Tale of a GT2RS Allocation
04-06-2018, 03:06 PM
#121
Burning Brakes
True, in a normal Supply/Demand situation your suggestion of increasing production of the desired product would be a sound solution.
But Gov't regulating agencies have introduced other hurdles that limit GT production besides supply and demand.
One of these is CAFE which relates because the GT cars are Gas Guzzlers. Porsche bean counters are constantly averaging up all the years car sales by their MPG rating,summing all together. Should Porsche's average violate the Corporate Average Fuel Economy limits then Huge fines are due.
Look at how massive these fines are AND they are back calculated based on every car sold that year. There is a very large incentive
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpor...e_fuel_economy
" If the average fuel economy of a manufacturer's annual fleet of vehicle production falls below the applicable requirement, the manufacturer must either apply sufficient CAFE credits (see below) to cover the shortfall or pay a penalty, currently $5.50 per 0.1 mpg under the standard, multiplied by the manufacturer's total production for the U.S. domestic market. "
Using 2016 numbers and a mis rate of 1 MPG, I calculate a fine to Porsche of well over $13M
https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/comp...ord-13310.html
But Gov't regulating agencies have introduced other hurdles that limit GT production besides supply and demand.
One of these is CAFE which relates because the GT cars are Gas Guzzlers. Porsche bean counters are constantly averaging up all the years car sales by their MPG rating,summing all together. Should Porsche's average violate the Corporate Average Fuel Economy limits then Huge fines are due.
Look at how massive these fines are AND they are back calculated based on every car sold that year. There is a very large incentive
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpor...e_fuel_economy
" If the average fuel economy of a manufacturer's annual fleet of vehicle production falls below the applicable requirement, the manufacturer must either apply sufficient CAFE credits (see below) to cover the shortfall or pay a penalty, currently $5.50 per 0.1 mpg under the standard, multiplied by the manufacturer's total production for the U.S. domestic market. "
Using 2016 numbers and a mis rate of 1 MPG, I calculate a fine to Porsche of well over $13M
https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/comp...ord-13310.html
04-06-2018, 03:45 PM
#122
04-06-2018, 04:09 PM
#123
GT3 player par excellence
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
supply demand
loyalty
personal vibe
a true appreciation for the product
many things
together get u a car
SSD msrp
5711/1a they told me to fk off
panarai I told bonatti to fk off
cipollini i told him to keep womanizing and stop making garbage disguised as bikes
specialized is new to me. but they know I beat the crap
out of their product and love it.
gt cars same. if the dealer feels that u are really a gt nut (that doesn’t mean u track or race) things happen.
loyalty
personal vibe
a true appreciation for the product
many things
together get u a car
SSD msrp
5711/1a they told me to fk off
panarai I told bonatti to fk off
cipollini i told him to keep womanizing and stop making garbage disguised as bikes
specialized is new to me. but they know I beat the crap
out of their product and love it.
gt cars same. if the dealer feels that u are really a gt nut (that doesn’t mean u track or race) things happen.
04-06-2018, 04:42 PM
#124
supply demand
loyalty
personal vibe
a true appreciation for the product
many things
together get u a car
SSD msrp
5711/1a they told me to fk off
panarai I told bonatti to fk off
cipollini i told him to keep womanizing and stop making garbage disguised as bikes
specialized is new to me. but they know I beat the crap
out of their product and love it.
gt cars same. if the dealer feels that u are really a gt nut (that doesn’t mean u track or race) things happen.
loyalty
personal vibe
a true appreciation for the product
many things
together get u a car
SSD msrp
5711/1a they told me to fk off
panarai I told bonatti to fk off
cipollini i told him to keep womanizing and stop making garbage disguised as bikes
specialized is new to me. but they know I beat the crap
out of their product and love it.
gt cars same. if the dealer feels that u are really a gt nut (that doesn’t mean u track or race) things happen.
04-06-2018, 04:49 PM
#126
Burning Brakes
04-06-2018, 04:58 PM
#127
I make that post and THATS what you ask??? LOL just playing around 
I paid 5 over MSRP a year ago, so 17.5 brand new with my name on the warranty card and I peeled the stickers off myself. The ask is now 19.5 for black and 20.5 for white I believe for BNIB. I went black dial, prefer it to the more popular white.
