PPF Sun Tek Ultra Experience and Opinions?
07-17-2018, 02:27 PM
#16
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Dan
Was your installer the one you went to for your GT3? If so, perhaps ask him? He should be able to shed some light on the situation.
Was your installer the one you went to for your GT3? If so, perhaps ask him? He should be able to shed some light on the situation.
07-17-2018, 04:04 PM
#18
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Spyerx, the poop was small brown stringy. it did not explode into something that could cause the damage.
Waxer, I tend to agree. This hasn't happened on any of my other cars. The film would be warranty but, the re-installation costs will be a subject of discussion.
Robert, Yes. In two years this has happened only one other time and it was a pro using a 3k psi pressure washer. I have a feeling the difference in having CQuartz and not may be determining. If it's acting as a hard shell, it might make the difference. I have confidence with the installer so we'll see what solution results. Most likely, we'll need to redo the door and, I may have to CQuartz everything to see if that makes the difference.
Thanks again all for your thoughts, questions and comments. It's much appreciated.
Waxer, I tend to agree. This hasn't happened on any of my other cars. The film would be warranty but, the re-installation costs will be a subject of discussion.
Robert, Yes. In two years this has happened only one other time and it was a pro using a 3k psi pressure washer. I have a feeling the difference in having CQuartz and not may be determining. If it's acting as a hard shell, it might make the difference. I have confidence with the installer so we'll see what solution results. Most likely, we'll need to redo the door and, I may have to CQuartz everything to see if that makes the difference.
Thanks again all for your thoughts, questions and comments. It's much appreciated.
07-17-2018, 11:27 PM
#19
I've had both Suntek Ultra and XPEL on multiple cars, and I've had no issues with the Suntek, but I've never been really happy with the XPEL, it always had various issues. I've had Suntek Ultra now on 3 cars without a single issue. I'm not sure it really makes a difference, but every single car (Suntek and XPEL) has been ceramic coated.
07-18-2018, 12:14 AM
#20
GT3 player par excellence
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also if you have bug gut bird poop, wipe them off as soon as possible, it will yellow your film and or other damages
07-18-2018, 12:41 AM
#21
Drifting
I have Suntek Ultra on my GT3. Using the same pressure washer as you (well it's a different model but same motor for 2030psi and 1.76gpm). I only use the 40-degree or 25-degree nozzles. And the pressure is probably closer to 1,000psi to be honest. Won't damage your paint. I can hold my hand up in front of either nozzle without any real discomfort, so I doubt it's hurting the PPF or paint.
07-18-2018, 08:01 AM
#22
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Lots of great input here and once Dan brings me the Macan, I can better asses the situation. I’ve personally only seen film peel up where another pro detailer used a strong pressure washer, true 3000 psi, but in that situation, the film was more pushed back or peeled, not penetrated in a few small isolated areas like the one in this Macan.
Not having a nano coating definitely is the 2nd differentiating factor between this car and the other two we did for Dan. I know for a fact that a nano coating reduces the surface tension on a surface allowing dirt, debris, water, etc. to easily come off the surface. But I’m not sure that’s a huge factor since the film itself has an inherent hydropobic coating and we did install CarPro reload as part of our basic SOP on a ppf installation.
So, no speculation yet until I can see in person.
Suntek PPF Ultra is an excellent film and we will do our own testing with a pressure washer on this Macan to attempt duplication of the situation.
See you Friday dan and i’m Sure we’ll figure something out.
Not having a nano coating definitely is the 2nd differentiating factor between this car and the other two we did for Dan. I know for a fact that a nano coating reduces the surface tension on a surface allowing dirt, debris, water, etc. to easily come off the surface. But I’m not sure that’s a huge factor since the film itself has an inherent hydropobic coating and we did install CarPro reload as part of our basic SOP on a ppf installation.
So, no speculation yet until I can see in person.
Suntek PPF Ultra is an excellent film and we will do our own testing with a pressure washer on this Macan to attempt duplication of the situation.
See you Friday dan and i’m Sure we’ll figure something out.
07-18-2018, 01:14 PM
#23
Race Director
Spyerx, the poop was small brown stringy. it did not explode into something that could cause the damage.
Waxer, I tend to agree. This hasn't happened on any of my other cars. The film would be warranty but, the re-installation costs will be a subject of discussion.
Robert, Yes. In two years this has happened only one other time and it was a pro using a 3k psi pressure washer. I have a feeling the difference in having CQuartz and not may be determining. If it's acting as a hard shell, it might make the difference. I have confidence with the installer so we'll see what solution results. Most likely, we'll need to redo the door and, I may have to CQuartz everything to see if that makes the difference.
