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Old 05-15-2019, 05:52 PM
  #16  
Jickel180
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Originally Posted by krell View Post
I've got a 2005 competition package M3 with the "track" stability mode, and it's exactly useless on the track.

Thought I recognized this name from M3F. The nannies are 2439038425x better in the GT3 than our E46s. I always turn my DSC off in the E46, but I haven't found the need to do so in the GT3 on track yet. Maybe if I jump the shark and make this a dedicated track car on slicks, but for most of us the nannies are fine.
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Old 05-15-2019, 06:01 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by orthojoe View Post
What has been stated above is all true. It can be a difficult concept to accept for some, though. ESC system use can be a religious crusade for some people who are convinced there is no such thing as a good esc system. I've had multiple people accuse me of being a clueless driver only because the systems are on. Of course, none of them have driven a late model Porsche to see for themselves. They all say I would crash in an older car. Except I have a race car from 1991 with no abs, no power steering, no esc, and I do pretty well in racing. These guys also tend to be not so good at driving themselves. I'm not willing to let go of a safety net on a 200k car just to satisfy a bunch of people I couldn't care less about.

Can the system cause bad habits if don't know what you are doing? Yes. Does it mean it can't be used properly? No.
About to head out to the track again with the new RS and trying to remember what I did in the .1 GT3. My recollection was holding the ESC button to either turn it off or put it in sport mode (don't remember) but always left TC on. What's been your practice, Joe? Just Sport PDK Manual mode and that's it?
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Old 05-15-2019, 06:06 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by MayorAdamWest
About to head out to the track again with the new RS and trying to remember what I did in the .1 GT3. My recollection was holding the ESC button to either turn it off or put it in sport mode (don't remember) but always left TC on. What's been your practice, Joe? Just Sport PDK Manual mode and that's it?
Esc on
Tc on
Sport exhaust on
Pdk sport auto mode
Pasm firm mode

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Old 05-15-2019, 06:37 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by tstafford View Post
BMW nannies are terrible and highly intrusive. Porsche on the other hand has it nailed. The nannies are there as a safety net and do not get in the way of driving fun. If you're bumping into them on the road something is wrong with your driving.
Bingo. I drove my BMW 1M with the nannies off 100% of the time because they were so intrusive and ham-fisted. On the GT3 I almost never switch them off on the street because I simply don't need too (and because I have great respect for the 1-2 flat shift, especially on cool tires). I do however always switch them off when competing- they are still limiting if you drive... "flamboyantly", shall we say. Though that's mainly at lower (autocross) speeds.
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Old 05-15-2019, 06:59 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by Kobalt View Post
They don't stop you from doing stupid things so I'd say they are really good.

What they do in real life I'm not sure of as I don't lean on them. I'm pretty sure that I was saved once in Wipperman (on the Ring).
I also know that I was not saved in Aremberg

When the lamp starts to blink it says: "You are doing wrong - try it another way".

Technically As I understands it there is Stabilization which helps you when you are about to loose the car like when over steering
Next level is anti spin which helps you not loosing traction.

As mentioned before there is big difference driving a BMW with systems on and a Porsche.
The BMW you must turn off the systems otherwise the car is over protecting (generally speaking).

In my Porsche's I leave nannies on and in BMW's I turn them off - unless it is wet then I might turn nannies on/off during driving depending on the situation.
Originally Posted by Kobalt View Post
Absolutely
Originally Posted by orthojoe View Post
What has been stated above is all true. It can be a difficult concept to accept for some, though. ESC system use can be a religious crusade for some people who are convinced there is no such thing as a good esc system. I've had multiple people accuse me of being a clueless driver only because the systems are on. Of course, none of them have driven a late model Porsche to see for themselves. They all say I would crash in an older car. Except I have a race car from 1991 with no abs, no power steering, no esc, and I do pretty well in racing. These guys also tend to be not so good at driving themselves. I'm not willing to let go of a safety net on a 200k car just to satisfy a bunch of people I couldn't care less about.

Can the system cause bad habits if don't know what you are doing? Yes. Does it mean it can't be used properly? No.
Originally Posted by tqevo View Post
I like what they've done with the handling of the .2 GT3s. You can still kick the rear out and spin even with ESC on. I haven't spun yet but got close a few times and was definitely very sideways.
100% agreed. I’ve never come up with a good reason to turn it off.
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Old 05-15-2019, 07:24 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by orthojoe View Post
Esc on
Tc on
Sport exhaust on
Pdk sport auto mode
Pasm firm mode

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^ This! I haven’t found nannies on Porsches to be particularly intrusive not hindering on track, thus why turn them off when they might actually help in the event of that tail-event miscue when they would be welcomed.
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Old 05-15-2019, 08:25 PM
  #22  
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This has been an interesting thread. If Orthojoe and Trakcar, who have much track experience, and are likely better drivers than me, both advocate for keeping the nannies on, then I plan to definitely keep them on while on the track at high speeds with other cars around me, walls, etc.

