GT fever
02-12-2019, 08:37 PM
#76
Everything was fact. Plenty of RL members there that day that can confirm what they saw. I really don’t think what anyone here or anywhere thinks. Just relaying info and facts of that day. I’d be more than happy to attend and replicate it at future events. But some of the RL koolaid is strong here. And then, most can’t even exploit the performance of the platforms irl.
02-12-2019, 09:00 PM
#77
Burning Brakes
Actually, PBIR is one of those tracks where a regular GT3 and even better a 911 Touring can do well.
The track setup has such a long back straight, that no drag (a sleek car like the 991 Touring) can hit some real high speeds. The turns are too slow to have the downforce on the RS help at all.
Without in-car video, data and lap times it is hard to judge the Touring capabilities, but PBIR is one of the few places where a Touring can be better than a GT3 or a GT3 RS.
The track setup has such a long back straight, that no drag (a sleek car like the 991 Touring) can hit some real high speeds. The turns are too slow to have the downforce on the RS help at all.
Without in-car video, data and lap times it is hard to judge the Touring capabilities, but PBIR is one of the few places where a Touring can be better than a GT3 or a GT3 RS.
02-12-2019, 09:02 PM
#78
Everything was fact. Plenty of RL members there that day that can confirm what they saw. I really don’t think what anyone here or anywhere thinks. Just relaying info and facts of that day. I’d be more than happy to attend and replicate it at future events. But some of the RL koolaid is strong here. And then, most can’t even exploit the performance of the platforms irl.
02-12-2019, 09:08 PM
#79
Actually, PBIR is one of those tracks where a regular GT3 and even better a 911 Touring can do well.
The track setup has such a long back straight, that no drag (a sleek car like the 991 Touring) can hit some real high speeds. The turns are too slow to have the downforce on the RS help at all.
Without in-car video, data and lap times it is hard to judge the Touring capabilities, but PBIR is one of the few places where a Touring can be better than a GT3 or a GT3 RS.
The track setup has such a long back straight, that no drag (a sleek car like the 991 Touring) can hit some real high speeds. The turns are too slow to have the downforce on the RS help at all.
Without in-car video, data and lap times it is hard to judge the Touring capabilities, but PBIR is one of the few places where a Touring can be better than a GT3 or a GT3 RS.
02-12-2019, 09:10 PM
#80
Race Director
I'm very curious if the wider front track of the standard 992 (which matches current 991 gt3) will mean that the 992 gt3 goes to RS width. Because that great racecar-type feel of the RS is all about that wide front track and the ability to put some big rubber up there.
If you see the 992 reviews, the handling gets praised immensely.. in not sure I WANT 911's to get any wider but anytime you wider the FRONT track it does wonders for your grip and handling (REAR width is all about cars & coffee preening).
If you see the 992 reviews, the handling gets praised immensely.. in not sure I WANT 911's to get any wider but anytime you wider the FRONT track it does wonders for your grip and handling (REAR width is all about cars & coffee preening).
02-12-2019, 09:39 PM
#81
Thats not what I said. You’re reading comprehension needs improvement. My post was primarily vs the 991.1 RS there that day. Read it again. It explicitly stated the 991.2 RS’s where in another group. Sure, I didn’t experience any significant different vs the 991.2 RS on a highway during a short run on another occasion. That is not to say it doesn’t have an advantage over the Touring or 991.2 GT3 on a track like the Nurburgring with a professional driver. The right size ***** can more than make up certain differences. But how many people actually drive and track a 13 mile racetrack to exploit and experience the difference between the two platform in the US to justify this “GT Fever”? None. Now, if people want to own something that can do something without ever really experiencing it. Ok. Go for it. The point of this thread has to do with the so called GT fever of getting the next thing. But most wont ever experience any significant difference in most US tracks and roads, and they’ll be disappointed in the experience/results when there’s the right driver with the right skills in a “regular” GT3 vs their RS. Hence, silly to just buy a car because a perceived performance they’ll never actually achieve. Sure, if you want to buy an RS because you love the RS or what it represents, go ahead and switch and spend the extra money. But don’t be sureprised when the right person with decent skills keeps up or passes you at the track with a wing or “neutered” Touring GT3.
02-12-2019, 09:40 PM
#82
Rennlist Member
For people who cannot tell the difference driving a GT3 or an RS, either car will do. Just buy the one you can’t help but turn around and look back at when you park it. I drove my GT3 for 3 years and loved every second. Felt very comfortable in the car. My track times at Sebring lowered by 4 seconds over that period as I refined my driving and slowly set up the suspension to track geometry from Factory settings. I got the .2 3RS and out of the box I was apprehensive due to the stiffer suspension and rough Sebring surface but it was almost immediately 4+ seconds faster than my GT3 personal best. Turn in is better, faster, at a higher level. The cars respond the same. Set up correctly, you can take them to a skid pad and they behave similarly but the levels are different. I applied track geometry settings to the RS suspension and expect my next time out will be quicker again. For me there is a huge difference between the cars. I love both for their similarities but I prefer the RS for the track.
