Key secret why 991.2 GT3 RS will post some great lap times
03-11-2018, 12:27 PM
#61
"The .2 GT3 is faster than the .1 GT3RS... the .2GT3RS is faster than the .2 GT3."
Highly highly doubt this. Im willing to bet my .1 RS on N2 is faster than a GT3 (and not far from a .2 RS on many tracks). And frankly I'd be willing to lay some money on the line to prove it.
Highly highly doubt this. Im willing to bet my .1 RS on N2 is faster than a GT3 (and not far from a .2 RS on many tracks). And frankly I'd be willing to lay some money on the line to prove it.
03-11-2018, 01:14 PM
#62
No, are you serious? You talk like that's springs and solid bushings is all they did. We will have the chance to see.
Edit. I might be overstating the gains, I will check spa times, laguna and algarve. Until results are out, I think this kind of talk is redundant.
I do believe gains in time will be bigger than anyone is imagining, might be totally wrong
Edit. I might be overstating the gains, I will check spa times, laguna and algarve. Until results are out, I think this kind of talk is redundant.
I do believe gains in time will be bigger than anyone is imagining, might be totally wrong
Just to add, I don't mean to knock the .2 rs at all and I'd have one in a flash if I were deemed worthy by an OPC to get an allocation (here in the uk the situation is laughable). It's clearly an improved and further optimised car over the .1 but the hype and all that surrounds every new car gets a bit ridiculous.
03-11-2018, 01:18 PM
#63
Nordschleife Master
Tires aside, the new stock GT3 engine puts down 400 whp at just 6600 rpm, whereas the old stock RS engine does it at 7200 rpm. Plus the new GT3 engine also puts 30 wtq more at 6000 rpm (also getting to peak torque 600 rpm sooner than the old RS engine). It doesn’t matter what Porsche claims on paper ( both supposedly 500 hp engines), which most may see as underwhelming. Delivery is more efficient in the new engine. That together with the suspension upgrades, gears, etc... All those incremental improvements make a significant difference - always have on every .2 version.
.1RS clearly capable of replicating the 7:12 at the Ring the .2GT3 hit. (The old 7:20 Ring time is not representative based on poor weather and yestersdays tires) .1RS has same hp, same springs and dampers as .2GT3. In fact .1RS has wider track and better aero. The new .2GT3RS with an additional 20 hp and stiffer spring rates (likely 15 at rear wheel) will be able to bite off another 10 seconds over a 7 mile run at the Ring especially with the better tires. No doubt. Time differences less on shorter tracks and cars are still close enough main difference will still be dependent on drivers especially where .1RS has updated rubber shoes.
The GT2RS nailed a 6:47 at the Ring with over 700 hp. My bet is the .2GT3RS comes in around 7:05 to 7:00. Manthey .1RS hit 7:09 without any headers.
Also can someone point me to where the .2GT3RS has rose jointed control arms????? Its not in the PAG materials nor did AP mention it which he would be crowing about if it had it. That's a GT2RS goodie not available on the 3RS.
Wagers on Ring times?
03-11-2018, 01:52 PM
#64
Rennlist Member
I’m now running 295-345 Hoosier R7 on 19”.
The car really needed more tire.
Now it’s a dream to drive, even with the softer oem springs.
A lot of the drivability come from the possibility to play with the rake more and also drop the car a tremendous amount.
The car really needed more tire.
Now it’s a dream to drive, even with the softer oem springs.
A lot of the drivability come from the possibility to play with the rake more and also drop the car a tremendous amount.
03-11-2018, 02:17 PM
#65
(The old 7:20 Ring time is not representative based on poor weather and yestersdays tires)
Also can someone point me to where the .2GT3RS has rose jointed control arms????? Its not in the PAG materials nor did AP mention it which he would be crowing about if it had it. That's a GT2RS goodie not available on the 3RS.
?
Also can someone point me to where the .2GT3RS has rose jointed control arms????? Its not in the PAG materials nor did AP mention it which he would be crowing about if it had it. That's a GT2RS goodie not available on the 3RS.
?
"" Like the 911 GT2 RS, rose joints are used throughout the front and rear suspension and the rear-wheel steering system has been extensively reprogrammed."""
the 991rs time was representative at 7:20 based on SportAuto times (7:28 rs vs 7:32 991.1gt3). With the same driver (von saurma) the .2gt3 was 7:24 recently iirc. There's absolutely nothing to suggest this damp track stuff that has been bandied about.
03-11-2018, 04:08 PM
#66
Nordschleife Master
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...t3-rs-revealed
"" Like the 911 GT2 RS, rose joints are used throughout the front and rear suspension and the rear-wheel steering system has been extensively reprogrammed."""
the 991rs time was representative at 7:20 based on SportAuto times (7:28 rs vs 7:32 991.1gt3). With the same driver (von saurma) the .2gt3 was 7:24 recently iirc. There's absolutely nothing to suggest this damp track stuff that has been bandied about.
If you think representative runs are on third time out and on a wet track then that's in your world not everyone elses.
https://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/...dk/first-drive
As to the rose jointed control arms, I am shocked AP wasn't crowing about this in the vid review with EVO. He was quick to point out the spring rate changes. I can't believe AP totally left this out of his review with EVO. Wow! I am not convinced yet. It would be great if .2RS did come with rose jointed arms but needs to be confirmed. Not buying the Autocar article info just yet. I am sure if the .2GT3RS had the upfitted rose joints AP would have been all over it in the interview.