Thanks again all for your thoughts, questions and comments. It's much appreciated.
Waxer, I tend to agree. This hasn't happened on any of my other cars. The film would be warranty but, the re-installation costs will be a subject of discussion.
Robert, Yes. In two years this has happened only one other time and it was a pro using a 3k psi pressure washer. I have a feeling the difference in having CQuartz and not may be determining. If it's acting as a hard shell, it might make the difference. I have confidence with the installer so we'll see what solution results. Most likely, we'll need to redo the door and, I may have to CQuartz everything to see if that makes the difference.
Thanks again all for your thoughts, questions and comments. It's much appreciated.
07-18-2018, 01:36 PM
#24
Burning Brakes
There's no telling from that picture what is going on and I do not mean that in an accusatory way. But hearing Moe was the installer and will be inspecting it, you honestly have nothing to worry about. If there is any warranty issue, I happen to know Moe will take care of it and deal with the manufacturer.
You're in good hands.
On the note of Suntek Ultra:
I've used a lot of it since its release and never had an issue with durability or performance. That is not to say faulty products can't make it onto someone's car though. But as Moe touched on, coating the PPF will give an owner more chemical resistance. As it's now practical to install PPF in a way that it is absolutely beautiful(unlike from around 2012 and before....), there's something to be said for making it easier to keep attractive for those who are into that kind of thing. So coating them properly can still provide value for those.
It's important to make it clear that hydrophobicity of a surface does not intrinsically mean it is chemically resistant to any defined measure. So hydrophobic PPF is not absolutely mean it's not going to be the same as coated PPF....and not all coatings are hydrophobic at all either. Hydrophobicity, by itself, is a by-product of surface tension(in this case).
You're in good hands.
On the note of Suntek Ultra:
I've used a lot of it since its release and never had an issue with durability or performance. That is not to say faulty products can't make it onto someone's car though. But as Moe touched on, coating the PPF will give an owner more chemical resistance. As it's now practical to install PPF in a way that it is absolutely beautiful(unlike from around 2012 and before....), there's something to be said for making it easier to keep attractive for those who are into that kind of thing. So coating them properly can still provide value for those.
It's important to make it clear that hydrophobicity of a surface does not intrinsically mean it is chemically resistant to any defined measure. So hydrophobic PPF is not absolutely mean it's not going to be the same as coated PPF....and not all coatings are hydrophobic at all either. Hydrophobicity, by itself, is a by-product of surface tension(in this case).
07-20-2018, 01:53 PM
#25
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Lots of great input here and once Dan brings me the Macan, I can better asses the situation. I’ve personally only seen film peel up where another pro detailer used a strong pressure washer, true 3000 psi, but in that situation, the film was more pushed back or peeled, not penetrated in a few small isolated areas like the one in this Macan.
Not having a nano coating definitely is the 2nd differentiating factor between this car and the other two we did for Dan. I know for a fact that a nano coating reduces the surface tension on a surface allowing dirt, debris, water, etc. to easily come off the surface. But I’m not sure that’s a huge factor since the film itself has an inherent hydropobic coating and we did install CarPro reload as part of our basic SOP on a ppf installation.
So, no speculation yet until I can see in person.
Suntek PPF Ultra is an excellent film and we will do our own testing with a pressure washer on this Macan to attempt duplication of the situation.
See you Friday dan and i’m Sure we’ll figure something out.
Not having a nano coating definitely is the 2nd differentiating factor between this car and the other two we did for Dan. I know for a fact that a nano coating reduces the surface tension on a surface allowing dirt, debris, water, etc. to easily come off the surface. But I’m not sure that’s a huge factor since the film itself has an inherent hydropobic coating and we did install CarPro reload as part of our basic SOP on a ppf installation.
So, no speculation yet until I can see in person.
Suntek PPF Ultra is an excellent film and we will do our own testing with a pressure washer on this Macan to attempt duplication of the situation.
See you Friday dan and i’m Sure we’ll figure something out.
My wife brought this to my attention yesterday. It's on the hood. The PPF is doing it's job but, it's not holding up very well in the process. Although she says she has no recollection of anything hitting the car yesterday, I checked at an angle and, I can see a slight depression in the film so I'm sure it was an impact.
I'm starting to believe this is may not be a one day fix thing, you'll have to tell me. Let's chat when you have a free moment and, thanks.