02-12-2019, 10:25 PM
#83
Thats not what I said. You’re reading comprehension needs improvement. My post was primarily vs the 991.1 RS there that day. Read it again. It explicitly stated the 991.2 RS’s where in another group. Sure, I didn’t experience any significant different vs the 991.2 RS on a highway during a short run on another occasion. That is not to say it doesn’t have an advantage over the Touring or 991.2 GT3 on a track like the Nurburgring with a professional driver. The right size ***** can more than make up certain differences. But how many people actually drive and track a 13 mile racetrack to exploit and experience the difference between the two platform in the US to justify this “GT Fever”? None. Now, if people want to own something that can do something without ever really experiencing it. Ok. Go for it. The point of this thread has to do with the so called GT fever of getting the next thing. But most wont ever experience any significant difference in most US tracks and roads, and they’ll be disappointed in the experience/results when there’s the right driver with the right skills in a “regular” GT3 vs their RS. Hence, silly to just buy a car because a perceived performance they’ll never actually achieve. Sure, if you want to buy an RS because you love the RS or what it represents, go ahead and switch and spend the extra money. But don’t be sureprised when the right person with decent skills keeps up or passes you at the track with a wing or “neutered” Touring GT3.
“So imo, there's no significant different in performance at the track or street to justify the price difference if you got the right spec. Wing, Touring, or RS.”
where in that paragraph do you specify that you are referring to the 991?
02-12-2019, 10:59 PM
#84
and some engineer will say that it needed a bigger contact patch 
02-13-2019, 04:14 PM
#87
Rennlist Member
For the 991.2 GT3 generation, the dynamic differences between the GT3 and GT3 RS are larger than ever before.
With each generation, the grow apart more and more. Back in the 996, aside from cheater tires on the GT3RS, the two cars performed quite similar on a racetrack, and again with the 997.1 GT3 RS. The 997.2 was the first big departure, then the 991.1 GT3 RS once again a big departure.
What Porsche has done with the .2 GT3 RS is a first ever for the RS street cars. I inspected my 2019 underneath, and I found massive differences with the 2016 RS it replaced. Although the motors are the same, that and brakes is where the common parts (that apply to dynamic behavior, not the interior cosmetics and accessory options) end.
The .2 RS has a shorter ring and pinion gear (4.19:1 vs the GT3 3.97). The 2018/2019 got louder inside, it must be this new ultra light carpets (my old 2016 shared the carpets with the GT3). For the first time, there is almost 1,000 lbs of downforce at 186mph (the GT3 produces a tad over 300 lbs at these same speeds). Very wide rubber fits on both axles, yet covered by the body for aero efficiency, my 295 front tires and 345 rear tires fit just fine, and they come with more grip. For the first time, the spring rates went drastically up compared to the GT3 (older GT3 and GT3 RS were always in the same range for spring rates). There are a new transmission and axles naca cooling ducts, additional cooling ducts for the rear brakes compared to the 991.1 GT3 RS, and the best feature: no rubber on all the suspension joints (there are many of them), except the RWS joint, all others are solid aluminum or monoballs, this is where the car is gaining on lateral performance, but only when proper tires are used, the difference will be appreciated, as Hoosiers and slicks tend to overwhelm the rubber bushings (and all the dynamic camber, toe changes that carries).
For street use, in U.S. roads at 55mph or slower due to speed limits, neither car makes sense, a Cayman GT4 is more fun. For track use (tracks with turns, dragways are not tracks, parking lots are not tracks): GT3RS. For Drag Racing: GT2RS or Turbo S. For street use breaking all sort of traffic laws as most Youtube content these days, choose whatever you're comfortable leaving at the impound yard.
With each generation, the grow apart more and more. Back in the 996, aside from cheater tires on the GT3RS, the two cars performed quite similar on a racetrack, and again with the 997.1 GT3 RS. The 997.2 was the first big departure, then the 991.1 GT3 RS once again a big departure.
What Porsche has done with the .2 GT3 RS is a first ever for the RS street cars. I inspected my 2019 underneath, and I found massive differences with the 2016 RS it replaced. Although the motors are the same, that and brakes is where the common parts (that apply to dynamic behavior, not the interior cosmetics and accessory options) end.
