OT:money no object, would you pick Ruf or Singer and why?
06-03-2018, 11:53 AM
#17
Three Wheelin'
06-03-2018, 12:11 PM
#19
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I've had the pleasure to drive a singer, and have visited both the singer factory, as well as the RUF factory (just last week). my thoughts are follows:
-singer reminds me of a classic California show car shop, where many skilled artisans are working on leathers, colors and details, to make beautiful works of art. The end result is more of a show car, than a performance car. That's not To say that the singer is not fantastic to drive, just that more emphasis is placed on really unique aesthetics. To me driving the singer felt like holding a beautiful and intricate watch... You enjoy examining all the components, but you're not really too worried about all of the functionality.
RUF, By contrast, feels like a race prep shop. While the finish on these cars is nice enough, there's nothing truly that special about what your touch and see. However, there are multiple engine rooms, there is a dyno, and most of the workers were working on suspension set ups, engines and transmissions. Completely different focus and ethos than Singer.
My intention there was to go see the carbon fiber car, as they are building the first customer car after Geneva. When you consider that it's a similar price to a singer, to me there is no contest in deciding which car provides true intrinsic value. The RUF is not a prettied-up 911 with nice paint and leather. Its a completely custom carbon chassis machine, with in-board suspension, all dimensions completely different from a 911 including the doors (despite looking similar to the untrained eye). The new RUF carbon car is their own from-scratch creation, with a custom made super short geared 7 speed, with a unique linkage, unique steering rack, completely bespoke suspension structure.. this is a performance machine with huge built-in value from the ground up. And... it's still quite pretty, but not in the leatherlined engine bay sort of way , more in an engineering uniqueness sort of way. Only the glass comes from a 911.. no other part.. that speaks to me.
Singer is an artisan shop, RUF is a storied race shop. I can't think of a sub $1M car I want more than the carbon RUF.. nothing speaks to me more than a 911 which is actually a full carbon race car underneath.
Ill share some pics when I get a decent internet connection.. currently riding shotgun in a Zonda and Italian cell-phone towers just can't seem to keep up!?
-singer reminds me of a classic California show car shop, where many skilled artisans are working on leathers, colors and details, to make beautiful works of art. The end result is more of a show car, than a performance car. That's not To say that the singer is not fantastic to drive, just that more emphasis is placed on really unique aesthetics. To me driving the singer felt like holding a beautiful and intricate watch... You enjoy examining all the components, but you're not really too worried about all of the functionality.
RUF, By contrast, feels like a race prep shop. While the finish on these cars is nice enough, there's nothing truly that special about what your touch and see. However, there are multiple engine rooms, there is a dyno, and most of the workers were working on suspension set ups, engines and transmissions. Completely different focus and ethos than Singer.
My intention there was to go see the carbon fiber car, as they are building the first customer car after Geneva. When you consider that it's a similar price to a singer, to me there is no contest in deciding which car provides true intrinsic value. The RUF is not a prettied-up 911 with nice paint and leather. Its a completely custom carbon chassis machine, with in-board suspension, all dimensions completely different from a 911 including the doors (despite looking similar to the untrained eye). The new RUF carbon car is their own from-scratch creation, with a custom made super short geared 7 speed, with a unique linkage, unique steering rack, completely bespoke suspension structure.. this is a performance machine with huge built-in value from the ground up. And... it's still quite pretty, but not in the leatherlined engine bay sort of way , more in an engineering uniqueness sort of way. Only the glass comes from a 911.. no other part.. that speaks to me.
Singer is an artisan shop, RUF is a storied race shop. I can't think of a sub $1M car I want more than the carbon RUF.. nothing speaks to me more than a 911 which is actually a full carbon race car underneath.
Ill share some pics when I get a decent internet connection.. currently riding shotgun in a Zonda and Italian cell-phone towers just can't seem to keep up!?
06-03-2018, 01:38 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I've had the pleasure to drive a singer, and have visited both the singer factory, as well as the RUF factory (just last week). my thoughts are follows:
-singer reminds me of a classic California show car shop, where many skilled artisans are working on leathers, colors and details, to make beautiful works of art. The end result is more of a show car, than a performance car. That's not To say that the singer is not fantastic to drive, just that more emphasis is placed on really unique aesthetics. To me driving the singer felt like holding a beautiful and intricate watch... You enjoy examining all the components, but you're not really too worried about all of the functionality.
RUF, By contrast, feels like a race prep shop. While the finish on these cars is nice enough, there's nothing truly that special about what your touch and see. However, there are multiple engine rooms, there is a dyno, and most of the workers were working on suspension set ups, engines and transmissions. Completely different focus and ethos than Singer.
