the 991 GT3 and the new engine didn't even exist when he made those statements. It seems possible, and all the other issues aside, that after testing the manual and PDK with the new powerplant the revised 7sp PDK proved to be a better match than the 6 speed manual. Reasonable people can change their minds when presented with new information and circumstances. Just a thought.
A manual gearbox is still the best fit for a purist. The PDK dilutes the experience by taking away functions the driver should perform. Im not concerned about the lap times, I want to get the most enjoyment from the car.
03-15-2013, 10:14 PM
#47
Nordschleife Master
Something to consider, the Top Gear interview was in April 2010. The Edmunds quote was from October 2009. There have been significant advances in the PDK since then.
More to the point, the 991 GT3 and the new engine didn't even exist when he made those statements. It seems possible, and all the other issues aside, that after testing the manual and PDK with the new powerplant the revised 7sp PDK proved to be a better match than the 6 speed manual. Reasonable people can change their minds when presented with new information and circumstances. Just a thought.
More to the point, the 991 GT3 and the new engine didn't even exist when he made those statements. It seems possible, and all the other issues aside, that after testing the manual and PDK with the new powerplant the revised 7sp PDK proved to be a better match than the 6 speed manual. Reasonable people can change their minds when presented with new information and circumstances. Just a thought.
Then they added better timing for computer to be smarter for automatic gear shifting, again. Yee haw. Screw that.
03-15-2013, 10:22 PM
#48
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When my wife told me to trade in my GT3 for the 991 so that she could drive it too, that made up my mind. I'm waiting for a couple of years to get the RS with manual shift.
03-15-2013, 10:49 PM
#49
Race Director
Mike,I'm with you,but I don't think anybody would've been this upset if they didn't offer a manual in a Carrera or Carrera S,but the GT3?! The iconic sports/track raw car?!
I understand PDK is a much faster,better transmission and I'm glad they're offering it,but should we really believe that Porsche couldn't have made the effort to offer both on this iconic sports/track raw car?!
I will admit something here : I used to be one of the people,at the beginning of my time on this board,making fun of folks driving an automatic transmission,yet I was so wrong! I've learned in time that the people I was making fun of were enthusiasts like me that drove manuals for longer than I was born but chose to drive an automatic for other reasons and I respect that! Why can't Porsche respect us too and give us a manual?
I understand PDK is a much faster,better transmission and I'm glad they're offering it,but should we really believe that Porsche couldn't have made the effort to offer both on this iconic sports/track raw car?!
I will admit something here : I used to be one of the people,at the beginning of my time on this board,making fun of folks driving an automatic transmission,yet I was so wrong! I've learned in time that the people I was making fun of were enthusiasts like me that drove manuals for longer than I was born but chose to drive an automatic for other reasons and I respect that! Why can't Porsche respect us too and give us a manual?
Personally, I think the first scenario is more likely, although that said, I could wish for a perfect world where we would all have had a choice. I've noticed, though, that the world isn't perfect. I honestly feel badly for the people who are disappointed by Porsche's decision.
03-15-2013, 11:01 PM
#51
Race Director
Grandmas can still use paddles, and they are now less challenging than ever.
A manual gearbox is still the best fit for a purist. The PDK dilutes the experience by taking away functions the driver should perform. Im not concerned about the lap times, I want to get the most enjoyment from the car.
A manual gearbox is still the best fit for a purist. The PDK dilutes the experience by taking away functions the driver should perform. Im not concerned about the lap times, I want to get the most enjoyment from the car.
What I was responding to was the chatter about Preuninger being some kind of jerk because he had changed his mind about things he said 3 or 4 years ago. He now has several years more experience with the systems involved, and knowledge of how the new car/engine drives with PDK compared to with a MT. If you had his information and had driven the car, you might or might not feel differently than you do, but you should at least be able to see that it could lead someone else to a different conclusion than they reached before.
03-15-2013, 11:05 PM
#52
Race Director
I like my pdk...but about the wife driving...I ordered my GTS without Bose, no Navi, GT2 Sport Buckets which ya know are manual, and put 6 point harness in. She won't drive it, thinks its stupid. Problem solved
03-15-2013, 11:16 PM
#53
Nordschleife Master
neanicu, I don't know the answer to that. I suspect it wasn't an easy choice and the development team apparently went back and forth on the issue. We don't know all of the factors involved; engineering considerations, performance targets, financial and production realities, sales data, what have you. Offering two transmissions probably wasn't the no-brainer some people think it should have been. OTOH, maybe Porsche and their new VW overlords really are evil and stupid, and don't care about cars or alienating their loyal customers.