.2GT3 clocked 7:12 with factory driver. The .1RS is clearly capable of the same or equivilent times based on specs and maybe a tad better based on track width and aero.
03-11-2018, 04:25 PM
#67
SportAuto runs were on a fully dry track and the .1 gt3/rs were broadly in line with Porsche declared factory times so no reason to think 7:20 was not representative. Note Top gear says "apparently" as well. Continue believing whatever you wish though.
03-11-2018, 04:27 PM
#68
Pro
"The .2 GT3 is faster than the .1 GT3RS... the .2GT3RS is faster than the .2 GT3."
Highly highly doubt this. Im willing to bet my .1 RS on N2 is faster than a GT3 (and not far from a .2 RS on many tracks). And frankly I'd be willing to lay some money on the line to prove it.
Highly highly doubt this. Im willing to bet my .1 RS on N2 is faster than a GT3 (and not far from a .2 RS on many tracks). And frankly I'd be willing to lay some money on the line to prove it.
.2 GT3 has so much more torque down low... and incremental overall improvements...
.1 RS guys can keep singing the 'tires blues'... but the fact is the .1 RS has 'bigger' tires than the .2 GT3... so if it's going to be apples to apples, pick your poison.
Porsche has plenty of access to the RING... if they thought the .1 car's time wasn't reflective of what it could do... they'd have come back.
I will be interested to see the .2 GT3 at Laguna Seca with Randy driving it... and compared to what he last did with the .1 RS... that should be fairly equal.
Irregardless, they are both great cars... evolution will continue on... just as the 992 will be quicker than the 991.2... You can always mod the car to go quicker... but that's not what we're comparing.
Best Regards,
Dave
03-11-2018, 04:32 PM
#70
I'll take that bet... I'm in the SW and happy to meet up to run a .1 RS on similar tires.
.2 GT3 has so much more torque down low... and incremental overall improvements...
.1 RS guys can keep singing the 'tires blues'... but the fact is the .1 RS has 'bigger' tires than the .2 GT3... so if it's going to be apples to apples, pick your poison.
Porsche has plenty of access to the RING... if they thought the .1 car's time wasn't reflective of what it could do... they'd have come back.
I will be interested to see the .2 GT3 at Laguna Seca with Randy driving it... and compared to what he last did with the .1 RS... that should be fairly equal.
Irregardless, they are both great cars... evolution will continue on... just as the 992 will be quicker than the 991.2... You can always mod the car to go quicker... but that's not what we're comparing.
Best Regards,
Dave
.2 GT3 has so much more torque down low... and incremental overall improvements...
.1 RS guys can keep singing the 'tires blues'... but the fact is the .1 RS has 'bigger' tires than the .2 GT3... so if it's going to be apples to apples, pick your poison.
Porsche has plenty of access to the RING... if they thought the .1 car's time wasn't reflective of what it could do... they'd have come back.
I will be interested to see the .2 GT3 at Laguna Seca with Randy driving it... and compared to what he last did with the .1 RS... that should be fairly equal.
Irregardless, they are both great cars... evolution will continue on... just as the 992 will be quicker than the 991.2... You can always mod the car to go quicker... but that's not what we're comparing.
Best Regards,
Dave
😉
03-11-2018, 04:38 PM
#71
Pro
Closest I may get (at least in my car) would probably be COTA. Would love to make the haul to Sebring some day for sure!
03-11-2018, 05:47 PM
#72
As to the rose jointed control arms, I am shocked AP wasn't crowing about this in the vid review with EVO. He was quick to point out the spring rate changes. I can't believe AP totally left this out of his review with EVO. Wow! I am not convinced yet. It would be great if .2RS did come with rose jointed arms but needs to be confirmed. Not buying the Autocar article info just yet. I am sure if the .2GT3RS had the upfitted rose joints AP would have been all over it in the interview.
It's in the press materials. It's also on the Porsche.com website under technical data:
Front axle Lightweight spring strut axle (McPherson type), all suspension mountings ball-jointed
Rear axle Lightweight multi-link suspension with wheels independently suspended on five links, all suspension mountings ball-jointed
They completely reworked the GT2's suspension to help it put down 550 lbs ft and 700 hp through the rear wheels. Ball joints all around, different spring and damper philosophy, etc. They then evolved the GT3's suspension from that using many of those parts including the rose-jointed mountings. This has been mentioned quite a lot around here?
03-11-2018, 05:47 PM
#73
i think you are hugely underestimating just how much of an improvement 3 seconds over a 90 second lap is, especially if achieved outside tyres and purely on chassis changes. For example, I would personally be very surprised if the 4.0rs was 3 seconds a lap faster than the 997.1rs on a 90s track once you put the 2 cars on the same spec of tyre and the changes to the 4.0 vs the 7.1 I would suggest are considerably greater than in the 991s.
Just to add, I don't mean to knock the .2 rs at all and I'd have one in a flash if I were deemed worthy by an OPC to get an allocation (here in the uk the situation is laughable). It's clearly an improved and further optimised car over the .1 but the hype and all that surrounds every new car gets a bit ridiculous.
The RS is a gt3, plus a lot more.
03-11-2018, 06:52 PM
#75
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