My intention there was to go see the carbon fiber car, as they are building the first customer car after Geneva. When you consider that it's a similar price to a singer, to me there is no contest in deciding which car provides true intrinsic value. The RUF is not a prettied-up 911 with nice paint and leather. Its a completely custom carbon chassis machine, with in-board suspension, all dimensions completely different from a 911 including the doors (despite looking similar to the untrained eye). The new RUF carbon car is their own from-scratch creation, with a custom made super short geared 7 speed, with a unique linkage, unique steering rack, completely bespoke suspension structure.. this is a performance machine with huge built-in value from the ground up. And... it's still quite pretty, but not in the leatherlined engine bay sort of way , more in an engineering uniqueness sort of way. Only the glass comes from a 911.. no other part.. that speaks to me.
Singer is an artisan shop, RUF is a storied race shop. I can't think of a sub $1M car I want more than the carbon RUF.. nothing speaks to me more than a 911 which is actually a full carbon race car underneath.
Ill share some pics when I get a decent internet connection.. currently riding shotgun in a Zonda and Italian cell-phone towers just can't seem to keep up!?
-singer reminds me of a classic California show car shop, where many skilled artisans are working on leathers, colors and details, to make beautiful works of art. The end result is more of a show car, than a performance car. That's not To say that the singer is not fantastic to drive, just that more emphasis is placed on really unique aesthetics. To me driving the singer felt like holding a beautiful and intricate watch... You enjoy examining all the components, but you're not really too worried about all of the functionality.
RUF, By contrast, feels like a race prep shop. While the finish on these cars is nice enough, there's nothing truly that special about what your touch and see. However, there are multiple engine rooms, there is a dyno, and most of the workers were working on suspension set ups, engines and transmissions. Completely different focus and ethos than Singer.
My intention there was to go see the carbon fiber car, as they are building the first customer car after Geneva. When you consider that it's a similar price to a singer, to me there is no contest in deciding which car provides true intrinsic value. The RUF is not a prettied-up 911 with nice paint and leather. Its a completely custom carbon chassis machine, with in-board suspension, all dimensions completely different from a 911 including the doors (despite looking similar to the untrained eye). The new RUF carbon car is their own from-scratch creation, with a custom made super short geared 7 speed, with a unique linkage, unique steering rack, completely bespoke suspension structure.. this is a performance machine with huge built-in value from the ground up. And... it's still quite pretty, but not in the leatherlined engine bay sort of way , more in an engineering uniqueness sort of way. Only the glass comes from a 911.. no other part.. that speaks to me.
Singer is an artisan shop, RUF is a storied race shop. I can't think of a sub $1M car I want more than the carbon RUF.. nothing speaks to me more than a 911 which is actually a full carbon race car underneath.
Ill share some pics when I get a decent internet connection.. currently riding shotgun in a Zonda and Italian cell-phone towers just can't seem to keep up!?
J
06-03-2018, 01:53 PM
#21
Burning Brakes
For me it would be Singer. I had the pleasure of visiting with them last year and they are just works of art. I already have the performance cars.
Cheers
Cheers
06-03-2018, 02:07 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
06-03-2018, 02:08 PM
#25
Rennlist Member
RUF is LIKE a race shop even though they don’t race.
They build cars that look like 911’s and Special stuff likenCTR3.
Its and exotic but looks like 911 and as an aside, because they start with Body in white or a black CF canvas they will build anything you request.
including a bullit proof track weapon.
one day I will visit and one day I will order, the question is, will they have East and West coast reps one day again in the US to help build their brand.
it would be one way I would want to own a dealership..
easiest brand ever to build up and capitalize on.
They build cars that look like 911’s and Special stuff likenCTR3.
Its and exotic but looks like 911 and as an aside, because they start with Body in white or a black CF canvas they will build anything you request.
including a bullit proof track weapon.
one day I will visit and one day I will order, the question is, will they have East and West coast reps one day again in the US to help build their brand.
it would be one way I would want to own a dealership..
easiest brand ever to build up and capitalize on.
06-03-2018, 02:26 PM
#26
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
RUF is LIKE a race shop even though they don’t race.
They build cars that look like 911’s and Special stuff likenCTR3.
Its and exotic but looks like 911 and as an aside, because they start with Body in white or a black CF canvas they will build anything you request.
including a bullit proof track weapon.
They build cars that look like 911’s and Special stuff likenCTR3.
