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I just completed the three day “Masters RS” driver training school in Birmingham at Barber track. A shout out to Porsche Track Experience. It is one of the most professional schools.Highly recommend.
they even showed off Speedster S/N 0000
I had taken the Masters course 2 years prior. Most school cars back then were Carrera S.
All the cars I recall ran steel rotors. Throughout the track days the steel brakes had bad pulsation on some cars.
This time around, all the track cars (except 718) had PCCB rotors.
The PCCB are fantastic on track. All day, the cars are on track for four plus hours.
The pedal was solid and rotors ran smoothly. Really impressed.
I discussed with the lead instructor, Cas, about their use of PCCB vs previously using Steel rotors.
”way fewer problems with the rotors”
”we get 3000 ON TRACK miles out of a set”
the rear rotors are punished more due to pulsation of stability control system.
”we have to watch pad taper wear very closely, any worn pad that allows metal to rotor, we replace.
”we get a discount on rotors for school but it is less discount that what you would expect”
”for us, it is more cost effective to run PCCB”
I think Porsche really did something to improve PCCB
At $25k ish for rotors and pads for 3,000 track miles no way that is close to break even with reds without a major discount. Mere mortals need not apply.
Cas and the team at sport driving school are amazing. I have gone several times and it is run perfectly.
Curious what they get to buy PCCBs for... when I have gone Ive always had reds except for RS cars and Turbo S. They are regularly pulling cars with reds into shop for brake work throughout the day. Still think PCCB prices have to come down over time once they have enough scale as more and more cars are using them now.
It’s a great weekend to go to Barber!
And I see they picked the fastest color for RS :-)
Surface Transforms for the win!
100+ track days... I’m at about 35 now and easily 70-100 to go.
$13,000 and $600 per corner to refurbish after 20 days front and 40 days rear, no brainer.
Bought a second set for my .2RS, I can’t go back to steel...
The ST option does begin to look attractive when running costs are taken into account. Steel is likely still cheaper though, and I'm not sure how Barber concluded otherwise unless they are counting significant downtime for their cars. Irons last between 2 and 4k track miles themselves?
The cost comparison to iron is one thing but it fails to account for the performance. PCCB is a performance option and performance costs $$$ esp. if paying Porsche OE prices. My point is simply that it's not really apples to apples to compare iron to PCCB on cost alone. There are many dimensions on which we could cut our running costs at the track. PCCB vs. iron is just one and it does have implications like all the others.
I understand now. I didn't know the brand was "Surface Transforms"
they look like a great alternative to OEM PCCB.
Very interesting
I have not seen anything in this thread that makes me believe Barber is using “Surface Transforms” rotors. From Porsche the car would be delivered with Porsche Carbon Ceramic Brakes (PCCB) which are not iron but are a different technology. ST are only available aftermarket.
PCCB are great but expensive if you track given the 20k+ replacement costs. ST aftermarket rotors cost more initially but less over time if used heavily because they can be resurfaced.
If Barber is actually using ST I think we’d all be very interested to know that. It seems much more likely to me that they are using PCCBs at a reasonable discount and are making the math work due to other factors. ST meanwhile is something a few track junky forum members are using as an alternative with success.
PCCB are great but expensive if you track given the 20k+ replacement costs. ST aftermarket rotors cost more initially but less over time if used heavily because they can be resurfaced.
.
My shop in UK tells me they can send off the oem pccb's to be resurfaced?
How do the ST do on street? My car is prob 50/50 street/track.
im going to be the cynic here and suggest that this is an intentional marketing program to increase PCCB sales by both mandating that the school uses PCCB cars, and giving them such a discount on replacements that it is indeed "more economical" for them to run them. Bondurant for example gets free Vipers and Chargers, and before that, got free Corvettes and Mustangs, depending on their auto industry partner at the time.
06-21-2019, 12:32 AM
PCCB’s on All School cars at Barber