The .2 RS has a shorter ring and pinion gear (4.19:1 vs the GT3 3.97). The 2018/2019 got louder inside, it must be this new ultra light carpets (my old 2016 shared the carpets with the GT3). For the first time, there is almost 1,000 lbs of downforce at 186mph (the GT3 produces a tad over 300 lbs at these same speeds). Very wide rubber fits on both axles, yet covered by the body for aero efficiency, my 295 front tires and 345 rear tires fit just fine, and they come with more grip. For the first time, the spring rates went drastically up compared to the GT3 (older GT3 and GT3 RS were always in the same range for spring rates). There are a new transmission and axles naca cooling ducts, additional cooling ducts for the rear brakes compared to the 991.1 GT3 RS, and the best feature: no rubber on all the suspension joints (there are many of them), except the RWS joint, all others are solid aluminum or monoballs, this is where the car is gaining on lateral performance, but only when proper tires are used, the difference will be appreciated, as Hoosiers and slicks tend to overwhelm the rubber bushings (and all the dynamic camber, toe changes that carries).
For street use, in U.S. roads at 55mph or slower due to speed limits, neither car makes sense, a Cayman GT4 is more fun. For track use (tracks with turns, dragways are not tracks, parking lots are not tracks): GT3RS. For Drag Racing: GT2RS or Turbo S. For street use breaking all sort of traffic laws as most Youtube content these days, choose whatever you're comfortable leaving at the impound yard.
02-13-2019, 07:25 PM
#88
please let’s keep it civil with all the name calling! You never Specified that the Touring is better at that particular track.
“So imo, there's no significant different in performance at the track or street to justify the price difference if you got the right spec. Wing, Touring, or RS.”
where in that paragraph do you specify that you are referring to the 991?
The point of this thread is whether there is such a thing a GT Fever, to get the so called next best thing. The 991.2 RS is awesome. Not that the 991.2 GT3/Touring isn’t. Whether the cost difference is worth it is totally subjective. I can set it up to keep up or even pass a 991.2 RS at with PBIR, Homestead, or Sebring. That is the point. Hence, not necessarily worth the psychological urgency to upgrade. You know what opinions are like, but facts are facts.
Whenever someone in FL wants to meet, at any of those tracks, I’m down. No ego, just for fun, like my posts. No name calling anywhere in my post.
02-13-2019, 11:40 PM
#90
Nordschleife Master
Did you ever try to hold back the tide?
AP’s boys made the RS to be the ultimate GT. It is. That’s why factually that annoying little saying of “RS is an RS” actually means something to PAG and in the Porsche community. The GT3 is epic and an icon in the sports car performance world but the RS is just a step on. Fact. Full stop.
Whether you compare the the performance or looks or both the winner is undeniable when the getting the “most” is the goal. RS>GT. As Catchpole so eloquently put it “the looks of the RS make the GT3 look shy and retiring”
If your personal tastes or preferences have you leaning towards a GT3 then it’s the better choice for you. That’s why they make both. You have a choice based on your likes and preferences and priorities.
But..there is something about the 3RS and its visceral raw nature that had nearly every reviewer picking it over a 2RS. Example: “ Evo 3 Kings”. That says volumes for the 3RS. There is just something magical about it. It’s a real NA drivers car that nips at the heels of the 2RS in performance and makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up when you get over 8000 rpm. The thing rips!
Always willing to to help with your plight...I’ll just leave this here. One of the most enjoyable reviews of the 3RS out there. They picked it over the 2RS also. I have 0 desire for a 2RS with this thing in my garage.
AP’s boys made the RS to be the ultimate GT. It is. That’s why factually that annoying little saying of “RS is an RS” actually means something to PAG and in the Porsche community. The GT3 is epic and an icon in the sports car performance world but the RS is just a step on. Fact. Full stop.
Whether you compare the the performance or looks or both the winner is undeniable when the getting the “most” is the goal. RS>GT. As Catchpole so eloquently put it “the looks of the RS make the GT3 look shy and retiring”
If your personal tastes or preferences have you leaning towards a GT3 then it’s the better choice for you. That’s why they make both. You have a choice based on your likes and preferences and priorities.
But..there is something about the 3RS and its visceral raw nature that had nearly every reviewer picking it over a 2RS. Example: “ Evo 3 Kings”. That says volumes for the 3RS. There is just something magical about it. It’s a real NA drivers car that nips at the heels of the 2RS in performance and makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up when you get over 8000 rpm. The thing rips!
Always willing to to help with your plight...I’ll just leave this here. One of the most enjoyable reviews of the 3RS out there. They picked it over the 2RS also. I have 0 desire for a 2RS with this thing in my garage.