Dan (should be glad its not the paint)
07-20-2018, 01:57 PM
#26
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
I had Xpel Stealth applied to my whole car. One small section kept on coming up so was replaced under warranty which the work was also included. I am assuming Xpel would compensate my Detailer. I also did not care to ask because if they are taking care of it - good enough for me.
07-27-2018, 06:31 PM
#28
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
To update, I just got back from GP after bringing both the Macan and Cayenne and the pressure washer and can say Moe was able to replicate what happened. The Macan's Suntek Ultra film without CQuartz will not withstand pressure wash at close distance. The Cayenne's older Suntek with CQuartz withstood multiple range zero pressure wash for the same duration or longer.
Moe is graciously going to perform testing experimenting with Suntek, Suntek Ultra, Suntek with Cquartz and Suntek Ultra with CQuartz and, probably XPEL and another film to see where my pressure washer will penetrate the film and, where it will not. If the Suntek Ultra with CQuartz withstands the wash, I'll add the nanocoat and, we've worked out the associated costs. Where it becomes an issue is if the Suntek Ultra with CQuartz still fails to withstand a wash, then it's a clear performance issue with the film and, we're going with a full do-over with the old Suntek and CQuartz and, Suntek will need to stand up to a warranty claim. It's going to be a week before the testing will be complete and, it will be done very carefully, likely video documented because it's a big deal when we're talking about replacing almost a full wrap at Suntek's expense.
In short, I wanted to share this with the community, especially for those of you who are using Suntek Ultra. Until we find out whether the difference is the CQuartz application or, if the film is just not as resilient as its older version, for those of you who have Suntek Ultra without some additional nano coat, you may want to be careful how you wash your car. For me, I'm going to have the underlying problem resolved one way or another without having to tip toe around my washes when I know I have two cars that can withstand a wash and, one that can't but should. I'm glad I can count on Moe to get me there.
Dan (will keep the forum updated)
Moe is graciously going to perform testing experimenting with Suntek, Suntek Ultra, Suntek with Cquartz and Suntek Ultra with CQuartz and, probably XPEL and another film to see where my pressure washer will penetrate the film and, where it will not. If the Suntek Ultra with CQuartz withstands the wash, I'll add the nanocoat and, we've worked out the associated costs. Where it becomes an issue is if the Suntek Ultra with CQuartz still fails to withstand a wash, then it's a clear performance issue with the film and, we're going with a full do-over with the old Suntek and CQuartz and, Suntek will need to stand up to a warranty claim. It's going to be a week before the testing will be complete and, it will be done very carefully, likely video documented because it's a big deal when we're talking about replacing almost a full wrap at Suntek's expense.
In short, I wanted to share this with the community, especially for those of you who are using Suntek Ultra. Until we find out whether the difference is the CQuartz application or, if the film is just not as resilient as its older version, for those of you who have Suntek Ultra without some additional nano coat, you may want to be careful how you wash your car. For me, I'm going to have the underlying problem resolved one way or another without having to tip toe around my washes when I know I have two cars that can withstand a wash and, one that can't but should. I'm glad I can count on Moe to get me there.
Dan (will keep the forum updated)
07-27-2018, 09:44 PM
#29
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To be candid, this is definitely the EXTREME case and we’re possibly pushing the film to the absolute limit. The consistent damage was replicated when pressure washer tip was put DIRECTLY onto the film. Dan and I agreed that defies the laws of common sense and no one would actually rest the tip of a pressure washer on the film to get something off.
With that said, I also see Dan’s concern how this same test did not tear the film on his Cayenne, which we did verify to be Suntek PPF Topcoated. Other than film being different, there was also CQUARTZ nano coating on cayenne, while Macan had no actual nano coating, rather, CarPro Reload.
until further testing in control environment, everything is still mere speculation and we want to be certain as to giving valid information and not opinions.
In a day and age where there’s information overload, sometimes based on opinions or biased facts, we feel it’s our fiduciary duty to provide our clients, and those that see us as experts and professionals in the field, with the most reliable and honest data.
With that said, I also see Dan’s concern how this same test did not tear the film on his Cayenne, which we did verify to be Suntek PPF Topcoated. Other than film being different, there was also CQUARTZ nano coating on cayenne, while Macan had no actual nano coating, rather, CarPro Reload.
until further testing in control environment, everything is still mere speculation and we want to be certain as to giving valid information and not opinions.
In a day and age where there’s information overload, sometimes based on opinions or biased facts, we feel it’s our fiduciary duty to provide our clients, and those that see us as experts and professionals in the field, with the most reliable and honest data.
07-27-2018, 09:45 PM
#30
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