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Key secret why 991.2 GT3 RS will post some great lap times

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Key secret why 991.2 GT3 RS will post some great lap times

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Old 03-09-2018, 08:45 AM
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Kaizu
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Default Key secret why 991.2 GT3 RS will post some great lap times

The improved suspension and aero is a benefit, but here comes the key reason:

"For the first time, specially developed race track tyres are available for the new 911 GT3 RS separately. While these tyres are also road-legal, they place even more focus on maximum track performance."

Source: https://www.porsche.com/internationa...hassis/wheels/

Does this mean they are an option as they're not standard but "are available"? That would be doing it the same way as for example AMG GTR. That car comes with Michelin Cup2's, however, you can somehow opt for "track spec" Cup2's which is a more grippier tire for track use and is part of the reason why AMG GTR posted great lap times in 2017. This is not a rumour, for example Sport Auto magazine in Germany did some track tests with both set of Cup2s in the GTR, showing the special ones are quicker.

These "special" Cup2s of the AMG GTR have not been available from the car's option list, but can be somehow ordered separately from Mercedes. Maybe the reason for this silliness is the car has been approved for emissions and noise standards only with the ordinary Cup2s and no tiny deviation would be allowed due to VAG dieselgate etc. Looks like same with GT3 RS?

A bit same goes for Huracan Performante, in all the tests the car is equipped with Trofeo R's, however you cannot spec the Trofeo R's from the option list at all, even though Pirelli and Lambo itself has made press releases about the specially developed Trofeo R for the Performante: https://www.pirelli.com/global/en-ww...urgring-record

So, Sub 7 at the Ring with GT3 RS is quite certain with these special tires (also the new smoother track surface of 2018 will definitely help).

Btw. I loved for example the 996 GT3 RS, each of those cars were lightweight spec track beasts with pure RS heritage and no room for excess luxury. If you saw a GT3 RS back then at a track day you immediately knew those cars meant business with their perlon bucket seats, full cages and often with at least radio if not air/con deletes! Today I'm not entirely a fan that for the first time in the history of GT3 RS there can be a measurable performance difference depending on the spec. In my view, Porsche could leave the more luxury stuff for GT3 and Turbo models and keep RS as a hardcore brand, but sure if customers want more options it's better to provide them. Anyways, just consider the following difference, if a RS WP stripper model with the fast special tires is compared to a luxurious RS with:
- Slower tires
- no WP package +18kg
- no titanium roll cage, but normal one +12kg
- no Magnesium wheels +12kg
- no PCCB, but steel brakes +15kg
- No bucket seats, but comfort seats +30kg (btw for weight geeks, aren't the folding buckets lighter than full buckets due to no motor for height adjustment )
- no radio and nav delete, but bose system +20kg
- no air-con delete +15kg
- front-lift added +10kg
- led lights added +5kg
+ all random small adds, reversing camera, sport chrono, light package, garage opener etc. +5kg easily

These weights are estimates, but it's approx 140 kg of difference (310 lbs!) in the total sum. Quite the difference between two GT3 RSs that look quite the same.

P.S. Not anyway hating the 991.2 GT3 RS, but considering trying to get one...
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Old 03-09-2018, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaizu View Post
Porsche could leave the more luxury stuff for GT3 and Turbo models and keep RS as a hardcore brand, but sure if customers want more options it's better to provide them.
Good post. Especially the the part above.
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaizu View Post
The improved suspension and aero is a benefit, but here comes the key reason:

"For the first time, specially developed race track tyres are available for the new 911 GT3 RS separately. While these tyres are also road-legal, they place even more focus on maximum track performance."

Source: https://www.porsche.com/internationa...hassis/wheels/

Does this mean they are an option as they're not standard but "are available"? That would be doing it the same way as for example AMG GTR. That car comes with Michelin Cup2's, however, you can somehow opt for "track spec" Cup2's which is a more grippier tire for track use and is part of the reason why AMG GTR posted great lap times in 2017. This is not a rumour, for example Sport Auto magazine in Germany did some track tests with both set of Cup2s in the GTR, showing the special ones are quicker.

These "special" Cup2s of the AMG GTR have not been available from the car's option list, but can be somehow ordered separately from Mercedes. Maybe the reason for this silliness is the car has been approved for emissions and noise standards only with the ordinary Cup2s and no tiny deviation would be allowed due to VAG dieselgate etc. Looks like same with GT3 RS?

A bit same goes for Huracan Performante, in all the tests the car is equipped with Trofeo R's, however you cannot spec the Trofeo R's from the option list at all, even though Pirelli and Lambo itself has made press releases about the specially developed Trofeo R for the Performante: https://www.pirelli.com/global/en-ww...urgring-record

So, Sub 7 at the Ring with GT3 RS is quite certain with these special tires (also the new smoother track surface of 2018 will definitely help).