Its and exotic but looks like 911 and as an aside, because they start with Body in white or a black CF canvas they will build anything you request.
including a bullit proof track weapon.
06-03-2018, 02:30 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
That’s what I mean.
You can make it a track weapon by specifying all option, engine brakes etc.
its not what they do per se. But because it’s all custom, it’s what you can build as the ultimate street legal car for the track. Integrated roll cage included :-)
You can make it a track weapon by specifying all option, engine brakes etc.
its not what they do per se. But because it’s all custom, it’s what you can build as the ultimate street legal car for the track. Integrated roll cage included :-)
06-03-2018, 03:39 PM
#28
Race Director
Originally Posted by TB993tt
Ruf is not a "race shop" they have never really been involved in racing, their engines and vehicle set ups are honed for very high speed Autobahn driving. Singer is for show Ruf is for go.
Frustrating I can't post pics, Internet is ****e.. I'll try tomorrow, I have some really good ones of RUF.
I was also in the Pagani Rally this week, and man was that an experience... a Zonda & maybe even more so a Huayra, are like a Singer and a RUF had mad psychedelic Axis Power sex, with cocaine ice cream afterwards to wind down. Incredible finishes together with insane carbon chassis and engines to die for. I'll try to upload one pic at at time... favorite ones first.
Let me just say.. as it's pertinent to this thread. If money is no object, you should definitely go Pagani. the level of detailed care, engineering, ingenuity there is simply astonishing. I admit to being biased as I get to speak to El Jefe & Family himself and therefore absorb all their passion.. but this stuff is next level.
I'll be at the factory later this week to hang out, I'll see if I can get permission to post some detail stuff in this "money no object" thread
06-03-2018, 11:03 PM
#29
You're correct. I actually made that mistake while I was talking to them and they corrected me also. Hopefully the overall message I was trying to convey still makes sense despite that descriptive mistake on my part.
Frustrating I can't post pics, Internet is ****e.. I'll try tomorrow, I have some really good ones of RUF.
I was also in the Pagani Rally this week, and man was that an experience... a Zonda & maybe even more so a Huayra, are like a Singer and a RUF had mad psychedelic Axis Power sex, with cocaine ice cream afterwards to wind down. Incredible finishes together with insane carbon chassis and engines to die for. I'll try to upload one pic at at time... favorite ones first.
Let me just say.. as it's pertinent to this thread. If money is no object, you should definitely go Pagani. the level of detailed care, engineering, ingenuity there is simply astonishing. I admit to being biased as I get to speak to El Jefe & Family himself and therefore absorb all their passion.. but this stuff is next level.
I'll be at the factory later this week to hang out, I'll see if I can get permission to post some detail stuff in this "money no object" thread
Frustrating I can't post pics, Internet is ****e.. I'll try tomorrow, I have some really good ones of RUF.
I was also in the Pagani Rally this week, and man was that an experience... a Zonda & maybe even more so a Huayra, are like a Singer and a RUF had mad psychedelic Axis Power sex, with cocaine ice cream afterwards to wind down. Incredible finishes together with insane carbon chassis and engines to die for. I'll try to upload one pic at at time... favorite ones first.
Let me just say.. as it's pertinent to this thread. If money is no object, you should definitely go Pagani. the level of detailed care, engineering, ingenuity there is simply astonishing. I admit to being biased as I get to speak to El Jefe & Family himself and therefore absorb all their passion.. but this stuff is next level.
I'll be at the factory later this week to hang out, I'll see if I can get permission to post some detail stuff in this "money no object" thread
I would get a Singer because they have a local dealership to me, and you can't get a new street legal RUF, to my knowledge.
06-03-2018, 11:06 PM
#30
RUF is LIKE a race shop even though they don’t race.
They build cars that look like 911’s and Special stuff likenCTR3.
Its and exotic but looks like 911 and as an aside, because they start with Body in white or a black CF canvas they will build anything you request.
including a bullit proof track weapon.
one day I will visit and one day I will order, the question is, will they have East and West coast reps one day again in the US to help build their brand.
it would be one way I would want to own a dealership..
easiest brand ever to build up and capitalize on.
They build cars that look like 911’s and Special stuff likenCTR3.
Its and exotic but looks like 911 and as an aside, because they start with Body in white or a black CF canvas they will build anything you request.
including a bullit proof track weapon.
one day I will visit and one day I will order, the question is, will they have East and West coast reps one day again in the US to help build their brand.
it would be one way I would want to own a dealership..
easiest brand ever to build up and capitalize on.