PM me if you want my jeweler's info, I consider him one of the best. Be careful, it's a slippery slope
I paid 5 over MSRP a year ago, so 17.5 brand new with my name on the warranty card and I peeled the stickers off myself. The ask is now 19.5 for black and 20.5 for white I believe for BNIB. I went black dial, prefer it to the more popular white.
PM me if you want my jeweler's info, I consider him one of the best. Be careful, it's a slippery slope
04-06-2018, 05:04 PM
#128
Burning Brakes
04-06-2018, 05:21 PM
#130
don't want to hijack this thread but can't help myself..People love the SS SkyD because it's now available at 30% of the WG cost when 99 out of 100 people wouldn't be able to tell the difference. I had the SS black dial (I bought it simply because I was offered one at MSRP and wanted to try it out) and agree, it was way too bulky/blingy for my taste and traded it a couple days later.
I had the 116520 and got it at MSRP as well, it was my favorite until I was able to get the 116500. The 520's only weakness IMO was the bezel, if you just breathe on it - it would scratch and my OCD couldn't handle that...hence the skyrocket in demand for the 500 with the gorgeous ceramic bezel.
edit - I get my pricing off of rolexforums, not eBay... haven't been active on there in a long time but browse the for sale ads and check in with my dealer from time to time
If you aren't already in line, you are too late. It's like the 3RS/2RS LOL. Time to go shop at McLaren/Ferrari/Lambor.. oh wait I mean Omega/Hublot/Breitling/Cartier... Thankfully I'm not going to go masochistically hunting for this one. Since I got my DaytonaC I haven't seen a single watch I'm interested in and feel the same way with my GT3..they are the endgame for me! I will say the new Pepsi is admittedly a gorgeous piece and unique with the jubilee and slimmed lugs. Looks killer
Ok back to 2RS allocations...
04-06-2018, 05:27 PM
#131
04-06-2018, 06:00 PM
#132
Racer
Join Date: Oct 2017
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Getting back to the original topic, it seems so obvious to me that market pricing is "fair" in the way that the price is determined by the willingness of individuals to transact at a given price for a good or service. There is no way that market pricing isn't fair because it is by definition "fair". Frankly people who don't like market pricing are likely those that want something but don't have the willingness to spend the funds or don't have the funds in the first place to pay for it.
Now, if a dealer promises you a car and then pretends to not know you exist when it is time to deliver, then that is something to be upset about. But in my opinion that is not an "ADM" issue, that is more of a "quality of the people you do business with" issue. Dealer games are one thing. ADM is another thing.
If you don't like ADM, then don't pay it. If there are enough of us that don't pay it, then they will stop asking for it. the problem is everyone's bid price is going to be different. Would you pay $1 ADM? Obviously. Well you'll probably lose out to the guy who will pay $10 ADM, and he would lose out to the guy that was willing to pay $100 ADM. That's just how a free market works when demand exceeds supply. I paid an ADM for my .2 GT3 allocation. Why did I pay it? Because after some initial legwork I found out that it wasn't easy to get a car. My local dealer offered me a slot at ADM and I took it. Would I have preferred not to pay ADM? Yes. But I wanted the car and didn't think another slot would come along so I took it and told myself I could live with the "extra cost".
You can't really hate that ADM exists because that would essentially be saying you hate that the GT3 is such a desirable car or that you think it would be better if Porsche actually built way more GT3s than they could sell and then dealers would have to give a discount (or reverse ADM) in order to sell them or even a more extreme example where they built so many GT3s (like a billion of them) that they were actually worthless.
No one likes paying more money than they HAVE to. But no one HAS to pay more than they ultimately WANT to when it comes to a GT3.
Now, if a dealer promises you a car and then pretends to not know you exist when it is time to deliver, then that is something to be upset about. But in my opinion that is not an "ADM" issue, that is more of a "quality of the people you do business with" issue. Dealer games are one thing. ADM is another thing.