Personally, I think the first scenario is more likely, although that said, I could wish for a perfect world where we would all have had a choice. I've noticed, though, that the world isn't perfect. I honestly feel badly for the people who are disappointed by Porsche's decision.
Personally, I think the first scenario is more likely, although that said, I could wish for a perfect world where we would all have had a choice. I've noticed, though, that the world isn't perfect. I honestly feel badly for the people who are disappointed by Porsche's decision.
I'm glad you see where I'm coming from,I just wish Porsche did too.
Other than their transmission choice I really like the car and would've ordered it without a second thought. I'll also refrain from judging it without actually had driven it.
03-15-2013, 11:16 PM
#54
Rennlist Member
Whether or not you want PDK, it does seem like they waited until PDK was "worthy" of being put in a GT3.
03-16-2013, 12:08 AM
#55
Drifting
Have to agree.
Sometimes it's tough to face changes and evolution, these cars have to stay competitive in a technology based generation now. It could be seriously 10 years from now and no brand new cars will be offered with a manual transmission.
At least you'll always have the option to choose from many great 911 variants of the past, so everyone can stay satisfied.
And yes AP has to agree and say what is approved by his employer - Porsche. Anybody employed by a large organization knows these press conferences etc are micro-managed and rehearsed to say the correct things to make sales!
To the OP, great looking car!
Sometimes it's tough to face changes and evolution, these cars have to stay competitive in a technology based generation now. It could be seriously 10 years from now and no brand new cars will be offered with a manual transmission.
At least you'll always have the option to choose from many great 911 variants of the past, so everyone can stay satisfied.
And yes AP has to agree and say what is approved by his employer - Porsche. Anybody employed by a large organization knows these press conferences etc are micro-managed and rehearsed to say the correct things to make sales!
To the OP, great looking car!
03-16-2013, 12:22 AM
#56
Rennlist Member
Don't shoot the messenger fellas, he deserves better than that. Those way higher than AP are calling the shots, he's just taking the heat... Go easy...
Just saying...
03-16-2013, 12:25 AM
#57
Rennlist Member
Don't agree with Porsche's direction with this car but certainly don't agree with this statement... AP most certainly isn't an embarrassment. Too many people judging AP personally for comments and opinions made on behalf of his employer! These changes in position are those of Porsche that he must parrot. We don't know APs true personal feelings on the GT3 evolution. Maybe he always felt the manual sucked and had to tell us its the best option because they had no other option at the time! Who knows...
Don't shoot the messenger fellas, he deserves better than that. Those way higher than AP are calling the shots, he's just taking the heat... Go easy...
Just saying...
Don't shoot the messenger fellas, he deserves better than that. Those way higher than AP are calling the shots, he's just taking the heat... Go easy...
Just saying...
03-16-2013, 12:49 AM
#58
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Yeah, I like to see my wife's legs in the short mini skirt and high heels working those pedals...
03-16-2013, 03:45 AM
#59
Have to agree.
Sometimes it's tough to face changes and evolution, these cars have to stay competitive in a technology based generation now. It could be seriously 10 years from now and no brand new cars will be offered with a manual transmission.
At least you'll always have the option to choose from many great 911 variants of the past, so everyone can stay satisfied.
And yes AP has to agree and say what is approved by his employer - Porsche. Anybody employed by a large organization knows these press conferences etc are micro-managed and rehearsed to say the correct things to make sales!
To the OP, great looking car!
Sometimes it's tough to face changes and evolution, these cars have to stay competitive in a technology based generation now. It could be seriously 10 years from now and no brand new cars will be offered with a manual transmission.
At least you'll always have the option to choose from many great 911 variants of the past, so everyone can stay satisfied.
And yes AP has to agree and say what is approved by his employer - Porsche. Anybody employed by a large organization knows these press conferences etc are micro-managed and rehearsed to say the correct things to make sales!
To the OP, great looking car!
03-16-2013, 03:46 AM
#60
