Braking the GT2RS
08-09-2018, 12:25 PM
#17
Former Vendor
Thanks for the shout out Seb! We are thrilled to be paired with ST and expect you to enjoy the setup on track quite thoroughly : )
If anyone has any questions on the ST ceramics, I'd be happy to answer them
If anyone has any questions on the ST ceramics, I'd be happy to answer them
08-09-2018, 12:32 PM
#18
Are you sure about that Grant? My understanding is that it is just a matter of fitment and proper mounting along with proper pad sizes for them to work with the ST rotors. You can use the ST with the steel factory calipers which are smaller they just have to be fitted properly. I know the AP guys say you can't but I don't think anyone has tried it yet
08-09-2018, 12:42 PM
#19
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Are you sure about that Grant? My understanding is that it is just a matter of fitment and proper mounting along with proper pad sizes for them to work with the ST rotors. You can use the ST with the steel factory calipers which are smaller they just have to be fitted properly. I know the AP guys say you can't but I don't think anyone has tried it yet
"The Surface Transforms carbon ceramics will not be compatible with our complete brake kit. There are several reasons why that is the case. OEM-style discs tend to have a very tall radial depth, as does the pad that mates to them. Radial depth means the distance from the inner diameter of the disc to the outer diameter...essentially, the height of the swept area. For example, the iron OEM GT3 discs have a radial depth of 66mm. The PCCB's have a swept area that is 75mm. That is typical. Unlike a proper iron racing rotor, carbon ceramic discs typically do not have an efficient internal vane structure that flows a lot of air. For example, our iron front discs have 84 internal cooling vanes. Implementing such a design on a carbon ceramic disc would be both technically challenging and expensive/labor intensive. The OEM PCCB discs have about half as many, nor do they have the same shape. I'm not 100% certain of the vane design on the Surface Transforms discs, but my hunch is that it is very similar to the OEM in both quantity and shape. Carbon ceramic discs (and their corresponding pads) are usually made to have as much surface area as possible to aid with the radiation of heat. Conversely, our iron racing discs are incredibly efficient, and can be made with a smaller radial depth. In our case, the radial depth is 54mm. AP Racing doesn't have a caliper in its part bin that would run on a disc with a radial depth as large as the OEM setup. Doing so would mean that the caliper was carrying around a ton of unnecessary mass."
08-09-2018, 01:17 PM
#20
I am relying on what I was told by AP reps. No, I haven't tried it...
"The Surface Transforms carbon ceramics will not be compatible with our complete brake kit. There are several reasons why that is the case. OEM-style discs tend to have a very tall radial depth, as does the pad that mates to them. Radial depth means the distance from the inner diameter of the disc to the outer diameter...essentially, the height of the swept area. For example, the iron OEM GT3 discs have a radial depth of 66mm. The PCCB's have a swept area that is 75mm. That is typical. Unlike a proper iron racing rotor, carbon ceramic discs typically do not have an efficient internal vane structure that flows a lot of air. For example, our iron front discs have 84 internal cooling vanes. Implementing such a design on a carbon ceramic disc would be both technically challenging and expensive/labor intensive. The OEM PCCB discs have about half as many, nor do they have the same shape. I'm not 100% certain of the vane design on the Surface Transforms discs, but my hunch is that it is very similar to the OEM in both quantity and shape. Carbon ceramic discs (and their corresponding pads) are usually made to have as much surface area as possible to aid with the radiation of heat. Conversely, our iron racing discs are incredibly efficient, and can be made with a smaller radial depth. In our case, the radial depth is 54mm. AP Racing doesn't have a caliper in its part bin that would run on a disc with a radial depth as large as the OEM setup. Doing so would mean that the caliper was carrying around a ton of unnecessary mass."
"The Surface Transforms carbon ceramics will not be compatible with our complete brake kit. There are several reasons why that is the case. OEM-style discs tend to have a very tall radial depth, as does the pad that mates to them. Radial depth means the distance from the inner diameter of the disc to the outer diameter...essentially, the height of the swept area. For example, the iron OEM GT3 discs have a radial depth of 66mm. The PCCB's have a swept area that is 75mm. That is typical. Unlike a proper iron racing rotor, carbon ceramic discs typically do not have an efficient internal vane structure that flows a lot of air. For example, our iron front discs have 84 internal cooling vanes. Implementing such a design on a carbon ceramic disc would be both technically challenging and expensive/labor intensive. The OEM PCCB discs have about half as many, nor do they have the same shape. I'm not 100% certain of the vane design on the Surface Transforms discs, but my hunch is that it is very similar to the OEM in both quantity and shape. Carbon ceramic discs (and their corresponding pads) are usually made to have as much surface area as possible to aid with the radiation of heat. Conversely, our iron racing discs are incredibly efficient, and can be made with a smaller radial depth. In our case, the radial depth is 54mm. AP Racing doesn't have a caliper in its part bin that would run on a disc with a radial depth as large as the OEM setup. Doing so would mean that the caliper was carrying around a ton of unnecessary mass."
08-09-2018, 03:47 PM
#21
Contact the guys at Autoquest for the ST Rotors, here’s a link to their website with the pricing: Autoquest website
The Mov’it guys can be contacted at this link and will be able to help you with pricing for the calipers: Mov’it website
Note it’s the same replacement kit from Mov’it for the OEM PCCB sizing installed on the 991 GT3RS and GT2RS
I contacted Movit some days ago and "for suprise" they told me that Movit does not have their own ceramic rotors any more. ST is now thier ceramic rotors supplier.
So my question for you: Why Movit did not offered the full set rotors+calipers+pads ?
Do you have information that some other pads will fit with these calipers?
08-09-2018, 06:48 PM
#22
From what I read the entire setup (calipers and disks) are ALMOST as light as the pccb setup. But to ne honest it's the disks I care about don't really understand the obsession with very lightweight calipers, it's not rotating mass.
08-09-2018, 06:53 PM
#23
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doesn't st offers ceramic disks for iron calipers? If so they should fit AP calipers.
From what I read the entire setup (calipers and disks) are ALMOST as light as the pccb setup. But to ne honest it's the disks I care about don't really understand the obsession with very lightweight calipers, it's not rotating mass.
From what I read the entire setup (calipers and disks) are ALMOST as light as the pccb setup. But to ne honest it's the disks I care about don't really understand the obsession with very lightweight calipers, it's not rotating mass.
Calipers are not rotating mass, but they are unsprung mass. Does make some difference...
08-09-2018, 07:01 PM
#24
Former Vendor
doesn't st offers ceramic disks for iron calipers? If so they should fit AP calipers.
From what I read the entire setup (calipers and disks) are ALMOST as light as the pccb setup. But to ne honest it's the disks I care about don't really understand the obsession with very lightweight calipers, it's not rotating mass.
From what I read the entire setup (calipers and disks) are ALMOST as light as the pccb setup. But to ne honest it's the disks I care about don't really understand the obsession with very lightweight calipers, it's not rotating mass.
08-09-2018, 07:50 PM
#25
John,
Please do this with the AMG GT R ASAP; there are many of us in the future who will be buying ST rotors from you IF the rotors are the same sizes as the PCCBs, and I suspect they are!
Bish
08-11-2018, 11:24 AM
#28
08-11-2018, 03:07 PM
#29
I contacted Movit some days ago and "for suprise" they told me that Movit does not have their own ceramic rotors any more. ST is now thier ceramic rotors supplier.
So my question for you: Why Movit did not offered the full set rotors+calipers+pads ?
Do you have information that some other pads will fit with these calipers?
