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4pt vs 5/6pt for HPDE & PCA Guidelines

 
Old 03-15-2019, 06:21 PM
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iphilips
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Default 4pt vs 5/6pt for HPDE & PCA Guidelines

In the process of getting a BBI roll-bar installed in my 991.2 GT3 w/ carbon buckets and I'm getting mixed feedback on the harness system to install. I plan to use the car for HPDE (HOD, PCA, [email protected], and Droids & Friends/HOD) and don't plan to do any racing that requires FIA standards. I plan to have both driver and passenger have the same standards.

I've read been told that I must have 6pt, which from what I understand requires holes to be made in the base of the passengers carbon LWB seat. Are both of these statements true?

I've also been told that it's ok to have 4pt (like the Schroth SR 90593-0), this requires no holes to be made and has the ASM technology.

So when I read the PCA guidelines I see this..
"Four Point Belt Exception: Schroth has developed a four point harness for specific newer Porsche models only. These models are the 918 Spyder, 2015 GT3, 2016 Cayman GT4, 2016 Boxster Spyder, and 2015 GT3RS, and these models must also be fitted with the Full Bucket Seat Option P11 as provided by Porsche. The belts are Federal Motor Vehicle Standard 209, and as such they are deemed street legal and approved by federal seat belt safety regulations. These belts also have labeling confirming the intended use for these specified Porsche models."


Now my GT3 is a 2018, so not sure if this applies to me.

I also see this in their guidelines...
"Be used in conjunction with a seat that has the supplied routing holes for the shoulder and antisubmarine belts."

So does anybody know what is the "right" outome that will get me to pass tech and be safe. Can I just use the 4pt's w/ no drilling/holes, or do I use the 6pt's with drilling and holes in a 2018 991.2 GT3.
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Old 03-15-2019, 06:33 PM
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Shoulder straps should be pulled as tight as possible and the advantage of the 5/6pt is that the lap belt has a counter balancing force to keep it from riding up due to shoulder belts pulling. IMO 5/6pt is definitely preferable
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Old 03-15-2019, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by gt38088 View Post
Shoulder straps should be pulled as tight as possible and the advantage of the 5/6pt is that the lap belt has a counter balancing force to keep it from riding up due to shoulder belts pulling. IMO 5/6pt is definitely preferable
Thanks, 6 > 5 > 4 is always true :P But, I'm really looking for advice on how people have interpreted the PCA guidelines and what they are practically doing on the ground that is passing tech.
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:22 PM
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Get a head/neck restraint too if you are going to run 5/6pt harness (Hans, etc).
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by usctrojanGT3 View Post
Get a head/neck restraint too if you are going to run 5/6pt harness (Hans, etc).
100% on this one. I'm looking at the NecksGen as it seems to have a lower profile rear relative to the HANS. I've already thrown in the trackspec recliners to adjust angle so I suspect the HANS won't be ideal relative to the NecksGen.
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by iphilips View Post
100% on this one. I'm looking at the NecksGen as it seems to have a lower profile rear relative to the HANS. I've already thrown in the trackspec recliners to adjust angle so I suspect the HANS won't be ideal relative to the NecksGen.
Good man, sounds like you are all over it. You'll enjoy tracking.
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by usctrojanGT3 View Post
Good man, sounds like you are all over it. You'll enjoy tracking.
Thanks! Are you running 6pt with standard LWB and are passing tech? I don't want to be in the position to fail tech b/c i've made a hole in the passenger side seat to install the 6pt.
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Old 03-15-2019, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by iphilips View Post
Thanks! Are you running 6pt with standard LWB and are passing tech? I don't want to be in the position to fail tech b/c i've made a hole in the passenger side seat to install the 6pt.
Yeah, I'm running a 6pt harness with the LWBs along with a roll bar. If they ding me then I'll go to 3pt belts but I drive in advanced solo.
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Old 03-15-2019, 08:55 PM
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Run other than 3pt stock belts in 2019 PCA rules require H&NR system.

Simple.
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Old 03-15-2019, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by usctrojanGT3 View Post
Yeah, I'm running a 6pt harness with the LWBs along with a roll bar. If they ding me then I'll go to 3pt belts but I drive in advanced solo.
Thanks, this is what I was looking for. 6pt is in my future

Originally Posted by 996AE View Post
Run other than 3pt stock belts in 2019 PCA rules require H&NR system.

Simple.
Understood, my question is about 4pt vs 5/6pt and the need to modify the passenger seat for the 5/6pt, 100% agree and understand that H&NR is required for 4+ pt, that's the easy rule to follow.
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Old Today, 02:54 PM
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If you don't want to modify the passenger seat, or deal with the anti-sub strap sitting on the seats all the time then just get the Schroth Porsche specific seats for the carbon buckets. PCA rules allow them so you should be good to go. Now if you WANT to modify the seat, have at it. I'd be shocked if any local PCA chapter would check this, in spite of the language in the handbook saying no seat shall be modified. In fact the seat has a knockout there so it just needs to be dremel'd out.
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Old Today, 10:07 PM
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My region seems to say equal restraint is the key. I have also heard some venues banning 4 pt despite ASM technology.
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Old Today, 10:10 PM
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^^

When I was first introduced to track events, I was told a 4 point has the potential to submarine... "you don't want track officials to find all of you in your footwell after a bad crash". ASM or no ASM, I'll take 6 point thank you.
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Old Today, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by krell View Post
If you don't want to modify the passenger seat, or deal with the anti-sub strap sitting on the seats all the time then just get the Schroth Porsche specific seats for the carbon buckets. PCA rules allow them so you should be good to go. Now if you WANT to modify the seat, have at it. I'd be shocked if any local PCA chapter would check this, in spite of the language in the handbook saying no seat shall be modified. In fact the seat has a knockout there so it just needs to be dremel'd out.
Lol, a few folks haven't read my OP. Only the 2015 GT3 has been "passed" according to the PCA website for 4 pt Porsche specific harness with ASM. So my question was does a 2018 991.2 GT3 pass that same test or not.

I ended up going with 6pt and cutting the seat anyway and will assume that PCA won't ding me for cutting a hold in the passenger seat.
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Old Today, 10:14 PM
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Originally Posted by SToronto View Post
My region seems to say equal restraint is the key. I have also heard some venues banning 4 pt despite ASM technology.
Originally Posted by Smoking Rotors View Post
When I was first introduced to track events, I was told a 4 point has the potential to submarine... "you don't want track officials to find all of you in your footwell after a bad crash".
This is what pushed me to cut the hole in the seat and go with the 6pt - I don't have to trust the 4pt ASM tech. If PCA doesn't like the passenger seat with hold and 6pt, then we go 3pt and the factory betls.
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