Btw. I loved for example the 996 GT3 RS, each of those cars were lightweight spec track beasts with pure RS heritage and no room for excess luxury. If you saw a GT3 RS back then at a track day you immediately knew those cars meant business with their perlon bucket seats, full cages and often with at least radio if not air/con deletes! Today I'm not entirely a fan that for the first time in the history of GT3 RS there can be a measurable performance difference depending on the spec. In my view, Porsche could leave the more luxury stuff for GT3 and Turbo models and keep RS as a hardcore brand, but sure if customers want more options it's better to provide them. Anyways, just consider the following difference, if a RS WP stripper model with the fast special tires is compared to a luxurious RS with:
- Slower tires
- no WP package +18kg
- no titanium roll cage, but normal one +12kg
- no Magnesium wheels +12kg
- no PCCB, but steel brakes +15kg
- No bucket seats, but comfort seats +30kg (btw for weight geeks, aren't the folding buckets lighter than full buckets due to no motor for height adjustment )
- no radio and nav delete, but bose system +20kg
- no air-con delete +15kg
- front-lift added +10kg
- led lights added +5kg
+ all random small adds, reversing camera, sport chrono, light package, garage opener etc. +5kg easily

These weights are estimates, but it's approx 140 kg of difference (310 lbs!) in the total sum. Quite the difference between two GT3 RSs that look quite the same.

P.S. Not anyway hating the 991.2 GT3 RS, but considering trying to get one...
39 lbs each for the gt2 seats. How much for the 918 style seats?

Porsche is doing it right tho, it caters for those who want the best an RS can be, the C&C type and those for whom the gt3 rs is the only or main toy. This RS performance will vary much more than any other but the thing is a full fat .2 rs with normal tires will still be quicker than a normal light spec .1 rs.

Those who will have the ***** to get the lightest/fastest spec will have a gem that others won't be able to experience. And the others will experience a great livable car that can be enjoyed in a much largest spectrum of opportunities that those who went for strippers won't understand. In the end Porsche does it right for everyone.

As someone said a couple of days ago, if the car was bought for the long run, most tech today will be defunt in a near future, so might as well just don't spec it, plus, this is my opinion that I hold certain as death, lightweight, no tech cars/lightweight specs in a near future will be worth a LOT more than those who are full fat.

Look at how the automotive world is heading and the main points and faults of the cars of the future. The opposites of both faults and features will make wath it's sought after.
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:19 AM
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Curious - previous GT3 RS owners manual specifically prohibited use of slicks which I took to mean if you use them Porsche may deny warranty claims. Does this mean that that prohibition no longer is in place for the .2 RS?
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by tstafford View Post
Curious - previous GT3 RS owners manual specifically prohibited use of slicks which I took to mean if you use them Porsche may deny warranty claims. Does this mean that that prohibition no longer is in place for the .2 RS?
I'm guessing: No, the tire mentioned by Kaizu is a street tire so it doesn't create the same G-forces a slick would.
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by tstafford View Post
Curious - previous GT3 RS owners manual specifically prohibited use of slicks which I took to mean if you use them Porsche may deny warranty claims. Does this mean that that prohibition no longer is in place for the .2 RS?
MPSC 2ís, Hoosier R7, Pirelli Trofeo Rís, Nittos NT01, Toyo R888, are not slicks...all are DOT approved

Pireeli DH, Michelin Blue, Contiís ,etc are true slicks
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Old 03-09-2018, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaizu View Post
aren't the folding buckets lighter than full buckets due to no motor for height adjustment
Exactly what I was thinking as I went through the builder... what's the weight of a 918 seat with that (rather useless) height adjuster?
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Old 03-09-2018, 11:04 AM
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The airbag modules are the heavy part that seats get now that we didn't pay for in the CGT style seat. 918 has airbags and a motor but are still slightly lighter than a 2 way/4way seat.

GT2 folding buckets are 4kg lighter if memory serves
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Old 03-09-2018, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by CRex View Post
Exactly what I was thinking as I went through the builder... what's the weight of a 918 seat with that (rather useless) height adjuster?
Height adjustment is hugely useful to increase helmet room beyond folding buckets...
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Old 03-09-2018, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by C.J. Ichiban View Post
The airbag modules are the heavy part that seats get now that we didn't pay for in the CGT style seat. 918 has airbags and a motor but are still slightly lighter than a 2 way/4way seat.

GT2 folding buckets are 4kg lighter if memory serves
how hard is it to put cgt seats on the 991 rails?
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Old 03-09-2018, 06:38 PM
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Does anyone know why there is no lightweight battery as it was option on 991.1RS ?
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Old 03-09-2018, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by EST
Does anyone know why there is no lightweight battery as it was option on 991.1RS ?
Supply and liability issues
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Old 03-09-2018, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by C.J. Ichiban View Post
Supply and liability issues
i expect there are lightweight batteries with similar specs for much less cost available aftermarket as Porsche canít be bothered to still provide them.
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Old 03-09-2018, 09:10 PM
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I wish someone will equip the .1 RS (already has light weight lithium battery and magnesium hood) with BBS magnesium wheels and new RS special Cup2's, Bilstein cup shocks and tune and do an honest comparison of Nurburing lap times with the .2 RS that is similarly equipped. The cost of upgrade on the .1 RS might be less than the cost of trading in the .1 RS and buying the .2 RS. Just a thought.
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Old 03-09-2018, 09:43 PM
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Correction: Carbon fiber hood and fenders, Magnesium top.
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