Notices
991 GT3, GT3RS, GT2RS and 911R 2012-2019
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Because PDK: Some observations after a roll race

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 03-13-2018, 04:00 PM
  #76  
GrantG
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
GrantG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 17,770
Received 4,720 Likes on 2,691 Posts
Default

And here is the one I had made for Manual (note the Final Drive is slightly different than yours) - still a distinct advantage for PDK...:


Old 03-13-2018, 04:02 PM
  #77  
GrantG
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
GrantG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 17,770
Received 4,720 Likes on 2,691 Posts
Default

And I have some other data that suggests the Final Drive for the Manual is 3.89:1 which would narrow the gap considerably (to only 2%)...

I just don't remember where the numbers came from or which is most reliable...

Old 03-13-2018, 04:03 PM
  #78  
robmypro
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
robmypro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,220
Received 1,772 Likes on 1,020 Posts
Default

Good info Grant! So what do you think? Does that gearing advantage for the .1 PDK negate the power advantage of the .2 MT? There is one sure way to find out.
Old 03-13-2018, 04:05 PM
  #79  
Dewinator
Drifting
 
Dewinator's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 3,096
Received 44 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

I need to learn to just let it go, but you were baiting manual fans from the very beginning of your post when you titled it “because pdk”. I’m not sure why you’d do that and then get defensive when they take the bait.

If you’ve seen PDK be much faster from a roll that’s fine, but that hasn’t been the result generally experienced by professional reviewers that have done controlled tests betwee the two.
Old 03-13-2018, 04:06 PM
  #80  
GrantG
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
GrantG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 17,770
Received 4,720 Likes on 2,691 Posts
Default

Check my updated last post - Answer: I don't know what the correct number is or whether the gearing outweighs the power/torque or vice-versa ...
Old 03-13-2018, 04:07 PM
  #81  
robmypro
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
robmypro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,220
Received 1,772 Likes on 1,020 Posts
Default

Grant, from Road and Track...

With 4.0 liters at the ready, the GT3 pulls happily from low revs, but the real joy is in keeping it above 5500 rpm where important stuff happens. The manual does have tall gearing in its first two ratios (second is good for 81 mph), but the GT3 spends so little time in those gears that it's less of a criticism and more of a warning.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...3-first-drive/
Old 03-13-2018, 04:14 PM
  #82  
robmypro
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
robmypro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,220
Received 1,772 Likes on 1,020 Posts
Default

Grant, this link for the 911R shows the final drive ratio of 3.09. So I am thinking that this would be consistent with the data I posted.

https://www.carfolio.com/specificati...ar/?car=486948
Old 03-13-2018, 04:19 PM
  #83  
robmypro
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
robmypro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,220
Received 1,772 Likes on 1,020 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Dewinator
I need to learn to just let it go, but you were baiting manual fans from the very beginning of your post when you titled it “because pdk”. I’m not sure why you’d do that and then get defensive when they take the bait.

If you’ve seen PDK be much faster from a roll that’s fine, but that hasn’t been the result generally experienced by professional reviewers that have done controlled tests betwee the two.
I really wasn't trying to bait anyone, so sorry if it came off that way. Also not getting defensive. I am curious to know what caused the result I experienced. Just a quest for the truth! Trying to get the boys to agree to a meetup at the local drags to verify or refute the results I experienced. I am fine with wherever the facts lead us. If the .1 PDK is slower than the .2 MT, no biggie. But if it is not slower, figuring out "why" seems like a good exercise! Again, I didn't mean to bait anyone. I actually thought the attitude would be "yeah, makes sense."

All good buddy!
Old 03-13-2018, 04:34 PM
  #84  
GrantG
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
GrantG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 17,770
Received 4,720 Likes on 2,691 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by robmypro
Grant, this link for the 911R shows the final drive ratio of 3.09. So I am thinking that this would be consistent with the data I posted.

https://www.carfolio.com/specificati...ar/?car=486948

Ok, thanks
Old 03-13-2018, 04:34 PM
  #85  
mass27
Burning Brakes
 
mass27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,108
Received 255 Likes on 108 Posts
Default

So without reading the 82384098032948 posts, 99.999999820938409823094809283409823094% of which are OPINION, is the point of this 820384098230483204th thread that the PDK transmission is BETTER (using ALL definitions that everyone would like to subjectively assign to this word) than the manual transmission? I think PAG already determined this considering they are the designer and manufacturer.

PDK IS FASTER AND BETTER. Maybe you subjectively like the manual more than the PDK. That doesn't mean its faster or better.
Old 03-13-2018, 04:52 PM
  #86  
robmypro
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
robmypro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,220
Received 1,772 Likes on 1,020 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by mass27
So without reading the 82384098032948 posts, 99.999999820938409823094809283409823094% of which are OPINION, is the point of this 820384098230483204th thread that the PDK transmission is BETTER (using ALL definitions that everyone would like to subjectively assign to this word) than the manual transmission? I think PAG already determined this considering they are the designer and manufacturer.

PDK IS FASTER AND BETTER. Maybe you subjectively like the manual more than the PDK. That doesn't mean its faster or better.
I wouldn’t say the PDK is better. Better is a personal preference. I would honestly be happy with either one and i would drive the snot out of each. Nobody can really claim one is better than the other. Faster is a bit easier, as the data clearly favors the PDK. But does that extra speed really matter on the street, or track? Not really imo. Both are stupid fast and a guaranteed loss of license, if you aren’t disciplined, on the street. On the track driver skill trumps all. Just ask the guy in the Miata who was up my *** the last time i was at the track.
Old 03-13-2018, 05:16 PM
  #87  
drdonger
Three Wheelin'
 
drdonger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 1,751
Received 39 Likes on 27 Posts
Default


991.2 GT3 manual >>> everything else
Old 03-13-2018, 05:25 PM
  #88  
Dewinator
Drifting
 
Dewinator's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 3,096
Received 44 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

Many kudos to Porsche for offering both though to suit both tastes, if you like the manual you’re out of luck now with Ferrari, Lambo, R8s, most Astons and so many others.
Old 03-13-2018, 05:27 PM
  #89  
robmypro
Race Director
Thread Starter
 
robmypro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,220
Received 1,772 Likes on 1,020 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Dewinator
Many kudos to Porsche for offering both though to suit both tastes, if you like the manual you’re out of luck now with Ferrari, Lambo, R8s, most Astons and so many others.
Exactly. We are very fortunate that Porsche listens.
Old 03-13-2018, 05:41 PM
  #90  
GrantG
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
GrantG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 17,770
Received 4,720 Likes on 2,691 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by robmypro


Exactly. We are very fortunate that Porsche listens.
And it wouldn't be unusual for most companies that offer both gearboxes that one or both of them would be compromised in some way. But I consider PDK the best dual-clutch on the market and the 911R/GT3 Manual to be the best manual on sale as well...


Quick Reply: Because PDK: Some observations after a roll race



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 02:54 PM.