If you don't like ADM, then don't pay it. If there are enough of us that don't pay it, then they will stop asking for it. the problem is everyone's bid price is going to be different. Would you pay $1 ADM? Obviously. Well you'll probably lose out to the guy who will pay $10 ADM, and he would lose out to the guy that was willing to pay $100 ADM. That's just how a free market works when demand exceeds supply. I paid an ADM for my .2 GT3 allocation. Why did I pay it? Because after some initial legwork I found out that it wasn't easy to get a car. My local dealer offered me a slot at ADM and I took it. Would I have preferred not to pay ADM? Yes. But I wanted the car and didn't think another slot would come along so I took it and told myself I could live with the "extra cost".
You can't really hate that ADM exists because that would essentially be saying you hate that the GT3 is such a desirable car or that you think it would be better if Porsche actually built way more GT3s than they could sell and then dealers would have to give a discount (or reverse ADM) in order to sell them or even a more extreme example where they built so many GT3s (like a billion of them) that they were actually worthless.
No one likes paying more money than they HAVE to. But no one HAS to pay more than they ultimately WANT to when it comes to a GT3.
04-06-2018, 06:25 PM
#135
Getting back to the original topic, it seems so obvious to me that market pricing is "fair" in the way that the price is determined by the willingness of individuals to transact at a given price for a good or service. There is no way that market pricing isn't fair because it is by definition "fair". Frankly people who don't like market pricing are likely those that want something but don't have the willingness to spend the funds or don't have the funds in the first place to pay for it.
Now, if a dealer promises you a car and then pretends to not know you exist when it is time to deliver, then that is something to be upset about. But in my opinion that is not an "ADM" issue, that is more of a "quality of the people you do business with" issue. Dealer games are one thing. ADM is another thing.
If you don't like ADM, then don't pay it. If there are enough of us that don't pay it, then they will stop asking for it. the problem is everyone's bid price is going to be different. Would you pay $1 ADM? Obviously. Well you'll probably lose out to the guy who will pay $10 ADM, and he would lose out to the guy that was willing to pay $100 ADM. That's just how a free market works when demand exceeds supply. I paid an ADM for my .2 GT3 allocation. Why did I pay it? Because after some initial legwork I found out that it wasn't easy to get a car. My local dealer offered me a slot at ADM and I took it. Would I have preferred not to pay ADM? Yes. But I wanted the car and didn't think another slot would come along so I took it and told myself I could live with the "extra cost".
You can't really hate that ADM exists because that would essentially be saying you hate that the GT3 is such a desirable car or that you think it would be better if Porsche actually built way more GT3s than they could sell and then dealers would have to give a discount (or reverse ADM) in order to sell them or even a more extreme example where they built so many GT3s (like a billion of them) that they were actually worthless.
No one likes paying more money than they HAVE to. But no one HAS to pay more than they ultimately WANT to when it comes to a GT3.
Now, if a dealer promises you a car and then pretends to not know you exist when it is time to deliver, then that is something to be upset about. But in my opinion that is not an "ADM" issue, that is more of a "quality of the people you do business with" issue. Dealer games are one thing. ADM is another thing.
If you don't like ADM, then don't pay it. If there are enough of us that don't pay it, then they will stop asking for it. the problem is everyone's bid price is going to be different. Would you pay $1 ADM? Obviously. Well you'll probably lose out to the guy who will pay $10 ADM, and he would lose out to the guy that was willing to pay $100 ADM. That's just how a free market works when demand exceeds supply. I paid an ADM for my .2 GT3 allocation. Why did I pay it? Because after some initial legwork I found out that it wasn't easy to get a car. My local dealer offered me a slot at ADM and I took it. Would I have preferred not to pay ADM? Yes. But I wanted the car and didn't think another slot would come along so I took it and told myself I could live with the "extra cost".
You can't really hate that ADM exists because that would essentially be saying you hate that the GT3 is such a desirable car or that you think it would be better if Porsche actually built way more GT3s than they could sell and then dealers would have to give a discount (or reverse ADM) in order to sell them or even a more extreme example where they built so many GT3s (like a billion of them) that they were actually worthless.
No one likes paying more money than they HAVE to. But no one HAS to pay more than they ultimately WANT to when it comes to a GT3.