But my question to the group is this, if I do turn off both ESC and TC to play around with the car on back roads for a more "pure" experience, is there still some kind of residual basic safety nanny in this rear engined car? I thought one of the early.1 GT3 reviews stated there was no way to completely turn off the nannies, but that turning off both ESC/TC just changed the threshhold significantly before the nannies would kick in. Anyone know for certain? Maybe C.J.?

I do remember on RL right after .1 GT3 came out, there was a big discussion about ESC and TC, and the consensus was to just leave both on or turn both off as turning just one system off didn't accomplish anything useful. So on empty backroads I was thinking of playing around with having both systems off..........
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Old 05-15-2019, 09:15 PM
  #23  
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I've heard only when running Hoosiers one might need to turn them off as they don't do so well w sticky tires - any truth to that?
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:01 PM
  #24  
krell
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Originally Posted by Jickel180 View Post
Thought I recognized this name from M3F. The nannies are 2439038425x better in the GT3 than our E46s. I always turn my DSC off in the E46, but I haven't found the need to do so in the GT3 on track yet. Maybe if I jump the shark and make this a dedicated track car on slicks, but for most of us the nannies are fine.
Yessir, was a regular on M3F for a good 8-10 years. Learned a lot and while I still have the M3 I'm learning another German language . . . Porsche-eese.
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:02 PM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Drifting View Post
This has been an interesting thread. If Orthojoe and Trakcar, who have much track experience, and are likely better drivers than me, both advocate for keeping the nannies on, then I plan to definitely keep them on while on the track at high speeds with other cars around me, walls, etc.

But my question to the group is this, if I do turn off both ESC and TC to play around with the car on back roads for a more "pure" experience, is there still some kind of residual basic safety nanny in this rear engined car? I thought one of the early.1 GT3 reviews stated there was no way to completely turn off the nannies, but that turning off both ESC/TC just changed the threshhold significantly before the nannies would kick in. Anyone know for certain? Maybe C.J.?

I do remember on RL right after .1 GT3 came out, there was a big discussion about ESC and TC, and the consensus was to just leave both on or turn both off as turning just one system off didn't accomplish anything useful. So on empty backroads I was thinking of playing around with having both systems off..........
I turned ESC+TC off in my .1 GT3 and was able to quickly spin the car. The car detected a complete loss of traction and re-engaged the system. To be clear this was all done on private pavement. Would not recommend turning them off for "back roads" driving. Competition is another matter.
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:44 PM
  #26  
ipse dixit
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I always keep my "nannies" on. Because I am not smarter than the the guys at Porsche Motorsport.
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:55 PM
  #27  
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I gave considerable thought to hiring a nanny, but my wife was opposed the idea, mostly because we don’t have kids.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:22 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by ipse dixit View Post
I always keep my "nannies" on. Because I am not smarter than the the guys at Porsche Motorsport.
In my experience “off” is worth about half a second over “on” when I’m “on” myself at a local autocross course. Examples: Off let me stay in it over one particular bumpy bend leading into a straight where “on” would consistently cut power and settle the car. Off also let me kick out the tail on the far side sweeper under power where “on” would cut throttle to manage attitude.

Off is less consistent obviously. Also as speed climbs I’m less comfortable and there is less benefit to sliding things around. That said all the top Porsche autocross drivers I know (including multiple PCA national champs) drive even the recent GT cars with everything off because it’s clearly quicker on most courses. Probably only slightly, but still.

None of us are smarter than Porsche Motorsports, but some of us can be smarter than the car. The car has no idea that it’s ok to let the wheels spin up over these particular bumps because the road is smoothing out and straightening ahead.

Last edited by Petevb; 05-15-2019 at 11:39 PM.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:36 PM
  #29  
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I'm an experienced autoxer, and like mentioned above, that's the only place I turn my TSC off. It's a great place to find the limits the car in a safe environment, with no nannies. I never turn it off on the street, as there's not enough room for error. I plan to track my car soon and will leave everything on.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:52 PM
  #30  
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^ off for autocross, although all I experience is understeer!
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